Metal techno?

  • Thread starter Thread starter [][][][]ROK[][][][]
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well, then there is a lot or work pending on those areas.

I have listen a lot of industrial, punk techno, hardcore techno, etc, and my ears really still hungry.

It's not just a mix of the electronic sounds with the rock sounds.
When somebody works hard trying to combinate different elements, maybe someday, if he is lucky SINERGY will appear, a totally new thing born from the merge of different elements, wich has new properties that you won't find on its isolated parts.

Thing like techno-shamanism, new science considerations about music effects., legacy of crazy guys like Terence Mckenna, the concept of new thinking groups born after the worldwide problems with terrorism, the new advances on technology, this mix will give a result that we still waiting. Also, I expect a lot from japanese electronic scene, I think they'll surprise to the entire world on the next years with something new.

I can't say what I exactly want to hear, because I can describe something I don't know, but I'm sure I feel its abscence.

I have years waiting for that feeling to appear again, the feeling that I had when I listened for the first time to N.I.N. I thought: what the f*cking hell is that!!!!
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balma said:
I have years waiting for that feeling to appear again, the feeling that I had when I listened for the first time to N.I.N. I thought: what the f*cking hell is that!!!!
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i can answer that.

crap
 
no NIN pretty hate machine was a masterpiece. I dont think you can really outdo something like that. True this type of music has been around for a long time and has been explored alot, but theres nothing wrong listening to old music. Its some of the best. :monkey: < look. a monkey. teehee.
 
Pretty hate machine, while an OK album by itself is really the most overated album i have ever heard. its chock full of skinny puppy rip offs and badly written overly angsty lyrics.

its really a shame that some people put it as THE shining star industrial album. i mean, its an above average pop, but sub par industrial cd.

tho dont get me wrong, its put together well, nothing very original but....amazing synths, great beats, decent guitar.

yet still nothing compared to some of trents compatriots, IMHO
 
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well, whitch albums in particular do you think better it?
 
Balma, are you really in the rainforests of Costa Rica? That's too cool!

I think you're on the case with all this, especially the bit about not knowing what the result will sound like, but knowing what's missing.

My feelings are as follows. The kind of music I'm really missing, wanting, and expecting is best described as metal techno. This music is not the same as industrial rock. That is, it would neither sound the same nor suggest the same images, view of life, and so on.

Industrial rock was kind of parallel to my musical evolution, as I grew up with it. Not the second wave, but the post-Throbbing Gristle stuff - DAF, Front 242, Nitzer Ebb, Liaisons Dangereuses, etc. I was in an industrial rock band too - we released a couple of albums. Later on things elolved into NIN et al - this music is still evolving and going places. It's not what we (Rok, Balma and I) mean by metal techno.

I think the three of us mean slightly different things (I know for example that Rok hears a hiphop feel in the drums), and this will yield slightly different results (good!) but that we do agree about this:

Metal techno:

- has no real guitars - not ever!
- has a rock band feel
- is full tilt, balls to the wall rock and roll with a very high energy level
- is clearly influenced by various streams of rock music in terms of songwriting, but uses a techno mindspace to create a crazy sonic universe where, in the context of a rock song structure, crazy things happen with effects and eq etc
-is deeply psychedelic in a metal way. The metal metaphor is exploited to the hilt ,and the sounds have a sharp, cold, steel-like quality that, as I said before, is intensely trippy and pyschedelic but also very minimal and clean (like pure techno).
-uses rock beats, or rock/funk, rock/hiphop hybrids.
- draws on the likes of Slayer, The Ramones, The Sex Pistyols, The Stooges, Joan Jett, L7, Judas Priest, Black Sabbath and so on, but also industrial noise types like Whitehouse and Merzbow. So we have songs that utilise melodies, vocals and pure noise together.
- has a crazy, wild sense of humour and post-nihilist joy of life that takes pleasure and pain as they come and never stops celebrating - the kind of humour you hear in the bands mentioned above, but also in the likes of certain hardcore/gabba types like Nasenbluten and The Mover.

More important than all this, though, is to understand we're not talking about a hybrid where these things are pasted together. For example (this is not a criticism by the way) in industrial rock you'll hear discrete bits of rock running in parallel to disctrete bits of techno: a funk bassline but played on an acid synth sound, for example, or a real guitar riff played over a drum machine.

In metal techno it is impossible to determine where the rock ends and the techno begins. Everything sounds rock in that the whole song could be played easily by a reasonably proficient rock band. On the other hand, everything sounds techno in that all the instrumentation (and maybe even the vocal) is completely synthetic.
 
I haven't done any metal techno myself yet, but the concept is so simple and can be taken in any direction, the fundamental principles being:

*for songwriting (melodies, structure, format, eg 4 piece band with drums, vocals, gtrs and bass),no influences from techno permitted: only influences from rock.

*for production (actual soundsynthesis, eq, effects, etc), no influences from rock permitted: only influences from techno.

HAHAHA!!:victory: That's how I feel when I contemplate this thing.

The techno part of the equation is to be completely transparent. That's interesting to me, because I'm 100% a techno producer and have been since about 1985. I only started seriously listening to rock recently.


Now, although I haven't done any metal techno, I've done some electronic rock with my female partner who has a straight up female rock voice and outlook on life. She's a very individualistic, rebellious woman and has that necessary energy that balma was talking about somewhere upthread. The result is completely digital except for the vocals. And yet no-one in the audience spots an industrial influence (they must be there, as I spent most of the 80's listening to Throbbing Gristle, Front 242 and DAF) - usually they compare us to the Plasmatics or L7. I think this may be because industrial rock has come into a certain kind of maturity with its own particular attitude and feel, which is very angsty, very analytical and troubled, and seeks catharsis through a combination of rhythm and verbal aggression. However, the words, though angry, are controlled. The catharsis is controlled. Which is a very interesting approach, and may explain why the word 'control' recurs obsessively thoughout industrial rock and industrial music. It's almost a lietmotif of the style: control, obsession, repression, social violence. Industrial music seeths with repressed rage, repressed perversion.

Rock, even in its heaviest form, seems to me a more innocent beast. Or, to put it more positively, it goes directly to catharsis without stopping to analyse. This attitude accounts for the difference between rock and industrial rock, and also for my belief that metal techno would sound like heavy metal/heavy rock with guitars, but not really like industrial techno, industrial rock or even industrial metal. Thanks mainly to Throbbing Gristle and Re/Search magazine, the word 'industrial' is loaded with intellectual and musical connotations: Gysin, Burroughs, various serial killers, Ballard/weird perversions, Weltschmertz, techno-paranoia, techno-paganism/body art, art brut, dub reggae, the Futurists, Magick/ OTO etc. Eyeliner, romanticism...

Just leaving aside the question of whether NIN is a great example of industrial rock (I was always more of a Skinny Puppy fan), if you want to get a quick and dirty appreciation of the difference between rock and industrial rock, compare Rob Halford's (of Judas Priest) collaboration with Trent Reznor as Two. Very, very different to his work before or after. A whole different attitude, once the industrial vibe permeated the music. It didn't cut loose any more: it seethed instead. Now this excellent and worth project died in the arse because heavy rock fans want to cut loose, end of story.

I think (again, this is not an attempt to insult the idea of metal techno) that metal techno seeks to bypass the intellect completely, and go straight for the root of the human being - sex, dancing, celebration, raw pain and raw fear - as a directly imparted physical sensation. These all go together. And it's not surprising that it goes with techno too - because techno is also about direct, intellectually unmediated, bodily celebration.

I'm curious to know, incidentally, what the people on the F/P metal/rock forum think.
 
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i see what you are getting at. tho frankly i fail to see how anyone could only have rock influences and approach a band with only synthesizers.

(btw, you may want to check out the screamers, its an old school LA punk band who only use a synth, an organ and a drum set)

the more i think on it the more bands come to mind that may fit your description. Any of Alex Empire's Digital hardcore bands fit the bill, just as like i previously mentioned, Babyland. as far back as the 70s you had bands like silver apples mixing rock with synthesizer music. its nothing wholey new.

ive got to ask you to stop refering to throbbing gristle as industrial rock tho. there is nothing even close to rock about anything they have done. they are the industrial originators, i wouldnt call anything industrial rock up untill ministry hit the scene in the early to mid 80s.

but back to the topic at hand, the whole reason industrial and metal have blended as well as they have is they are both musics where raw aggression is everything. industrial focusing on the beats and metal on the insane melodies. that in itself is a lethal combination. anyways, for some decent takes on the whole 'playing metal with electronic instruments' thing, check out the blackest album series. alot of killer metallica covers by some of todays most notorious EBM bands. now granted a great deal of the bands on the compilation drop any and all metal influence some of them stick very closely to the originals wothout straying into guitar territory.
2 tracks of note are Apoptygma Berzerk's covers of Fade to Black and Nothing Else Matters
 
What label puts out the blackest album series? Sounds kinda sik. I also seem to surprising share alot of similar ideas with Circuit Freak. However I think a hardcore rap, hip hop groove could carry the feeling too. This wouldnt by any means be some "pop" mainstream stuff. Itd be kind of like a fusion of the underground hiphop scene and black metal. Mostly electronic though. goth hip hop anyone? hehe :bat: and some polka as well.









hehe naw jk on polka.:D
 
[][][][]ROK[][][][] said:
What label puts out the blackest album series?
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heh probably the worst label for goth/industrial ever

cleopatra
 
Song I Made A Whilte Ago

Here's a song I made a few years ago, kind of techno-metal-ish....

 
not really sure what you're looking for, but maybe something similar to Crystal Method?
 
This is a ver interesting thread. I've actually toyed witht he idea myself being a guitar player / electronica producer.

Although fat boy slim, NIN, Chem bros, Daft Punk (to name a VERY few ammount) all tried a stab at it, it's not all the way, mostly so so.

While I realize fat boy slim and moby aren't Techno producers, it does fal under Electronica so was worth noting, however I do not actually like their music!

Peace : )
 
catnap said:


Nasenbluten, Bloody Fist Records, Venetian Snares, Addict Records, Doormouse, Stuntrock, Delta 9...

No, it's nothing like any metal band, or industrial - it's its own genre of music and is easily the most vicious of ANY kind of music to have EVER been made. most people wouldn't even consider it music!
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I totally forgot about this thread and there's more I wanted to say. I write music similar to everyone you listed, but with live bass and singing (screaming). I've of course heard similar acts (live instruments played to electronic tracks) but never anything quite like my ****. People around here call it "Murderyourfamilycore" :D

So yeah, I think there's still a lot of room for new ideas to emerge.
 
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