Why aren't you making your beats like this??

[j.troup]

Why are rap songs just 4 bar (or in some pathetic cases, 2 bar) loops, that just repeat over and over?


When was the last time you heard a rap song with a real pre-hook and bridge, with the accompanying chord progression changes?


I'm just sitting here making this beat for a raper, and it occurred to me to change the chord progression for a 4 bar pre-hook, and put an 8 bar bridge in, just like the songs that singers sing over.



Why isn't this done in rap?

 

[zoo]

Clams Casino does this quite a bit as far as I can tell!? But yeah I agree it should happen more.

 

[j.troup]

I listen to a song like Eminem's Space Bound, and the progression change on the pre-hook adds so much to the emotion of the song...and the melody change on the bridge.


If you listen to any singer's song...with the exception of Urban Music, there's always progression changes...hell, or at least MELODY changes (in the rare case that Katy Perry sings over a 4 bar loop).


I guess it's probably because in rap, there isn't too much EMOTION in the music.






Hell, you would think for as big of an Emo as Drake is, 40 would lace him with some chords that move!

 

[mark1234]

i guess its cause rap used to be done with samples mostly back in the day.
And with samples you can't get as versatile as somebody who can play keys most of the times.
they didn't use software much back than.
The gear was harder to use to make change-ups.
so Hip-Hop got a certain sound which stucked over the years.

 

[Just Clauz]

Damn Eminem's flow is weaker than Slim Shady.

But back on topic, I dont know, rap is really about the flow and lyrics, so I gues melodies are second priority.

But I think you're right, I often thought about making bridge, and even changing the chords in chorus, just havent experimented much with it.

 

[ERRL]

You make beats for rapers?

 

[Beat Off]

I've said this before on here, but the reason depends on who you are working for. If you have your own artists etc you can do what you want. But anything that plans on getting club and or radio spins they won't take it. Being original means nothing. They will come back asking you to do something like so in so. Right now the hot guy is Dj Mustard. "Yo this beat is hot but I'm looking for a club banger like a Dj Mustard or Mike Will type sound". It never fails. These sheep ass managers & artists go with whose hot at the moment and want duplication. **** them all.

 

[Wacco Stern]

You make beats for rapers?

Almost asked the same question lol.

 

[Desire Inspires]

​Chord changes and bridges are not a part of true hip-hop. Sorry.

 

[SFTRAXX]

​Chord changes and bridges are not a part of true hip-hop. Sorry.

I agree. They can be a part [and are sometimes used] but they aren't common in the genre.

To answer JTroups original question: I don't make em like that because [i feel] 4 bar loops allow the vocalist to have more creative control over the "flow" of the song whereas wild chord progressions and excessive changes can sometimes catch the artist off guard and that in turn can limit the creative flow for that artist...

I try and make my beats inspirational and easy for anyone to jump on. I've learned that I can successfully accomplish this in 4 bar loops.

 

[j.troup]

You make beats for rapers?

I've produced (made the beats and recorded) entire albums for rappers.



So to answer your question, yes. I didn't start out producing pop/rock/country. I started in hip hop, back in 2003.

 

[j.troup]

I've said this before on here, but the reason depends on who you are working for. If you have your own artists etc you can do what you want. But anything that plans on getting club and or radio spins they won't take it. Being original means nothing. They will come back asking you to do something like so in so. Right now the hot guy is Dj Mustard. "Yo this beat is hot but I'm looking for a club banger like a Dj Mustard or Mike Will type sound". It never fails. These sheep ass managers & artists go with whose hot at the moment and want duplication. **** them all.

You're right.


But all it takes is ONE person to hit with it, to change everyone's preferences.


Macklemore had a smash hit with THRIFT SHOP. That's the most quirky, non-beat beat EVER. ESPECIALLY in the age of Electro-Trap music.


Now watch, we're gonna be getting more Macklemore sounding records.



Hell, look at Kanye's 808's influence on Drake. I remember when FP told me that atmospheric pads over hip hop drums would NEVER work. Then Drake hit big with it. Now people are quick to jump on that sound.



All it takes is one. I guess I'm asking, why haven't we thought about doing it?

 

[Nightshade]

You're right.


But all it takes is ONE person to hit with it, to change everyone's preferences.


Macklemore had a smash hit with THRIFT SHOP. That's the most quirky, non-beat beat EVER. ESPECIALLY in the age of Electro-Trap music.


Now watch, we're gonna be getting more Macklemore sounding records.



Hell, look at Kanye's 808's influence on Drake. I remember when FP told me that atmospheric pads over hip hop drums would NEVER work. Then Drake hit big with it. Now people are quick to jump on that sound.



All it takes is one. I guess I'm asking, why haven't we thought about doing it?

I agree all it takes is the first person or group of people to step forward and make it happen.

Hip hop was built on the DIY principal and with a limited level of musical knowledge a 4 bar rhythm was easy to maintain so that is what it was and is to this day (for the most part).

As for the Macklemore comment...yeah it's played out but that beat is funky as hell and I for one like it because it is catchy. Do I want to hear the next 500 attempts at recreating it by any number of producers and artists...hell no, it was a one shot deal so lets leave it at that.

 

[Desire Inspires]

I am busy doing more guitar-based songs. I am not focused on the hip-hop crowd as a primary market.

Some of those melodies I make go well over hip-hop drums, but they also go well over the four-on-the-floor beats too.

That song "Wake Me Up" by Avicii inspired me to step my guitar game up and make some electro-country stuff.

 

[Thee3ternal]

I'm not musically on that level yet.

LOL if it were up to me I'd be putting out nothing but 'Maybach Music' quality beats.

 

[j.troup]

I am busy doing more guitar-based songs. I am not focused on the hip-hop crowd as a primary market.

Some of those melodies I make go well over hip-hop drums, but they also go well over the four-on-the-floor beats too.

That song "Wake Me Up" by Avicii inspired me to step my guitar game up and make some electro-country stuff.

Yeah, that's a hot joint. Sounds like a pop ho-down.

I'm not musically on that level yet.

LOL if it were up to me I'd be putting out nothing but 'Maybach Music' quality beats.

Ugh. Sorry, but they OVER KILL every single beat. They really don't have progression changes, like a proper pre-hook and bridge...they just do a bunch of acrobatics within the same progression.

 

[VDAYBeatz]

Loops allow for the rapper to have more control and they make the song more catchy if the loop is nice. Hip hop has never been a very "musical" genre. It is more focused on the drums, that's why it's called making a beat.

 

[j.troup]

Loops allow for the rapper to have more control and they make the song more catchy if the loop is nice. Hip hop has never been a very "musical" genre. It is more focused on the drums, that's why it's called making a beat.

My question is, why does it have to be that way?

I would think that loops are limiting. It's like driving on a straight street, there's only so much driving skill you can show off.

 

[Nightshade]

My question is, why does it have to be that way?

I would think that loops are limiting. It's like driving on a straight street, there's only so much driving skill you can show off.

It doesn't have to be that way, but it is a lot easier to just fit in and maintain the status quo. Much like water people tend to take the path of least resistance.

 

[Wacco Stern]

My question is, why does it have to be that way?

I would think that loops are limiting. It's like driving on a straight street, there's only so much driving skill you can show off.

It doesn't necessarily have to be that way. As far as what you're talking about I agree. "At the very least" I think that producers should change up their beats with inversions; due to the fact that producers aren't using chord progression, or much of it. You also have to take into consideration that the drum work does most of the "busyness" in hip hop. That's my opnion.