DJ Mustard & The Return of the Hip Hop Super Producer

100% FACT...Timbaland does not make a quarter million per beat. He may have made that once...maybe even 2 to 4 times...seriously doubt that many. But that is not what he "makes", period. It was a line in a song and a shot at Scott Storch who at the time was nowhere near "a couple grand" a track as a "piano man". They were selling tracks in the same ballpark at the time.

We can't differentiate between the 2 parties using falsified documents. No reason to when discussing a guy with decades of hits in comparison to a guy who had a good couple months, disappeared, and came back to have another run of a few good months thus far. Maybe if he's still on top 2 years from now we can get into all that.
 
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deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup said:
100% FACT...Timbaland does not make a quarter million per beat. He may have made that once...maybe even 2 to 4 times...seriously doubt that many. But that is not what he "makes", period. It was a line in a song and a shot at Scott Storch who at the time was nowhere near "a couple grand" a track as a "piano man". They were selling tracks in the same ballpark at the time.

We can't differentiate between the 2 parties using falsified documents. No reason to when discussing a guy with decades of hits in comparison to a guy who had a good couple months, disappeared, and came back to have another run of a few good months thus far. Maybe if he's still on top 2 years from now we can get into all that.
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100% Fact - If a man says that's what he charges for a beat and then has Jigga Man cosign, then that's all that you and I can go on as fact - we can't say, "maybe 2 to 4 times" because we don't know that.

Now, for the people saying Mustard has had a string of hits I'm only seeing his highest charting US Billboard Hot 100 single being Rack City which peaked at #7...back in 2011. His highest charting songs in 2014 are #22, #40, #48 and #54...this is why I don't understand why we're even bringing this cat up in this type of discussion.

My bad if I ruffled some cats feathers - it seems some people feel some type of way about Mustard and will defend the dudes honor no matter what like that's their mentor and hero. I personally don't get it and to each their own.
 
^^^What's to get he's the hot cat right now in terms of pop appeal rap - r&b, just like mike will a couple years back.
I don't think anyone is saying he's the best ever, but u got 2 respect his hustle and achievements at this pt.
 
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What artist in 2014, outside of Jay-Z doing a Samsung deal, has a budget to support $250,000 on producing the entire album let a lone one song?That's one reason that you don't hear Timbaland that often, and not usually with new artists unless their his artists. Why do you think he only reallyappears for Beyonce, Jay, & JR?Who else is selling enough units to mathematically justify paying that much money on one song, to a producer who's just now making "hit" songs again?I give Mustard his props, as a super producer in 2014, what it means in this era. The industry climate isn't the same as it was when Tim did Are You ThatSomebody so you can't really judge the business the same. This is Mustard's year, he has his DJ sets, Roc Nation deal as an artist, Timbo himself was onhis mixtape co-signging, their both signed to Roc Nation, he broke YG like I said, he gives brand new artists hits, Iggy Azalea is #1 with an imitation of his sound, ...not that you should judge "hip-hop" by the pop charts
 
AveMcree said:
how is that hard to understand when its clear that Mustard has far more hit records alchemist and a bigger following.... just admit that you don't like mustard's style of music and keep it moving...
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i hate when people use that "logic", i don't hate his style but don't consider him a super producer and alc has longevity that mustard doesn't. if he's big next year around this time then maybe but otherwise i say nah.
 
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wildinout8 said:
100% Fact - If a man says that's what he charges for a beat and then has Jigga Man cosign, then that's all that you and I can go on as fact - we can't say, "maybe 2 to 4 times" because we don't know that.
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Don't confuse "we" with "you", we're not the same person, you have no clue what "I" know. I can assume since your research is done via google and youtube, "you" can't say "maybe 2-4 times", "I" can.

His earnings and budgets for albums he's been part of would say otherwise. He peaked AFTER Timberlake's sophomore project, that's when he would've been able to ask for the amount being discussed. 100% sure Diddy didn't pay that for contributions to "Press Play", He didn't get it from Nelly Furtado, here budget would've been in the millions just for production. He wasn't paying it to himself for his albums...Omarion for Icebox? Kanye for fixing his drums? Rick Ross for posting up in a vid? C'mon, man. Jay wouldn't have made a dime off holy grail with that type overhead. It's money for a service, always negotiable.

It's like an artist saying they get $250k a show because they got it that one time they headlined a sold out arena arena...4 years later when no one checks them because they "charge too much" and no one has worked with them since they sold out that arena.

Now...to quote myself....."We can't differentiate between the 2 parties using falsified documents. No reason to when discussing a guy with decades of hits in comparison to a guy who had a good couple months, disappeared, and came back to have another run of a few good months thus far. Maybe if he's still on top 2 years from now we can get into all that."

Comparing Mustard to Timbo is just as ridiculous as thinking Timbo makes $250k a beat. Has made, sure. Has made alot of times....nah. In his defense, if he's counting royalties as part of that number, fair enough.
 
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deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup said:
Don't confuse "we" with "you", we're not the same person, you have no clue what "I" know. I can assume since your research is done via google and youtube, "you" can't say "maybe 2-4 times", "I" can.

His earnings and budgets for albums he's been part of would say otherwise. He peaked AFTER Timberlake's sophomore project, that's when he would've been able to ask for the amount being discussed. 100% sure Diddy didn't pay that for contributions to "Press Play", He didn't get it from Nelly Furtado, here budget would've been in the millions just for production. He wasn't paying it to himself for his albums...Omarion for Icebox? Kanye for fixing his drums? Rick Ross for posting up in a vid? C'mon, man. Jay wouldn't have made a dime off holy grail with that type overhead. It's money for a service, always negotiable.

It's like an artist saying they get $250k a show because they got it that one time they headlined a sold out arena arena...4 years later when no one checks them because they "charge too much" and no one has worked with them since they sold out that arena.

Now...to quote myself....."We can't differentiate between the 2 parties using falsified documents. No reason to when discussing a guy with decades of hits in comparison to a guy who had a good couple months, disappeared, and came back to have another run of a few good months thus far. Maybe if he's still on top 2 years from now we can get into all that."

Comparing Mustard to Timbo is just as ridiculous as thinking Timbo makes $250k a beat. Has made, sure. Has made alot of times....nah. In his defense, if he's counting royalties as part of that number, fair enough.
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Again, "we" can go back and forth on how much Timbo makes and blah blah blah blah - it aint my money and I honestly couldn't care less. You've taken one statement, which neither one of "us" can neither confirm nor deny and run completely down a hall by yourself with.

Now, back to the original point I made - where are these strings of hits people keep referring to from Mustard that even put him in the conversation of being a "Super Producer" and the only thing that makes you think you can compare him to Pharell/Timbo/DarkChild/Kanye is todays radio? If that's the case RZA is a genius because he composes film scores in todays films and is comparable to Mozart and Handl.

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There is a HUGE difference between being a Hot Producer and a Super Producer imo. I'm down for great debates because we are all passionate, intelligent people (and emotional, being musicians) but, beyond the fact we've both given Mustard his credit as being successful in today's market are you, deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup, really telling me he's even on the same field musically and talent-wise as the aforementioned producers?
 
Again, "you" are going back and forth with yourself or have an inability to read. I've said nothing to indicate Mustard is comparable to Timbo. In fact I quoted myself saying the total opposite. All i've said is "you" assume others have no clue of what they're talking when they correct nonsense that has nothing to do with the discussion because it holds no weight in the discussion. Producers like Dre and Max Martin(who surpass Timbo on charts, financially, socially, ect.)aren't charging $250k a beat OFTEN. Never have, and especially not these days.

You're so wrapped up in being right you can't figure out I haven't said you were wrong. I just said "don't believe the hoopla surrounding empty boasts made in rap lyrics". You want to convince us "no one knows better" when if you understand album budgets and how money is distributed to artists, it's not hard to figure out what one is able to demand. It's not even like 250 a track was once upon a time that far off, lol. But when you say "Timbo charges $250k a beat what does mustard make?" a correction needs to be made, because in the era when Timbo could ask for that without being laughed out of a boardroom, if Mustard existed with the same track record, he'd have things in motion right now to charge 60-100 easily. When people would pay that type money, they'd put more behind your song making it a bigger hit, making you bigger, and giving you the ability to ask for more for your next record, so with the momentum Mustard currently has, if he stayed consistant, it wouldn't be long before he was in Timbo's charging bracket. EXACTLY WHAT STORCH WAS ABLE TO DO IN A SHORT TIME.

All hypothetical being that we're not in an era where "super producers" are around every corner as stated earlier in the thread. 100% fact, last I knew of Storch selling a beat, it was to a female rapper I know who funds herself for $6 grand. He wouldn't have took the time for such a small payoff in his hay day. Don't let the bragging fool ya. If they were worth it, they'd still get it and hits would still be being made that made the payout worth it, being that's no such case...c'mon we have enough common sense to figure this out.

So, to quote myself yet again...

"We can't differentiate between the 2 parties using falsified documents. No reason to when discussing a guy with decades of hits(TIMBO) in comparison to a guy who had a good couple months, disappeared, and came back to have another run of a few good months thus far(MUSTARD). Maybe if he's still on top 2 years from now we can get into all that."
 
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wildinout8 said:
Timbaland charges $250,000+ per beat...Mustard doesn't and never will be....there's a reason why.
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That's the only thing you've said I challenged. Now you've gone on to say "we don't know" when all I've said is not only myself, but plenty of others see the nonsense in that.

Ciara made $2M to perform in Australia a few years back at New Years. That's like someone saying "Ciara is bigger than *insert current artist* because she charges $2M a show and they never will." That irrelevant to the discussion when we're in a different era of music and budgets are indeed different. That's still the live performance aspect though where money is paid by parties without consideration of recouping through album sales so even that's more realistic than Timbo making a quarter mil.
 
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deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup said:
That's the only thing you've said I challenged. Now you've gone on to say "we don't know" when all I've said is not only myself, but plenty of others see the nonsense in that.

Ciara made $2M to perform in Australia a few years back at New Years. That's like someone saying "Ciara is bigger than *insert current artist* because she charges $2M a show and they never will." That irrelevant to the discussion when we're in a different era of music and budgets are indeed different. That's still the live performance aspect though where money is paid by parties without consideration of recouping through album sales so even that's more realistic than Timbo making a quarter mil.
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Fair enough and great talk...now, are you done with this analyzing Timb's bank account discussion yet? I believe the original poster was discussing whether Mustard is considered a Super Producer or not...
 
wildinout8 said:
You kids nowadays hear a few garbage tracks on the radio geared towards uneducated and ignorant music fans aged 12-25 and think the "producers" are really doing something. I can guarantee you Alchemist makes more money doing one tour DJ'ing for Eminem than all of these "hits" Mustard has.

Point blank simple you MTV cats who think Mustard is a SuperProducer because the wack radio is FORCED to play his songs because his labels PAY TO HAVE HIM PLAYED show you know nothing of the music industry.

Timbaland charges $250,000+ per beat...Mustard doesn't and never will be....there's a reason why.
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You refer to us as kids in the 12-25 bracket, yet you can't grasp the concept that no one these days has a budget to pay a quarter million dollars for one song. You're either a grown man with no true concept of money or you're a teen yourself trying to sound wise and to those in your same age bracket as well as some who are older and more knowledgeable. Just think outside the box as a responsible adult, forget even approaching it like a seasoned veteran. If you were financing a music project, could you sign off on one song for 250K in this era of digital downloads and think you can honestly recoup that. Remember now they sell singles for 99 cents. You'd need 250 thousand plus downloads just to break even. At least back in the day they were selling albums for 14, 15 dollars a piece.It's really that simple. I dont claim to have any industry experience. I'm just using my common sense as an aspiring entrepreneur.
 
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I just don't think Mustard is there yet, but I still think that he can be if he continues like he does.

Mike Will though, he is closer to being a Super-producer in my eyes
 
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-Since were talkin about simple beats....
Aint wanna use somthin real complex.... u kno how he can get...
These are both Alchemist produced albums....
Actually there Alchemist X (feat) albums.....
Almost as if hes a "cough" artist himself...
huh ....look at that
 
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DJ Mustard is dope. I'm feeling that new T.I. joint ft Iggy Azalea. I believe it's called "No Mediocre".
 
2 Chainz is the hottest rapper in the game right now. Therefore, he's in the same discussion as 2Pac and Biggie. Anyone that disagrees is a know-it-all and thinks they're better than everyone (*sarcasm*)
 
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