F*ck Software

Kno1ills said:
Not arguing the analog vs digital, but I hear alot of guys talking about software if faster, workflow is so much better.

Could it be a possibility that maybe you haven't used the right hardware to keep you stuck on it than just trying out a mpc 1000 or a 500 and gave up? I have no need to convert peoples idea of which is better, just want to see if after you 'convert', do you still want to try more hardware?
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great point. All hardware is not the same and chances are just because you dislike one piece doesnt mean youll hate it all and vice versa
 
yeah that's a really valid point. as hardware is more expensive and harder to demo it can be hard to get an idea of what an actual piece of hardware is like before you buy it. with software you can demo in your home for as long as you like before you make the plunge.

watching product demonstration videos of hardware on youtube can only give you so much of a feel of how the unit and you will actually get along.

for example i had the old zoom sampletrack and sp303 before i bought an MPC2000. i thought i was going to get along great with the MPC because of all i heard about workflow but in reality i found it hard to adjust to. but i kept at it and it became easier after a while because well i was stubborn because i spent so much money on the unit.

when i got an sp404 i ended up using that piece more than the MPC2k. i eventually ended up selling that for an MPC1k which i ended up using a lot.

the same is true for software. when i first started using reason it just "clicked" with me. i just got along with the program. the same was true for renoise. lots of people say they have trouble adjusting to using trackers after traditional sequencers but i found it easy to work in renoise.

unfortunately whenever i try out the ableton live demo i just don't "get it". i've heard so many great things about the program and i really feel like i should give it a chance but whenever i boot up the demo i just am not feeling the program.

workflow is really just specific to the individual and the hardware/software in question.
 
say it terror said:
yeah that's a really valid point. as hardware is more expensive and harder to demo it can be hard to get an idea of what an actual piece of hardware is like before you buy it. with software you can demo in your home for as long as you like before you make the plunge.

watching product demonstration videos of hardware on youtube can only give you so much of a feel of how the unit and you will actually get along.

for example i had the old zoom sampletrack and sp303 before i bought an MPC2000. i thought i was going to get along great with the MPC because of all i heard about workflow but in reality i found it hard to adjust to. but i kept at it and it became easier after a while because well i was stubborn because i spent so much money on the unit.

when i got an sp404 i ended up using that piece more than the MPC2k. i eventually ended up selling that for an MPC1k which i ended up using a lot.

the same is true for software. when i first started using reason it just "clicked" with me. i just got along with the program. the same was true for renoise. lots of people say they have trouble adjusting to using trackers after traditional sequencers but i found it easy to work in renoise.

unfortunately whenever i try out the ableton live demo i just don't "get it". i've heard so many great things about the program and i really feel like i should give it a chance but whenever i boot up the demo i just am not feeling the program.

workflow is really just specific to the individual and the hardware/software in question.
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Truth in the pudding.

This thread is making me think twice about MPCs period. Now that I think about it, I've only really been in the game for like 4 years, and have been obsessed with getting an MPC............

........... till this thread. Thanks guys.

Is it worth the money??? From a software standpoint? I can do anything software, my problem usually with that is that I'm unstable lol. My beats will never be finished. Even when I place people on them, they're just put out, but I'll never say I ever finished a piece.

I really need to know for sure if buying an MPC is worth the learning curve today, cuz I'd probably get one sooner rather than later, and I'd rather spend the money on a monster VST and some controllers and padKontrol type products if I know I can do practically the same things with the hard-soft combination...
 
WatchWhatHappens1204 said:
Truth in the pudding.

This thread is making me think twice about MPCs period. Now that I think about it, I've only really been in the game for like 4 years, and have been obsessed with getting an MPC............

........... till this thread. Thanks guys.

Is it worth the money??? From a software standpoint? I can do anything software, my problem usually with that is that I'm unstable lol. My beats will never be finished. Even when I place people on them, they're just put out, but I'll never say I ever finished a piece.

I really need to know for sure if buying an MPC is worth the learning curve today, cuz I'd probably get one sooner rather than later, and I'd rather spend the money on a monster VST and some controllers and padKontrol type products if I know I can do practically the same things with the hard-soft combination...
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its hard to be subjective with a question like this. Some people love software samplers and say they are easier. Some people prefer having a piece of hardware in front of them during the creative process. I personally say yes a mpc is worth it but its old dying technology. Once the mpcs are gone I probably wouldnt advise people to start buying them again. I have a feeling that Akai will soon abandon the Mpc series and focus on the MPD and MPK series
 
If their dedication to fixing the bugs in the 5000 are any indication, then I think you are correct.
 
i heard the new os for the 5k fixed those bugs but seriously what mpc doesnt have a bug or two in it even the classics were abandoned with a few
 
Id be pissed too lol. I wanted a 5k too but not with all of this crap goin on. I also wish they would have made the 5k 24 bit like the 4k
 
I don't think Akai is going to stop making hardware anytime soon. They will of course lead the way when it comes to midi controllers, but that's just a given. (The MPK and the APC40 are both awesome controllers!)

But to the point, I think it all boils down to what you gel with the most. If you are happy making beats on a computer and feel you get good results, then go for it. But I personally realized that even if I use midi controllers, I never seem to have as much FUN making music on the computer as I do with hardware. And this is needless to say, but hardware does sound better. Some things are a little more cumbersome than working on a computer, as most things are made extremely intuitive by the huge space available of a monitor compared to a LCD on a typical piece of gear. And when working with vintage gear, it's kind of a pain in the ass to mess with scsi, floppies, zip disks, etc. I got a compact flash reader in my MPC 2000 XL so I could make a lot of things easier. Software is a lot quicker and easier to use than hardware, generally speaking, but I always get pissed off by running out of CPU power and the fact that it's so easy to spend a ridiculous amount of time going through a million vst instruments and effects, auditioning presets, tweaking stuff, etc. Hardware in a sense is more limiting, but in a good way. It's a lot easier to stay focused, and more importantly for me, when I start working on tunes with hardware I have so much hands-on options for tweaking and mangling my sounds, and I never have to worry about processor power. The only thing I use my PC for is recording. It just works better for me. 90% of the people that make beats these days do so on the computer with pirated software, and I like the fact that I make music that doesn't have easily recognizable vst presets in it. ;)
 
WatchWhatHappens1204 said:
Truth in the pudding.

This thread is making me think twice about MPCs period. Now that I think about it, I've only really been in the game for like 4 years, and have been obsessed with getting an MPC............

........... till this thread. Thanks guys.

Is it worth the money??? From a software standpoint? I can do anything software, my problem usually with that is that I'm unstable lol. My beats will never be finished. Even when I place people on them, they're just put out, but I'll never say I ever finished a piece.

I really need to know for sure if buying an MPC is worth the learning curve today, cuz I'd probably get one sooner rather than later, and I'd rather spend the money on a monster VST and some controllers and padKontrol type products if I know I can do practically the same things with the hard-soft combination...
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I don't know what you're using now but the only reason I'm on mpc is because the learning curve is over for me and i've mastered it after 5 years.

Software was NO WHERE near what it is today when I started. Even not too long ago most people were still "get mpcs" there used to be HUGGGEEE debates in this forum about fl studio vs mpcs and now there isn't bc the fruity loopers got vindicated from people other than 9th wonder and soulja boy...

Software today is amazing. You can arrage easily, track out simply, and add and subtract elements from various sources (vsts, samples). I would find a good piece of software, and buy some nice VST's and learn the hell out of it...

With my mpc, its not so easy to arrange, tracking out is easy with midi, but still takes longer because I can't do it all at once with my current interface, and I loose so much feeling in the process of moving my beat from MPC to computer.

If I could do it all over I'd move to Reason, which seems to have a nice variety of plugins, refills, effects, drums, ect.

I'm stuck on the mpc for better or for worse.

---------- Post added at 05:41 PM ---------- Previous post was at 05:40 PM ----------

Don't get me wrong the MPC has TONS of advantages over software during the creative process, but during the song making process... its not touching software.
 
Isn't the creative process and the song making process the same thing?

Yeah, making and recording music on a computer is easy, but it's also really damn boring. I just sequence all my hardware and record it all at once, I can go back later to edit if I really want, but usually I find that I like what I did the first time. Unfortunately I can't record individual tracks right now, only a main stereo input. I could go through and track every single output (synths, samplers, whatever) but I think that its a pain in the ass, so I don't. When I get my new interface I'm going to be able to record everything on it's own channel quite easily, so that will help me mix my tracks a little better but I think that as long as you have everything eq'ed and set right, you don't really need to edit much.

Producing on a computer is like having sex with a condom on... it gets the job done but its not nearly as enjoyable
 
^cop out. No beef. Just sayin

---------- Post added at 01:45 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:44 PM ----------

Creative Process - Sampling, looping, adding drums, bass, the art of the loop, ect.

Song Making Process - Mixing, Tracking, Arranging sequences and loops.

---------- Post added at 01:47 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:45 PM ----------

I agree Computer Producing for me has never been too enjoyable.

The only thing i ever liked about FL Studio, was the way you could arrange your song. I thought that was pretty cool. But other than that I hated it.
 
Yeah I was being lazy.

Honestly, I'll say software that's from my experience though and since we live in an age where everyone uses a computer it will be an easier transition for someone who wants to learn. I like FL personally, it doesn't matter how you make your beat it's whether or not you find the process in which you do it effective and enjoyable.
 
Doc Da Suess said:

I agree Computer Producing for me has never been too enjoyable
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I thought I was one of the few who felt this way. I would much much rather just make music on an actual keyboard or drum machine or combination than a computer its just not fun. For mixing and audio purposes I prefer the computer over adat, digital records and tape editing but for the actual creative process for me its all about hardware. I do enjoy the capabilities and ease of use Reason offers however. But not over my hardware
 
Nowadays they have software that emulates hardware though, with your Nikos and the Maschine and Kore 2 system, etc....Id look into stuff like this, because the maschine is really a monster...it does everything your mpc does at a fraction of the cost, and paired with Kore 2 and Komplete or your software rompler of choice, i dont see much need for a hardware keyboard unless its a dedicated synth.
 
Xabiton said:
I thought I was one of the few who felt this way. I would much much rather just make music on an actual keyboard or drum machine or combination than a computer its just not fun. For mixing and audio purposes I prefer the computer over adat, digital records and tape editing but for the actual creative process for me its all about hardware. I do enjoy the capabilities and ease of use Reason offers however. But not over my hardware
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I honestly miss workstations +Mpc workflow, Nothing can beat the speed and fun in that....the truth is the keyboard workstation is dead, as are Romplers in general (Notice no one is making new rack modules anymore). You can teach someone on hardware so that they understand the physical mechanics behind things, but they also need to know where the production world is going. You have to teach both today.
 
The production world isn't necessarily going computer-based. Computer-based production does open doors for a lot of people that otherwould wouldn't be able to afford hardware though. Let's be honest... how many beat makers these days use software and vst's they actually paid for? I've met a ton of computer-based producers and the large majority of them are wack amateurs with cracked software.

I'm with Xabiton mostly. As far as producing music, I'm all about hardware. It's more fun and sounds better. When it comes to recording I have to give it up to computers. It's so easy to record and mix music on a PC these days at quality people wouldn't have believed 20 years ago. I still prefer the sound of analog tape though... slightly overdriven!

I don't think keyboard workstations are dead, there will always be new ones with updated soundsets and features. But it's my opinion that if you're only wanting rompler type sounds, you're probably better off going with software. But if you want gritty samples and fat, punchy synths, you gotta go old school. You just can't replicate the sound.

I won't deny that computers are very powerful and flexible, but what it ultimately comes down to is the fact that it's so god damn boring to work on beats with a PC. I was software only for years but I got so sick of it that I had to buy hardware again just to get the love back.
 
SUPERBANANABOMB said:
The production world isn't necessarily going computer-based. Computer-based production does open doors for a lot of people that otherwould wouldn't be able to afford hardware though. Let's be honest... how many beat makers these days use software and vst's they actually paid for? I've met a ton of computer-based producers and the large majority of them are wack amateurs with cracked software.

I'm with Xabiton mostly. As far as producing music, I'm all about hardware. It's more fun and sounds better. When it comes to recording I have to give it up to computers. It's so easy to record and mix music on a PC these days at quality people wouldn't have believed 20 years ago. I still prefer the sound of analog tape though... slightly overdriven!

I don't think keyboard workstations are dead, there will always be new ones with updated soundsets and features. But it's my opinion that if you're only wanting rompler type sounds, you're probably better off going with software. But if you want gritty samples and fat, punchy synths, you gotta go old school. You just can't replicate the sound.

I won't deny that computers are very powerful and flexible, but what it ultimately comes down to is the fact that it's so god damn boring to work on beats with a PC. I was software only for years but I got so sick of it that I had to buy hardware again just to get the love back.
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The production world has already gone computer based...its not really about "going". Even folks that use Tape are also using Pro Tools these days. Production and Beatmaking...different topic. Beatmaking will always be more fun on hardware because of the 1-to-1 feedback between a human and hardware. ROMplers will exist for a different market, but they wont be the staple they once were in a project studio. 10 years ago look at how many sound modules existed, look at it now. Romplers will be designed for Stage use going forward, not for studio use primarily. Not saying hardware doesnt have a place, but look at whats really going on in the music instruments industry, the change is already here.
 
It makes sense for digital recording, but when it comes to production gear it boils down to reduced manufacturing costs, research & development costs, etc. Most modern hardware is designed with maximum profits in mind rather than making a truly quality product. There's still plenty of hardware being produced, but you won't find it at Guitar Center.

Just because many studios are going "virtual," that doesn't mean it's better. In the 80's, studios were getting rid of all their badass analog gear and replaced it with shitty early digital gear... The reason why everything is going computer-based is because it's cheap. Maximum profit$$$
 
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