Yamaha O2R: now interesting ?

  • Thread starter Thread starter THM
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THM,

Here is an important question... what is the purpose of your new studio? What do you want to accomplish with it? How do you plan to use it?

For example, are you a professional producer? Do you plan to rent it out for other peoples mixes? Will you be working on several tracks simultaneously? Are you writing music for yourself or for other clients? What is the end use of the music you write in this studio? Are you making records? Commercials? Film scores? Music for the web? etc, etc...
 
dvyce said:
THM,

Here is an important question... what is the purpose of your new studio? What do you want to accomplish with it? How do you plan to use it?

For example, are you a professional producer? Do you plan to rent it out for other peoples mixes? Will you be working on several tracks simultaneously? Are you writing music for yourself or for other clients? What is the end use of the music you write in this studio? Are you making records? Commercials? Film scores? Music for the web? etc, etc...
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Almost all of them... up 'till now it's only been used for private use (I made some records, I make the music for the websites I create), but I'm planning to reorganize seriously and doing stuff for other people and with other people (I have some serious candidates, a.o. the progressive-artist Dave Swayze - fairly wellknown in Belgium). Let's say this studio will be used in a semi-professional way (maybe later full-professional...). It should be possible to work on several tracks simultanously.
Main purpose is electronic music (trance/electro/progressive/techno) and a very little music for the web. No commercials nor film scores at this moment.
 
I would personally recommend that any room you are using for a day to day writing room where you have to go back and forth between projects and recall mixes, that you use a recallable digital mixer.

Just because a console is analog does not mean it is better. In your budget, you are not talking about an SSL or anything, so It is really important to look at your goals for the studio.

I have worked on major label projects using anything from a Mackie D8B to Euphonics to Sony DMX-R100 to SSL. to straight out of ProTools.. and they all sounded good.

There is a lot more involved in getting a good sound than just the mixing board.

More important than any board is getting some good mics, preamps, eq's, compressors, fx, etc.

If you record your stuff through a good mic into a good preamp into a good eq into a good compressor... then it will sound good.

What sort of outboard gear do you have now? Would your budget be better spent on some great preamps, compressors and eq's, then running straight out of ProTools?

Oh, and bringing your tracks to get professionalloy mastered is reeeeeeaaaly important to having your records sounding pro.


Also, don't forget to include in your budget the money for the patchbay (which will probably cost you at least a couple of thousand dollars.)
 
dvyce brings up a very good point. The who, what, why ,how, really should drive the decision.

Dvyce I could tell from listening to your work you would be banging your head against the wall in short order without a digital desk.

If there is any thought of doing surround sound at some point it would be tough without automation.

I am chosing analogue for several reasons. Within 3 years I hope to have a project studio up and running. My money pit.:D It will be as much for my recording use as it will to sell some recording time. Working with small groups I don't want to be dealing with monitoring/latency issues for one. I want a workhouse that is not going to be a constant upgrade hassle. I like analogue EQ better. I also want to be able to use some outboard effects on the mix down without going from digital mixer/analogue effects/digital conversion/mixdown. That alone can cause even more latency problems.

So I will run through an analogue desk to a 24 track hard disk recorder, dump that into the computer and do some work, then mix down through the analogue to 2 track stereo. But that's me and my crazy thought process. It sure wouldn't work for everyone.

THM here is a place in England that sells a lot of used equipment that might be worth checking out.
http://www.larking.com/
 
Yes, there are different solutions for peoples varied audio production scenarios. There is no 1 best way to do it. Everyone needs to do their research and figure out what will work best for them.


... and by the way, all the artists on www.Res-Freq.com are me.
 
I don't usually jump into this forum but it's an interesting topic here.

everyone always forgets the Tascam DM24...for the money, you are getting a lot of console. high quality A/D, TC Works reverbs, i think it will have surround sound capabilities in the future if it doesn't already, 100MM touch sensetive [smooth] faders, HUI emulation, and the list goes on. you can find one of these for around $2k and you get a lot for your money. it's a WAY better value than an 02R96 and offers almost as much.

oh wait...are you guys talking about the 02R96 or the regular 02R?

even still. it's worth the money.
 
Ablord said:
Does Bob Mastering Co have a website address ??
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If you are looking for a good mastering house, you should check out "The Lodge" in NY (www.TheLodge.net). The cheif mastering engineer/owner used to apprentice under Bob Ludwig. They have many quality high profile clients and, not that I am high profile, but I get all my stuff mastered there.
 
yo man hears my bit.

Ive got 2 O2Rs cascaded. I think they are wicked.

There is 4 slots on an O2r at the back for expansion
You can add cards to it such as 8 in/out analog,
8 in/out adat, aesebu in outs. etc

I have 2 8 in/out adat card to 1
in the other I have 8 more analog inputs and sends (you can get just inputs aswell wich is 1 slot as opposed to 2 slots)

so ....... An o2r has 16 1/4" mono inputs (8 of which are also aes ebu sockets) - the first 8. It has a further 4 stereo inputs.
these all have sends too.

..... U could then add 2 8 in/out cards giving you a further 16 channels.

The great thing about these desks is that you can program all of your fader movements within its self or cubase(i think). You can totaly have flying faders!!!!!. I have seen this done although to be honest I havent set it up in my setup yet cause I only have 1 unitor 8 and have no spare midi channels. You need 2 midi channels, 1 for the MTC and the other for automation.

It has 6 auxs and hardrouted to the internal effects.
The compressors are not good for anything like vocals, but do for bass and other minor things. The noise gate is ok.
Internal fx are fine for synths etc.

I cant comment on the other desks cause im not that familiar with them. But the o2r is still used widely and often in Digidesign Avid and producast situations.

Its great to be able to recall songs as well, so you dont have always write the desks settings.
 
Thanx once more for the info, guys. I don't know yet what will suit me the best... all further opinons are still very welcome !!

Well let's say that a Yamaha DM2000 and Sony DMX-R100 are outside my budget... so forget these.
And although some people recommend me to stay analog, nevertheless I think I go digital. So the GHOST series are gone too...

iow: still in the running:

* Yamaha O2R(96)
* Mackie D8B
* Digidesign Control|24 => although you do need other Protools hardware stuff here, isn't it ? and obviously the ProTools software itself, or is that included with the price of the Control|24 ?
* Tascam DM-24 => is this one any interesting or is it more interesting to spend more money to e.g. the ones here above ?

Thanks.
 
Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I think the Digidesign is just an overgrown control surface and not a mixer. Its a Mackie Control on steroids.
 
Tim20 said:
Someone correct me if I am wrong, but I think the Digidesign is just an overgrown control surface and not a mixer. Its a Mackie Control on steroids.
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Yes, I believe that is correct...

it believe it also has some Focusrite pre's in there , too... but I don't think they are very good - - at least not from what I have heard about them.
 
THM if you are going digital I suggest you check out the DM1000 (and the 02R96 already in your list) by yamaha....

remember if you go the digidesign route I'd look for a used tdm system from a reputable dealer...
 
Just remember too with Digidesign their main interest lies with the ProTools line, whereas the people who make mixers are trying to provide support to all of the recording software.

Personally, if I was going digital I would lean towards Yamaha and maybe take a look at the Tascam. Yamaha makes that Waves effects board that has it all for about 800.00. Doesn't that plug into the O2?

Mackie would be my last choice because I have heard more negative than positive. Mainly faders breaking, lightweight construction, etc. but on the up side it does have a lot of support for 3rd party effects boards. A big plus if you have the money.:D


Dyvce has used these and my big question about digital boards is the latency issue if you try to use an analogue outboard effect during mixdown. That conversion has to take at least 10ms? How do you overcome that? Do you have to totally forget about using outboard analogue effects?

:cheers:
 
Tim20 said:

Dyvce has used these and my big question about digital boards is the latency issue if you try to use an analogue outboard effect during mixdown. That conversion has to take at least 10ms? How do you overcome that? Do you have to totally forget about using outboard analogue effects?

:cheers: [/QUOTE


When we first got the D8B everyone was worried about the latencey... that is what everyone was talking about at the time (I got the board when it first came out... the OS wasn't even complete yet.)

The fact is, I never had any real problems with latency that I can recall - - and I always used outboard effects (and EQ's and compressors) especially with the D8B because I hated that reverb so much.

I never had any problem with any of them breaking down and I used them both on a daily basis for a couple of years each (except the D8B would crash every once in a while... but that was no big deal, you just restart it... like with any computer... hey, even our Euphonix would crash, and my DMX-R100 crashes... theres no escaping it with a computer based digital board).
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Tim20 said:

Dyvce has used these and my big question about digital boards is the latency issue if you try to use an analogue outboard effect during mixdown. That conversion has to take at least 10ms? How do you overcome that? Do you have to totally forget about using outboard analogue effects?

:cheers: [/QUOTE


When we first got the D8B everyone was worried about the latency... that is what everyone was talking about at the time (I got the board when it first came out... the OS wasn't even complete yet.)

The fact is, I never had any real problems with latency that I can recall - - and I always used outboard effects (and EQ's and compressors) especially with the D8B because I hated that reverb so much.

I never had any problem with any of them breaking down and I used them both on a daily basis for a couple of years each (except the D8B would crash every once in a while... but that was no big deal, you just restart it... like with any computer... hey, even our Euphonix would crash, and my DMX-R100 crashes... theres no escaping it with a computer based digital board).
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Dyvce, that's interesting! Even through the aux buss you weren't having a latency issue?

The one I always thought would be the biggest hassle would be trying to add some reverb from the board to a vocalist, but then I know there are workarounds for that.

Oh, I should also clarify what I had previously said about the digital summing. That was mainly in the computer based side, it hasn't been the best. I'm not a computer guru by any means, but I understand at least on a Windows based machine, it is done through the Windows mixer and it isn't the best. Of course we are starting to see more and more boxes to sum outside of the computer.

Digital mixer would be different.

It is a lot of info, pro's/con's to digest.:confused:
 
If you just getting this thing started maybe look into the digi 002.
its digital, automated and if preamps are a problem buy a few extenal voice strips and a good a/d converter. maybe you dont need to go all out and get a 32 channel automated digital board right yet. protools le gives you 32 tracks and overall it is much cheaper. Im a digidesign as well as other companys dealer so for any more info just let me know.supports RTAS plugins and there is a bunch of them.
MIC@Fullsail.
 
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