I decided i'm giving music up...

[[F_or_DEAF]]

" As in any business, before you get in over your head, it is important to understand what type of players you'll be dealing with. Those who invest in the music business are an unusual breed of gambler. A lawyer friend once explained it to me this way: " The entertainment industry is like a big casino. Motion pictures are the backroom baccarat tables for the millionaires with the $10,000 gold chips. Television is the $100 table for the yuppies, theater the $25 table, and the record biz is the $2 table, essentially for the bargain shopper......."

post of the month until further notice...

 

[jay_jizle]

Good luck to you Troup.

Some good advice from a few people in this thread, after sifting through pages upon pages of bickering.

I can understand your frustration, but I sincerely doubt you will be 'giving up music' with the amount of knowledge and passion you have for it.

Take a breather, whether that be a few weeks or a few years, and re-evaluate.

I understand you have tried different avenues to achieve your terms of success, but I personally find it silly to make your final attempt hinge on the success or failure of a website. Websites are a dime a dozen these days and I would think it would be more difficult to make a website stand out than to take some of these 'crap deals' to make some new connects. Though you may think that they conflict with your goals now, you never know who you can hook up with as a result.

I will check out your site when it drops, but I am curious as to why you named it 'industrysound.com' when it seems you are trying so hard to differentiate yourself from the current industry?

And for the people that say his music isn't good enough to make it...have you turned on the radio or tv recently? There is some absolute trash out there that people are eating up.

Sounds like you need a gimmick, Troup.

 

[vizionheiry]

It's nothing wrong with having a business plan and model to sell music (or any other commodity, yes art is a commodity).

I think it was biggrome (whose posts I love) who stated placements build up a resume. This is true.

But entrepreneurs don't need resumes. They create opportunities and solve problems.

Not every musician is an entrepreneur. Not every entrepreneur is a musician. It's difficult being excellent in both, but not impossible.


For those of you who want to monetize your product (beats, songs) I suggest you create a business plan. (Start out with something basic like the SBA business plan template).

It would be useful for to identify your target audience, your market segment.

You can get hip to this or you can be an employee of a company who you will end up paying to create a business plan for you. It happens to musicians every single day.

We all know of underground emcees who have all the talent and skill but don't sell because they haven't identified their target market.

It seems that Troup is the same way. He's beyond making beats for fun and has identified the economics of one unit, the market value and market segment.

Would you accuse Jobs and Wazniak for being egotistical when they suggested some day most people who earn $35k or more between the ages of 13-24 will want to walk around listening to music all day (Ipod). You would say -that's smart.

Looking beyond the tone of his writing, which many here find offensive, you have to commend him for sharing his business model. You will be able to witness if it fails or succeeds and identify the strengths and weaknesses from an insider's view.

It's strange that this is predominately a hiphop forum, yet so many condemn economic self-sufficency.

You can be an independent musician with your own revenue streams or sell Dr. Pepper, headphones, alcohol, McDonalds, beer, etc.

 

[JeanLukPigheart]

Would you accuse Jobs and Wazniak for being egotistical when they suggested some day most people who earn $35k or more between the ages of 13-24 will want to walk around listening to music all day (Ipod). You would say -that's smart.

30 years ago? yes.

 

[j.troup]

It's nothing wrong with having a business plan and model to sell music (or any other commodity, yes art is a commodity).

I think it was biggrome (whose posts I love) who stated placements build up a resume. This is true.

But entrepreneurs don't need resumes. They create opportunities and solve problems.

Not every musician is an entrepreneur. Not every entrepreneur is a musician. It's difficult being excellent in both, but not impossible.


For those of you who want to monetize your product (beats, songs) I suggest you create a business plan. (Start out with something basic like the SBA business plan template).

It would be useful for to identify your target audience, your market segment.

You can get hip to this or you can be an employee of a company who you will end up paying to create a business plan for you. It happens to musicians every single day.

We all know of underground emcees who have all the talent and skill but don't sell because they haven't identified their target market.

It seems that Troup is the same way. He's beyond making beats for fun and has identified the economics of one unit, the market value and market segment.

Would you accuse Jobs and Wazniak for being egotistical when they suggested some day most people who earn $35k or more between the ages of 13-24 will want to walk around listening to music all day (Ipod). You would say -that's smart.

Looking beyond the tone of his writing, which many here find offensive, you have to commend him for sharing his business model. You will be able to witness if it fails or succeeds and identify the strengths and weaknesses from an insider's view.

It's strange that this is predominately a hiphop forum, yet so many condemn economic self-sufficency.

You can be an independent musician with your own revenue streams or sell Dr. Pepper, headphones, alcohol, McDonalds, beer, etc.

And that is exactly what I'm talking about...the Business of Music.






Someone said I was bitter...no I'm not bitter at all. I'm thankful for ALL of my experiences along the way...good and bad...they all brought me to this point right here.


But for those of you making BEATS...what's YOUR PLAN? Not something that you "heard" works. What is YOUR PERSONAL PLAN FOR MAKING A CAREER OF THIS?

You gonna just make beats and send out demo's for 20 years? You gonna continue to "collab" with people and "hope" that someone makes it big, for 20 years?


Every single day, there are 10's of thousands of people who jump in your lane, and start doing the exact same thing that you do.



So what is YOUR PLAN to differentiate yourself? What is YOUR PLAN to monetize you craft?


...and don't give me that BS about "find and artist, make them hot, and sell a million records". Because music in 2009 is all but free...INCLUDING YOURS. And will become FREE-ER in the years ahead.




Making beats and HOPING doesn't MAKE THINGS HAPPEN.



SO HOW WILL YOU MAKE THINGS HAPPEN?

 

[LuckySe7en]

I just checked out your site. You have mad skills homie. Easily some of best tracks i've heard. It would be a shame to lose a talent like yours. Good luck.

 

[iambase]

starting by differentiating musically would already be a good thing... you are not differentiating musically but rather diversifying which can be equally good...or not !
by diversifying you are kinda trying to minimize the risk of failure but you might succeed as a business man and not necessarily as a musician... most people on this website are willing to succeed as musicians...

You are basically telling them that music is dying and that now, they have to sell other things than music...

I think you are right and wrong... they have to sell other things ON TOP of their music... But the core business should still be making tracks for them if that's what they want to...

that's why you should get these placements so that it helps you providing other services at the same time : kind of a lock-in strategy...

But your point is valid though if music is actually dying... Myself, i would rather try thinking of a way to lock-in people into buying music along with a service (instead of a service along with music) .. It's way too easy to just download, and people have other things to buy than intangible stuff these times..

Anyway, I need to find an internship first and I wish it could be at some Major in order to see what's really happening inside but it has few chances to happen... I'm still looking though... But I will repeat again...get inside to be able to get outside... ^^

 

[j.troup]

We don't have to GET INSIDE to see what's happening. They are showing us EVERY SINGLE DAY what is happening!


You don't have to work for a record label to know what DOESN'T WORK. We've seen their model since the beginning of recorded music. IT DOESN'T WORK ANYMORE. The internet destroyed that model.

Movies are next. Just like record stores are becoming a thing of the past, in the next 10 years, movie theaters will become niche businesses...all but GONE.



I should probably stop talking now.

 

[iambase]

if you see a car broken... do you know if the brakes are broken, or the motor or anything ... ?
you just know it is broken...
same logic...

you will need the industry to break itself... you cant break it on your own...

Anyway, I think I will be done talking too.. I've been hammering my point of view way too much... I still wish you good luck... And hope you will find the light

 

[j.troup]

if you see a car broken... do you know if the brakes are broken, or the motor or anything ... ?
you just know it is broken...
same logic...

you will need the industry to break itself... you cant break it on your own...

Anyway, I think I will be done talking too.. I've been hammering my point of view way too much... I still wish you good luck... And hope you will find the light

Given the symptoms, you can determine what's wrong.



If i push the brakes and it doesn't stop, then it's the brakes


If i turn the key and nothing lights up, it's the battery.



I don't need to take the car apart to figure that out.




The recording industry shows us it's broken every single day. The problem? They can't sell records. The reason? THE INTERNET.


You can't take away the internet like you can just replace the battery in a car...



Most people just put a band-aid on the battery, and hope it holds...



Me? I buy a new car that doesn't depend on a battery.

 

[SannyBoi]

there somany ways to make $ off music without even making music...

if i was u troop i'd **** that whole beat making thing and start to work as an label executive...**** it start as an intern!

wont take long till yo boss will relize that u kno what ure talkin bout and they will hire u!

good things come slow they say...but will last even longer thou'
**** will maybe take you 4 - 5 more years to get established into the industry but who cares?

better then drivin trucks or repairing AC's for 4 mo decades right?

give it a shot! if u really got all them connects u'll find a music related job in no time!

 

[SannyBoi]

**** a beat niccah!

 

[LuckySe7en]

naw I feel you man. The internet bruised up unit sales across the board. I mean why spend 15-20 bucks on a CD when you can just download it for free? And I can't even count how many bootleg movies I've seen. Why should I go pay $8.75 to go see the same movie?
People are all about convenience. Whats more convenient? Carrying around your cd collection or carrying an IPOD that can hold you're entire cd collection?

 

[j.troup]

there somany ways to make $ off music without even making music...

if i was u troop i'd **** that whole beat making thing and start to work as an label executive...**** it start as an intern!

wont take long till yo boss will relize that u kno what ure talkin bout and they will hire u!

good things come slow they say...but will last even longer thou'
**** will maybe take you 4 - 5 more years to get established into the industry but who cares?

better then drivin trucks or repairing AC's for 4 mo decades right?

give it a shot! if u really got all them connects u'll find a music related job in no time!

I'm not interested in being captain of a ship that's sinking.


Nor am I trying to get "established" in an industry that won't be there in the near future.



That's like trying to take over the CD Duplication industry...when we all know that CD's are on their way out.

 

[SannyBoi]

I'm not interested in being captain of a ship that's sinking.


Nor am I trying to get "established" in an industry that won't be there in the near future.



That's like trying to take over the CD Duplication industry...when we all know that CD's are on their way out

ye but it will take some time until that giant called music industry will go down! and its right now for all of us the last chance to get really into the game and establish relationships with the future CEO's and COO's of those companies that will be born in near future.

eventhough the majors are dying things like business tactics, contract and right management, all the stuff like that will remain forever. maybe slighlty renewed but the core basics will b just like they are and were lets say 20 Years ago.

and imo the majors are the best school for the music business period...

i mean look imagine iTunes would start a label or something right?

who do you think they would hire?

a producer who had his ups and lows in the game but was never really confronted with paperwork and all that bull?

or lets say an former assistant A&R who worked at the one time biggest record company in the world...

u only will go down with the ship if u dont know when it's your time to jump off it and start to swim...

(at the least thats the way i plan 2 do it)

hell yeah the industry will shrink dramatically...so?
just cus they dont know how to handle the situation it dont mean that u cant handle the situation!

u can get just in tha tposition to be the future of the industry with an innovative business plan and the right connect to investors!

and the best place to get that connect and the idea for a innovative businessplan is a major label office if u ask me...

 

[Jim Bond]

With all the money talk in this thread I thought i'd mention something that yall may not have thought over. If you are in the music industry to make a lot of money, you are definitely in the wrong industry. By statistics it is the most overcrowded, lowest return for time put in. You have to be in the top ranks to make any real money.

It's easier to get into the NBA than to get established in the music industry.

Me? I buy a new car that doesn't depend on a battery.

There are cars that don't need a battery to start?

 

[Noyzi]

The way it seems to me is that, The music it'self has no protection on it to keep it unstealable so the value of it continues to drop. Napster, ********, Bearshare, etc. makes itunes a honest consumers spot only. Once you get a buzz and your musics around you'll never get a grasp on the leakage from P2P sharing. Eitherway, if your situation is correct and you recieve a sizable portion of the monies generated from your music you can still get a good return on your investment. That's the part that's killing the present day recording industry model. Not enuff to go around when the labels won't give to get. There greedy to the point of starvation and stubborn to the point of solitude. Myspace records is 2 yrs too late since attention is being drawn to too many other talk spots but the model is actually a very good one(Which I see a little of in Troups idea). Indie Labels are getting artist heavy and is about to flood the market while the big boys are regrouping and holding think tanks for the summer.
I couldn't imagine the world without record stores but it's coming close... So, I say all that to say this...
If your seeing a void and your talented enuff to fill it don't wait to see what's gonna happen next cause YOU could be "What happened next". Your talent Troup and education isn't gonna save you from a possible loss but your fear of failure will. Nobody knows what to make of your plan which is why the mystike of all this is causing dissection sessions like this one. Your brains being picked by the unimaginitive and scary. Some guys are just curious, others are haters but none of us have seen a model quit like this before. A spot where you can be the engineer, producer, arranger, artist, with good material at a low price? The question is why wouldnt it work? It's too easy... Your walking people thru the maze and it's kinda odd for someone to do that. The possibilty of success is in the hands of the people how take advantage but if it isn't going to get you in the record industy it's gonna get your work on alot of mixtapes and possibly radio indirectly. I'm sure the people who have the power to make you a highly paid producer will learn of this venture and they will with no doubt in my mind keep tabs on your progress and when you talk they will listen. 3yrs from now when you take that $200,000 a year job as a label brain you'll remember it all started from a angle noone thought of. That's what I can see coming from this. Not major placements, not record sales but industy strategy and marketing ventures pass the common..."Remix contest" on all these sites looking for hot producers indirectly. Make a new road and there forced to follow...

All in All: JTroup is a brand and this is his product. It won't make the most sense to us at first but the product isn't gonna be as interesting as what the right people will do with it once it becomes known around the industry. There's no example to date to say this is a fail or a pass, that's what makes this something i can't wait to participate in. 23 pages of why and why nots is silly at best. I must say though, this is a testament of how strong his dedication to his dream and perspective is. FP had his time for two days off one comment. Dudes a beast... Learn from that...

 

[**1005**]

we're 24 pages deep and i STILL haven't seen what troup is asking for that timbo-all-in-one keyboard boxy thingy. my offer 100 US dollars (can't find the dolla sign on my new macbook, lol).

 

[ptonemusic]

I'm not interested in being captain of a ship that's sinking.


Nor am I trying to get "established" in an industry that won't be there in the near future.



That's like trying to take over the CD Duplication industry...when we all know that CD's are on their way out.

But you'd rather take people's money and sell them a dream.

If you really believed the industry was failing you wouldn't be setting up a website that depends on the industry surviving.


Aren't you basically just selling guide on how to break into the CD Duplication industry? How well would that guide do if the CD Duplication industry disappeared?


There's some real holes in your logic. You say the industry is going to disappear, how will your site survive if it does?

 

[THEVIRUSPRODUCTIONS]

Are you selling the equipment f***? Lol