swoopsoup said:
I don't have much to add, but this post, line by line is spot on. I agree 100% with what you are saying. It seems like alot of people don't want respect from their peers and more concerned about money. Looping = no respect.
Bezo said:
I'm late to the party, so pardon my responses if these things have been addressed. I'm responding as I go.Love & respect for your art maybe.
My response to both of you:
you are absolutely right.
BUT...
Many people don't care about respect from their peers...
Many people just want to make some quick money...
But what many of these people don't understand is that they might make some quick money, but they are not seeing the big picture. You need to have some work under your belt in order to get more work... you need to work your way up by doing small jobs before you get a chance to work on the big jobs. These small crappy jobs are the things that can help you get your opportunity to do bigger work and then, in return,
those will give you the opportunity to get even bigger work than
that... and so on, and so on...
But if you don't do an amazing job on those small jobs, nobody is going to hire you for bigger, more impressive jobs.
...and you will never get to make the REAL money.
The same way there are some people who are happy "selling beats" to the local guy for $50... then, on the other hand, there are the people who make music for the bigtime "real" records.
If you make some pre-made sample loop track to a guy for $50, do you really think you are going to move up to the "big leagues" when people hear that kind of crap with your name on it?
Bezo said:
I have a hard time believing a client would ask specifically for a beat made with stock riffs from Reason. But I haven't done this professionally yet. Can you give some insight on how these discussion/negotiations go, and how you interpret their needs and deliver preset riffs?
...that is because a client would NOT ever ask for something like that.
I will tell you exactly how the discussion goes:
The client comes to you, usually with a commercial that is in the final stages of editing... they will give you a copy of this video to write along with.
They will have a call with you and describe what they need musically.
It goes something like this...
"So, as you can see from the video, the commercial starts out with that long shot of the car, and then the camera goes under the car and it comes up and we go to a lot of quick cuts until it pans over to the girl driving. That is the high point of the commercial and then it goes to the logo and back to the car again before it ends.
We are looking for a song with a lot of energy but it should kinda start out slow and mysterious until we get to the quick cuts... there should be some kind of transition into that high energy part. And there is going to be some voiceover from around 8 seconds until around 17 seconds, so leave some room for that... we will send you the voiceover... Then when it cuts to the girl, there should be some kind of 'hit' on her and then it comes back down into the logo section... and there should be some other positive shimmery element that hits on the logo.
The commercial is geared towards guys in their mid to late 20's... it should be a really cool sounding track... really legit sounding... modern... maybe a mix of some electronic instruments and some live instrumentation. It should sound agressive but still a bit 'fashion-y' and sophisticated.
when this commercial comes on TV, we want people to hear the music and look up to see what it is... we want a signature sound that people will hear and know it is for this commercial. We want people to wonder 'hey, what song is that?'
You know what I mean... you are the music guy. And could we get maybe 5 versions by end of day tommorrow? Great."
and you ask them specific question you have regarding style and types of sounds... mention a few artists that you are thinking they be wanting it to be in the style of. It is then your job to figure out exactlky what they are trying to say and what they want, even though they may not know how to put it into words.
They want a "real" sounding track, and they want it to be original and their own music.
If you said to them "OK... I have the perfect sampled bassline from Reason that I can use"
They will say to you "what are you talking about? We want original music!"
It is also your job to give them what they REALLY want, even if they don't know how to explain it to you...
For example, if they say "we need a rap song that sounds like a real song and it needs to sound like something brand new that you would hear on the radio, because this commercial is for kids whore 16-20 years old, so we need something very modern, very current, very legit! you know, like MC Hammer... that age group loves him... and maybe put a crazy guitar solo in there"
...if
that is what they say,
you shouldn't say to yourself "OK, that is what the client wants"...
You should tell them that kids DON'T like MC Hammer anymore and that rap songs DON'T generally have guitar solos... It is your job to explain to them the style of rap that is currently popular and it is your job to give it to them.
YOU are the music expert.
THAT is why they hire YOU.
Just because you have a client who doesn't know any better, doesn't mean you should not give them the best music possible.
Even if they say to you "It needs more energy... you should add a drum loop on that"...
...you should tell them "Actually, I should probably program a different drum part or a more active shaker part on top... because drum loops like that are really very mid 1990's sounding.
Then they will probably say something like "OK, yeah, I don't know... it just needs more energy. You know what to do."
So, very often, the client doesn't know exactly what he wants. If you give them a synth pattern preset from Reason, they may be OK with it...
...but that is because they trust you and trust that you are giving them the best possible music...
They don't know they are getting a pre-made loop.
...and they shouldn't have to ask every time they get music from someone "this is not a loop, is it?"
So, if the conversation goes something like this "Dude, I don't care, this is a little crappy local spot... I just want to get it out of my hair... just throw a loop on it or something... it is a crappy commercial that nobody will see anyway. Just give me anything you have laying around."
If the client says that to you, then I guess they don't care... but that is not the way it usually goes.
(but even if they
did say that to you... you should still use it as an opportunity to do something good that you can [ut on your "reel" to help you get more jobs in the future.)