C
CuzinQ
Active member
I use them all the time especially if I want to practice drum programming
SwagProductionz
@SlurRty on Twitter
exactly i'll take the one shot drums and one shot sounds.. and make them my own..
---------- Post added at 03:22 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:20 PM ----------
well that guitarist is creating a loop you or him created.. right? and most important thing is that the loop IS NOT OUT THERE FOR THE WHOLE WIDE WORLD... like a kid from compton or some shit could go and buy the same loop etc from the construction kit.. that guitarist coming in is more private and more professional..
---------- Post added at 03:25 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:22 PM ----------
if you want to loook at it that way, I guess.. if your limited in your producer capabilites sure use the kits.. but using kits is essentially the same as bowling with bumpers..
---------- Post added at 03:27 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:25 PM ----------
He does. "Niggaz In Paris" was one. A lot of people do. It's no different than sampling except you don't owe anybody royalties.
what loop did he sample in the song?
aslaton1
New member
At the end of the day people don't care how you made it as long as it sounds good. With that said there is a limit for me when using loops. I will take an element flip it or keep it exactly the way it is and build a whole track around that loop. I found this nice motown rex drum loop last night and a shaker loop. I played out the piano, bass, organ, congas, brass and I still need to add the electric guitar and strings. I even programmed a simple kick drum clap pattern to layer the drum loop. Even though I used two loops, I gave the track my own feel.
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901_Rice_Street
Rice AKA Clyde Drexler
It's funny that people don't see the unlimited possibilities of modern music making. It's actually sickening. It's disgusting. It's pathetic. I bet 100% of the people talking that nonsense about construction kits use fruity loops. I'm not even trying to be funny either. It just comes with the misinformed territory. You use fruity loops...the enter the matrix....you live in a made up world of "this is a game". Got to be kidding me. This fruity loop age of people making music are funny. Not only that.......the people making these construction kits make music "good enough if not better" than what you hear getting placed. And the fear these fruity loop ass dudes have is that a total "noob in their game" is going to run around knifing they ass.....as they are happy to get long range snipes after years of practice. What kind of dudes is that? It's like we used to call dudes who would always do close up and grab throws in fighting games..."cheesing". "Ole cheesing ass MFer.....why you always grabbing me?" But that was us little rooty poots playing Mortal Kombat.......the ones in the competition playing for the big cash with throw your around all day if you allow it. Doesn't matter.......winner threw you 8 times in a match......you are the loser in the interview who didn't get the cash...."man..he was cheesing..all he did was threw me the whole match up". Winner holds the trophy and the cash.
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M
monsterman
New member
I like the midi files because I could really mess with and I don't play keys so midi files help. The one shots is good to but sometime I Get whole kit just for the midi files.
Xabiton
Cupcake God
Timbaland arguably the greatest hip hop producer in hip hop history has used a shit ton of construction kit loops. That attitude is all ego. Nobody gives a damn where your sounds comes from or if you played them out or not as long as they won't get sued and that shit is hot. I am with Griffin in the respect that producers have turned producing into one man band. The only difference between using loops from a construction kit and using loops from a record is one doesn't have to be cleared. We can all name countless people who have made legendary careers off loops. Q-Tip comes right to mind.
---------- Post added at 02:06 AM ---------- Previous post was at 01:56 AM ----------
exactly. I'd like to add I ain't ever produced for someone who said no I don't want this beat because it was a royalty free sample. I can think of quite a few records that have both royalty free and non royalty free loops in them though. There are so many damn loop libraries out there that most people will not have the same ones. There are thousands out there. People have been releasing loop libraries since at least the late 90s. When I bought Acid 2.0 in 2001 it came with a shit ton of loops. I get 3 or 4 emails a month from Prime Loops about their new loop libraries. All the stuff out there on Big Fish or loop libraries made for Kontakt or Reason. No reason not to use the royalty free stuff except for production preference or ego.
901_Rice_Street
Rice AKA Clyde Drexler
Construction kits and this.
Zero-G Vocaloid 3 Avanna - Time+Space | Virtual Instruments, VST Plugins, Sample Libraries, Sample CDs, Downloads, Tutorial DVDs, Hardware and Software
Time for me to get rich.......bittches!!
Zero-G Vocaloid 3 Avanna - Time+Space | Virtual Instruments, VST Plugins, Sample Libraries, Sample CDs, Downloads, Tutorial DVDs, Hardware and Software
Time for me to get rich.......bittches!!
Griffin Avid
Media Editor
Well this whole idea is personal and totally subjective. There is a reason each individual makes their own bar for considering when their art is their own.
I don't walk down the purist path because there is always someone more PURE than you. And if you believe more pure is better than objectively, factually someone will ALWAYS be better than you. Even if their output is horrible by your own standards. It's putting the Process before the Product.
For drums....we can create a line of thought that gets ridiculous but makes logical sense.
Guy A uses a step sequencer loaded with samples to make his drum pattern.
Guy B says A is not as good because he uses drum pads and really finger drums.
Guy C says B is not as good because his electronic drum set is more real playing than cheating with pads.
Guy D says C is not as good becuase he plays a real acoustic drum set.
Guy E says D is not as good because he samples real world noises and natural sounds and is more original than using something as limited and boring as a drum set.
Guy A loads D's samples and creates a drum pattern...and somehow he's the fakest for doing so.
=======================================
=======================================
Think of all the reasons for NOT using construction kits/samples/presets/templates etc......
1. Someday someone might use the same sound.
2. Someday someone might recreate my song on youtube and make it look easy.
3. Someday someone might sampleID one of my tracks
4. Someday someone might have a beat/track/song that sounds like mine.
And now deal with the reality that ALL of these are based on FEAR.
Afraid of how someone who is meaningless to you will think about you and your art.
This is a self-esteem issue when you only have imaginary confidence -based on what you think *might* happen in the future over your music.
As opposed to dealing with the reality of whether or not it's WORKING FOR YOU.
Make music for money, hope it makes you rich.
Make music for fun, hope you're having fun doing so.
Make music for no other reason than you are driven to do so, then I hope enough of the two previous reasons happen to sustain your desires.
This (PURITY) is IMPORTANT as an INDIVIDUAL CHOICE is- it may well decide how far and how seriously you take your music.
If you INVEST yourself heavily (Money, Emotion,Time, Effort) in your music, you are more likely to take your ambition to an end result.
Not saying the end will make you rich, famous, popular but it's harder to walk away from something you care about.
And if your music is YOU, then you will care enough to do something with it.
Anyone can noodle, move some sounds around...press some buttons, slap some keys...
Mixdown, limiter, upload and post on a profile/forum.
Anyone can tear down that process. Criticize, belittle, analyze it...
What they can't discredit is the effect and impact your music has on others.
That's the part that isn't subjective and determined by a peers opinion.
If you can accept that idea then you will realize the importance of picking a creative workflow and ethic that TOUCHES YOU FIRST so that you are inspired, no - DRIVEN to give your music a chance to touch others.
I don't walk down the purist path because there is always someone more PURE than you. And if you believe more pure is better than objectively, factually someone will ALWAYS be better than you. Even if their output is horrible by your own standards. It's putting the Process before the Product.
For drums....we can create a line of thought that gets ridiculous but makes logical sense.
Guy A uses a step sequencer loaded with samples to make his drum pattern.
Guy B says A is not as good because he uses drum pads and really finger drums.
Guy C says B is not as good because his electronic drum set is more real playing than cheating with pads.
Guy D says C is not as good becuase he plays a real acoustic drum set.
Guy E says D is not as good because he samples real world noises and natural sounds and is more original than using something as limited and boring as a drum set.
Guy A loads D's samples and creates a drum pattern...and somehow he's the fakest for doing so.
=======================================
=======================================
Think of all the reasons for NOT using construction kits/samples/presets/templates etc......
1. Someday someone might use the same sound.
2. Someday someone might recreate my song on youtube and make it look easy.
3. Someday someone might sampleID one of my tracks
4. Someday someone might have a beat/track/song that sounds like mine.
And now deal with the reality that ALL of these are based on FEAR.
Afraid of how someone who is meaningless to you will think about you and your art.
This is a self-esteem issue when you only have imaginary confidence -based on what you think *might* happen in the future over your music.
As opposed to dealing with the reality of whether or not it's WORKING FOR YOU.
Make music for money, hope it makes you rich.
Make music for fun, hope you're having fun doing so.
Make music for no other reason than you are driven to do so, then I hope enough of the two previous reasons happen to sustain your desires.
This (PURITY) is IMPORTANT as an INDIVIDUAL CHOICE is- it may well decide how far and how seriously you take your music.
If you INVEST yourself heavily (Money, Emotion,Time, Effort) in your music, you are more likely to take your ambition to an end result.
Not saying the end will make you rich, famous, popular but it's harder to walk away from something you care about.
And if your music is YOU, then you will care enough to do something with it.
Anyone can noodle, move some sounds around...press some buttons, slap some keys...
Mixdown, limiter, upload and post on a profile/forum.
Anyone can tear down that process. Criticize, belittle, analyze it...
What they can't discredit is the effect and impact your music has on others.
That's the part that isn't subjective and determined by a peers opinion.
If you can accept that idea then you will realize the importance of picking a creative workflow and ethic that TOUCHES YOU FIRST so that you are inspired, no - DRIVEN to give your music a chance to touch others.
Zonic
New member
Where is the original loop of that Usher: In This Club song?
Does anyone have before/after examples? That would be good to hear lol.
I remember the first time i heard all Timbaland samples on youtube, i lost a little piece of me lol.... and here i thought the genius Timbaland use to go in and create everything from scratch.
Does anyone have before/after examples? That would be good to hear lol.
I remember the first time i heard all Timbaland samples on youtube, i lost a little piece of me lol.... and here i thought the genius Timbaland use to go in and create everything from scratch.
mwandishi
New member
Preach!
The search for purity is a noble quest, but so often we forget that many of the people we seek to emulate weren't so pure.
Y
YOUNG TEX
New member
901_Rice_Street
Rice AKA Clyde Drexler
All Quincy Jones needed was a piece of got damn paper.
Yall ain't shit....Timbaland ain't shit. Dr.Dre ain't shit. Tell tem I said it. You don't hear music in your head......you hear somebody else's style.....then you construct it with sounds they might use. And you call it talent...then discredit a person using loops. smh.
Talking bout some...."I can't wait til I get home so I can make a beat". Hahahahahahahaaaaaa.........why you can't make one on break at your job? Because you don't have a computer? But oh...you can make one on a phone today.
That's where yall heads be....in the clouds. But you cry tears of triumph because you feel you are getting closer to something...and want people to respect you as one of the greatest one day...that's what you really want to be someday...but you want it the fake way. You have all of that got damn time and never do things that expands your "creative thinking". You go for presets that the market provided for you to sound like "someone else". Yet you think thet you are being "original".....your not...you just switched somebody else's style and made it just "a little bit different". That's all good...I ain't downing that at all....but at the same time "YOU DON'T DESERVE A PAT ON THE BACK FOR THAT".
Get on my level. I take samples and make them unrecognizable. If I hadn't have posted this and told people what sample I used....I could comfortably bet money NOBODY WOULD KNOW where it came from...yet the sample is used so obvious in rap songs throughout history. All I used were drums..everything else is from one song. So TImbaland...Dr.Dre....all of your favorite producers can kiss my ass and give me the crown...because they can't fuuck with me.
Slow October _The Return Of Shyne_.mp3 - DivShare
But does that matter? No.....I have no record sales. I hope yall get what I'm saying here. People post guys who's name we have never heard before...and they have amazing music that is better than anything Dr.Dre or Timbaland could ever do in their life.......but that shit does not matter and of course Tim and Dre wouldn't care anywa how much better I am than them. I would whoop Timbaland's ass in a beat battle if it wasn't for dick riders. "Timbaland did it so it must be good...even though it sounds weird....it's not off beat...hat's that extra bounce...it just sounds like it is off beat." Dudes get away with anything.
Oh yeah.........
I'm a bad MFer. I don't need pretty little snyth plug ins and shit. All I need is "other music". I'm a bad MFer....don't care what anybody think.....I'm a bad MFer because I know that shit!!!
Yall ain't shit....Timbaland ain't shit. Dr.Dre ain't shit. Tell tem I said it. You don't hear music in your head......you hear somebody else's style.....then you construct it with sounds they might use. And you call it talent...then discredit a person using loops. smh.
Talking bout some...."I can't wait til I get home so I can make a beat". Hahahahahahahaaaaaa.........why you can't make one on break at your job? Because you don't have a computer? But oh...you can make one on a phone today.
That's where yall heads be....in the clouds. But you cry tears of triumph because you feel you are getting closer to something...and want people to respect you as one of the greatest one day...that's what you really want to be someday...but you want it the fake way. You have all of that got damn time and never do things that expands your "creative thinking". You go for presets that the market provided for you to sound like "someone else". Yet you think thet you are being "original".....your not...you just switched somebody else's style and made it just "a little bit different". That's all good...I ain't downing that at all....but at the same time "YOU DON'T DESERVE A PAT ON THE BACK FOR THAT".
Get on my level. I take samples and make them unrecognizable. If I hadn't have posted this and told people what sample I used....I could comfortably bet money NOBODY WOULD KNOW where it came from...yet the sample is used so obvious in rap songs throughout history. All I used were drums..everything else is from one song. So TImbaland...Dr.Dre....all of your favorite producers can kiss my ass and give me the crown...because they can't fuuck with me.
Slow October _The Return Of Shyne_.mp3 - DivShare
But does that matter? No.....I have no record sales. I hope yall get what I'm saying here. People post guys who's name we have never heard before...and they have amazing music that is better than anything Dr.Dre or Timbaland could ever do in their life.......but that shit does not matter and of course Tim and Dre wouldn't care anywa how much better I am than them. I would whoop Timbaland's ass in a beat battle if it wasn't for dick riders. "Timbaland did it so it must be good...even though it sounds weird....it's not off beat...hat's that extra bounce...it just sounds like it is off beat." Dudes get away with anything.
Oh yeah.........
I'm a bad MFer. I don't need pretty little snyth plug ins and shit. All I need is "other music". I'm a bad MFer....don't care what anybody think.....I'm a bad MFer because I know that shit!!!
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Zonic
New member
Polo pretty much said "**** it" with that one, lol.
It's funny cause that's one of Usher's better songs too. I honestly don't even care where the sounds come from but you start to wonder and question their "talent".
Have these producers EVER come up with an original melody? lol
It's funny cause that's one of Usher's better songs too. I honestly don't even care where the sounds come from but you start to wonder and question their "talent".
Have these producers EVER come up with an original melody? lol
Y
YOUNG TEX
New member
^^^He was smart enough to use that loop nobody else used it and it was sitting right there. Having an ear to pick out even loops with potential and construct a song that becomes a hit record is talent imo..
901_Rice_Street
Rice AKA Clyde Drexler
DJ Quik and Battlecat are two of the few producers I have respect for as hip hop musicians. Very underrated.
DJ Quik can use samples, use live instrumentation, put them both together.....and do it all in a way that "sounds like him". Not just some drum patterns that define him...but the overall sound of the music. Just wish he would get back on that timeless shit and quit thinking outside of the box that is outside of the box.
Why nobody can't mess with Quik on any level...because he loves music....everything about it. He don't have to say it...the music speaks. I think Quik goes into the same mode as me. Get stuck in that outer box because we enjoy that area. But them other producers get at the paper because they have a great ear for what would be a highly salable product to push. Some music just don't appeal to the masses....unfortunately. Justice League comes to mind with their overly done changes in music every bar. Though some people like that kind of stuff...the dumb down stuff is more appealing.
Which is something to think about. Why even bother trying to "prove musical point"? Would be better off giving it to fans for free who respect your "musical mind....or minds (plural).
I may be going way off topic....but some things lead me to believe that musical ideas come and go as time passes...all that is left to do is bite...(which is all most people who are new know how to do anyway). Dangelo is very musically talented...but can he still have that same feeling now that he had in VooDoo? Or Prince...who makes music how he want...but has giving us all of this music from now to then and the music then sounds more set in stone that his newer stuff. Or The Time....their new stuff as The Original 7ven which sounds O.K....but man...IDK. I've never understood why hip hop can sample the music from back then and people love the beat (e ven when nothing is changed from the original. Why they can't get THAT feeling back at the same time as hip hop sampling them......why do they go left? I feel I know the answer and it's a mix of a bunch of answers....just saying that to spark brains really.
DJ Quik can use samples, use live instrumentation, put them both together.....and do it all in a way that "sounds like him". Not just some drum patterns that define him...but the overall sound of the music. Just wish he would get back on that timeless shit and quit thinking outside of the box that is outside of the box.
Why nobody can't mess with Quik on any level...because he loves music....everything about it. He don't have to say it...the music speaks. I think Quik goes into the same mode as me. Get stuck in that outer box because we enjoy that area. But them other producers get at the paper because they have a great ear for what would be a highly salable product to push. Some music just don't appeal to the masses....unfortunately. Justice League comes to mind with their overly done changes in music every bar. Though some people like that kind of stuff...the dumb down stuff is more appealing.
Which is something to think about. Why even bother trying to "prove musical point"? Would be better off giving it to fans for free who respect your "musical mind....or minds (plural).
I may be going way off topic....but some things lead me to believe that musical ideas come and go as time passes...all that is left to do is bite...(which is all most people who are new know how to do anyway). Dangelo is very musically talented...but can he still have that same feeling now that he had in VooDoo? Or Prince...who makes music how he want...but has giving us all of this music from now to then and the music then sounds more set in stone that his newer stuff. Or The Time....their new stuff as The Original 7ven which sounds O.K....but man...IDK. I've never understood why hip hop can sample the music from back then and people love the beat (e ven when nothing is changed from the original. Why they can't get THAT feeling back at the same time as hip hop sampling them......why do they go left? I feel I know the answer and it's a mix of a bunch of answers....just saying that to spark brains really.
Zonic
New member
Marketing.
If a certain style or genre is being pushed everything else is irrelevant to the market. That's why those old artist can't recapture that same feeling they once did. That feeling was there because that style of music was pushed and those artist were being marketed in the forefront during that era.
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SwagProductionz
@SlurRty on Twitter
At the end of the day everyone has their own take on it from the comments... this issue will never truly resolved lol
901_Rice_Street
Rice AKA Clyde Drexler
I agree just a little bit, but disagree a lot. Marketing has always been "the icing on the cake". But the actual music has always been the actual cake. A producer back then had the talent of knowing what was a hit that was different than the other jam sessions. Today.....artist like Odd Future can be #2 on the charts.....which is SAD. Thanks to the amount of weirdos who like weirdo shit. That's when you lick all the icing off the cake but never eat the cake. The cake used to be good with a little icing.....then people started putting sprinkles and M&Ms......focused less on the cake. But the good news is that every so often either a fresh new artist or an older artist proves that people still love cake. If it wasn't broke why fix it? If it was the icing....got to keep the icing on it so the fans eat something.
I like to think that I'm a good strategic thinker. I think of shit that I feel people with the power to make things move should jump on. Give New York some.....I want to hear a new Firm album....a part two. This time with more East Coast artist. Kool G Rap, Rakim, some new guess (that can really spit). Shit would huge Dre.....open some doors....get people back into writing. Just my thoughts...put the icing and some sprinkles on it. Eminem had these ole Future loving ass chicks in the south like "Eminem snappin" on the BET awards. So the momentum is there just waiting for rappers to put their all. Waiting for artist to put their all....you don't have to rush...you will meed icing though.
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Traxx1
Boss.
Nice.
In a nutshell, only self proclaimed "producers" care. But who's the music really for? ---- The "listener" audience and fans of the genre and thats who loved it and thats all that really matters.
--- I'm supposed to deprive my audience of some heat because I didn't make the entire arrangement?? lol smh...yall too much..
deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup
New member
I never use construction kits as a whole. I peice stuff together from everywhere by nature...but absolutely nothing wrong with them. If anything, I'll go as far as to say I'd probably have better kits if I wasn't always "frankensteining" my sounds.
Just done it so long it's habbit.
And when used right, they're very creative. I just have this unwritten rule you only "sample" 1 thing from 1 source ever.
Only 1 song from an album/artist
Only 1 sound out of an entire construction kit
Only 1 sound from a movie or TV show
That habit has costed me alot of money. I own thousands of CDs, DVDs, Vinyl, Songs in iTunes, Sample libraries, ect. that I love, but can only make myself sample once.
Dumb, but just a wierd rule I somehow subliminally made. Keeps me searchin for new sounds though.
Irony is, I only stick to an elite few for my drumsounds and they're mostly just DAW stock stuff.
---------- Post added at 11:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:40 PM ----------
Best post in a while on FP. FYI, this ain't rocket science...if you think it is, you're miserably failing, music should flow regardless of the tools you're using. If you're spending more time planning and "practicing" than actually making your music, you're just wasting time. Use all tools available as you learn to replace some with better ones. You may realize other areas you're lacking in more than what you're focusing on.
Just a ramble.....but for what it's worth, I was making better beats, better money, ect. before I was as music booksmart as I am now. That "f**k it, I dunno what I'm doing" attitude makes you think on your toes. Not encouraging people not to learn, incouraging people to not lose that unorthodox approach along the way. That's the moneymaker in the end. That's "the talent" I always try to put above everything else.
Just done it so long it's habbit.
And when used right, they're very creative. I just have this unwritten rule you only "sample" 1 thing from 1 source ever.
Only 1 song from an album/artist
Only 1 sound out of an entire construction kit
Only 1 sound from a movie or TV show
That habit has costed me alot of money. I own thousands of CDs, DVDs, Vinyl, Songs in iTunes, Sample libraries, ect. that I love, but can only make myself sample once.
Dumb, but just a wierd rule I somehow subliminally made. Keeps me searchin for new sounds though.
Irony is, I only stick to an elite few for my drumsounds and they're mostly just DAW stock stuff.
---------- Post added at 11:28 PM ---------- Previous post was at 10:40 PM ----------
Best post in a while on FP. FYI, this ain't rocket science...if you think it is, you're miserably failing, music should flow regardless of the tools you're using. If you're spending more time planning and "practicing" than actually making your music, you're just wasting time. Use all tools available as you learn to replace some with better ones. You may realize other areas you're lacking in more than what you're focusing on.
Just a ramble.....but for what it's worth, I was making better beats, better money, ect. before I was as music booksmart as I am now. That "f**k it, I dunno what I'm doing" attitude makes you think on your toes. Not encouraging people not to learn, incouraging people to not lose that unorthodox approach along the way. That's the moneymaker in the end. That's "the talent" I always try to put above everything else.
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