jnew
New member
so I have a question, do big time producers such as kanye, timbo, n dre mix there own beats, I think itd be weird as hell to make a track then jus hand it over to somebody to decide how it sounds, i don kno jus wonderin
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HIMbeats
Guest
It is called TRUST in your mix engineer. Kanye, Timbo and others mix their own tracks, but they are still sent off to a mix engineer and then to master just like joe the average producer does. The difference is in the mix engineer. The super producer won't trust just anybody on their stuff. For example Kanye did a great job mixing his track "Stronger", but Manny took it to a whole different level when he final mixed it. But that is why the man has 5 grammys!
ProducerJC
IndieHost
Producers and Audio Engineers have two completely different thought processes. Let me elaborate...being a part of the song is different during the arrangement process and requires a completely different train of than the technical aspect of audio engineering. There are few of us that can do both well. This is why a lot of producers will send there tracks off for professional mixing and mastering. Most producers like to focus on creating music, so sending tracks to a pro engineer can be a real time saver for them.
Producer to producer, I've noticed that a lot of us have trouble of letting our projects go into another persons care; and with good reason. We don't want our work to fall into the hands of the amateur with connections. You know who I'm talking about, right? That guy that knows everyone in the business, guarantees to make you famous, and has absolutely no clue as to whats going on. We try to avoid those guys.
But, the truth is that most music makers lack the technical skill to mix what is considered to be the industry standard mix. That's because there is no substitute for time, training, and experience. I've heard songs mixed (with ear buds) by professional engineers that sound better than songs mixed (using 50k dollar studios) by producers.
What's sad is that a lot of producers believe that the world revolves around their last beat and I can hear it in the mix. They'll mix in such a way that their beat will stand out over the lead vocals instead of bringing the best form every recorded track. Then there are the deaf DJ's who stand next to the stack of 15" woofers, without any ear protection, and claim to be able to do everything.
Mixing and mastering should be left to the pros.
Producer to producer, I've noticed that a lot of us have trouble of letting our projects go into another persons care; and with good reason. We don't want our work to fall into the hands of the amateur with connections. You know who I'm talking about, right? That guy that knows everyone in the business, guarantees to make you famous, and has absolutely no clue as to whats going on. We try to avoid those guys.
But, the truth is that most music makers lack the technical skill to mix what is considered to be the industry standard mix. That's because there is no substitute for time, training, and experience. I've heard songs mixed (with ear buds) by professional engineers that sound better than songs mixed (using 50k dollar studios) by producers.
What's sad is that a lot of producers believe that the world revolves around their last beat and I can hear it in the mix. They'll mix in such a way that their beat will stand out over the lead vocals instead of bringing the best form every recorded track. Then there are the deaf DJ's who stand next to the stack of 15" woofers, without any ear protection, and claim to be able to do everything.
Mixing and mastering should be left to the pros.
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Marogru
New member
Big producers maybe mix their tracks but for them selfs, to hear there they are going. Every one of them work with a very good engineer that helps him do it. Actually stronger was mixed by few engineers and they picked the best mix.
I know both sides I'm a mixer and a producer and I know that another mix engineer can hear in my production many more things then me. The baby is always beautiful to its father
When I mix for producers, dialog is very important. Often I get reference mixes with stems. Then I do a 60% mix and show it to the producer, then he can go : "Maro, I need this to be more thinck, the bass more upfront, the sample thinner, vocals oerdriven...etc..." Being a good mix engineer is not about knowing the gear, it would be too easy. Its about taste and music knowledge.
I know both sides I'm a mixer and a producer and I know that another mix engineer can hear in my production many more things then me. The baby is always beautiful to its father
When I mix for producers, dialog is very important. Often I get reference mixes with stems. Then I do a 60% mix and show it to the producer, then he can go : "Maro, I need this to be more thinck, the bass more upfront, the sample thinner, vocals oerdriven...etc..." Being a good mix engineer is not about knowing the gear, it would be too easy. Its about taste and music knowledge.
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oxygenbeats
New member
I feel like now more than in the past a lot of producers mix their own music. I know dudes like illmind and marco polo are engineer's as well as producers, and as a result don't have to rely on others to do their mixes.
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chris carter
New member
Generally speaking, almost ZERO producers mix their own records. It's slightly more common for a rock producer to mix their own record as opposed to a hip-hop producer, because there are a greater number of rock producers that used to be engineers. But it's still very rare. Dr. Dre is one of the few hip-hop producers that mixes some of his own records (not sure if he still does as I haven't bought a physical cd with liner notes in a long time).
Generally speaking, virtually ALL label projects go out to a mix engineer because, quite frankly, it will generally sound considerably better doing it that way. Artists doing self-releases and true indie labels (indie label with indie distribution, which are rare these days) will often do a one-stop shop thing with a producer who also does the tracking AND the mixing. But this is usually because they don't have the money to send it out. However, even this has changed since most mix engineers, even huge guys, have their own private rooms now and can remotely mix for considerably less than using a huge studio. And of course, there are people like me who are very inexpensive mix engineers.
Where things are a little more flexible is when it comes to just beat-making. Most producers mix their own beats because of money. Some huge guys have their own inhouse engineers who will mix their beats for them, but we are talking guys with stupid money. You would be suprised, however, to know that a LOT of producers that crank out beats will send their best ones to a mix engineer to up the chances of the beat getting picked up and to potentially up the price for the beat. It's very competitive out there and you will have an extremely difficult time these days sending out beats that aren't slick and polished - very different than it was 5 or 10 years ago.
Generally speaking, virtually ALL label projects go out to a mix engineer because, quite frankly, it will generally sound considerably better doing it that way. Artists doing self-releases and true indie labels (indie label with indie distribution, which are rare these days) will often do a one-stop shop thing with a producer who also does the tracking AND the mixing. But this is usually because they don't have the money to send it out. However, even this has changed since most mix engineers, even huge guys, have their own private rooms now and can remotely mix for considerably less than using a huge studio. And of course, there are people like me who are very inexpensive mix engineers.
Where things are a little more flexible is when it comes to just beat-making. Most producers mix their own beats because of money. Some huge guys have their own inhouse engineers who will mix their beats for them, but we are talking guys with stupid money. You would be suprised, however, to know that a LOT of producers that crank out beats will send their best ones to a mix engineer to up the chances of the beat getting picked up and to potentially up the price for the beat. It's very competitive out there and you will have an extremely difficult time these days sending out beats that aren't slick and polished - very different than it was 5 or 10 years ago.
jnew
New member
i appreciate it everybody, very informational i learned alot
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WeissSound
Engineer
Generally, in Hip Hop, at least in my experience - there is a great deal of correspondence and usually a rough mix between myself (the engineer) and the producer.
A lot can happen in the mix phase. Sometimes faults or at least eyebrow raisers in the production show up. "Hey DJ X, you don't have any instruments with any sort of high end content - do you want to lay something in, or were you going for that dark sort of feel? I could throw in a tamborine track real fast - you'd be surprised how far one little tamborine smack can take a record."
Communication is key.
A lot can happen in the mix phase. Sometimes faults or at least eyebrow raisers in the production show up. "Hey DJ X, you don't have any instruments with any sort of high end content - do you want to lay something in, or were you going for that dark sort of feel? I could throw in a tamborine track real fast - you'd be surprised how far one little tamborine smack can take a record."
Communication is key.
DJ Spinn
Spinn
I have an argument to make: First off, most of you guys do have good points about producers mixing and not mixing their material. But, ZERO producers mixing their own records??? Maybe in Hip Hop. But certainly true, that in Rock music some, if not most producers mix their own stuff. But in Dance & House music, almost every producer/remixer (who is a DJ), MIX their own stuff. I'm one of those. How the hell am I supposed to produce or remix a track and hand it off to someone, and that particular mix engineer is supposed to know how I want my track to sound, as far as effects, panning, compression, filtering, WHEN to add automation to the filter cutoff and/or resonance, and to what parts, FADE-INS/OUTS, when to reverse a crash cymbal or a kick for effects purposes, how or when to add a splashing reverb effect (with or without a following LFO to (let's say) one particular clap (not the entire clap line), If or when to add a lowpass filter to a kick on the break and add a long decayed reverb to it, etc??? As a DJ, I'm constantly playing music (especially through different sound systems), I know what a finished track is supposed to sound like. And that knowledge also, has come from years of DJ'ing and producing and mixing hands-on, and being in studios (especially in the analog days when almost every single studio had a 2 inch (24-track) tape recorder) HEARING and watching what is being done. There's just so much more, that I can keep going. Even if I tell them (the mix engineer) in detail, granted, yes, it may sound good, but bottom line, it will still never sound exactly how I want it to sound. They are going mix it there way no matter what. Now, if a producer has no idea how to mix, then OBVIOUSLY, that changes everything. AND there are a lot of producers out there who claim they know how to mix, and they don't. Again, in Hip Hop, this might be 100% true and best off. But in Dance music, it is a whole nother ball game. Now when it comes to mastering, that is a completely other ball game. I do not and will never try to master my own tracks. Maybe I'll just add very subtle compression on the master channel with a plugin like the Waves SSL Comp or the Vintage Warmer, but absolutely nothing else. I know this might not be of your taste in music (generally speaking) nor Hip Hop, but as an example, if you follow this link: http://soundcloud.com/djspinn/dj-spinn-i-just-go-2010-new, I have a Progressive Dance track on there, that I produced from scratch for one of my artists and mixed it completely MYSELF. And again, the point I'm trying to make is that if you know what you're doing, then you can do it.
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Beats09
Guest
Dope Thread!
ProducerJC
IndieHost
Yeah, it sounds like you have system that works for you DJ Spinn. A lot of DJ's make great producers, but not all of them. Especially the ones that are constantly exposed to 15" club monitors with loud speaker horns, without any ear protection. Most people don't know that the maximum mixing listening level, for a pro engineer, is 85dB. Most people, in general, don't understand that sound measuring over 85dB can cause hearing loss.
I have a DJ friend that boost the 10-20kHz range so high that it dominates the track. And, even though many of use have told him, the level stays relatively the same. I can tell that he's loosing his hearing in that frequency range. Or probably has tinnitus due failure to wear ear protection. I'd never recommend him for a mix session.
Then you run into the pro engineers that know the physics of frequency, understand the characteristics of how sound, how it travels, and recognize how to use the devices in a natural way so that the interpretation of the result is industry standard. Most people don't know the technical practices of audio engineers. Some producers just want to do what they do best; make beats. Others want to do everything themselves. People can tell the difference between a pro and amateur when listening to music. Fans, crew, and sales are what matters most.
You're right, about most producers wear every hat of the production process and doing everything themselves. But this doesn't mean they should.
I have a DJ friend that boost the 10-20kHz range so high that it dominates the track. And, even though many of use have told him, the level stays relatively the same. I can tell that he's loosing his hearing in that frequency range. Or probably has tinnitus due failure to wear ear protection. I'd never recommend him for a mix session.
Then you run into the pro engineers that know the physics of frequency, understand the characteristics of how sound, how it travels, and recognize how to use the devices in a natural way so that the interpretation of the result is industry standard. Most people don't know the technical practices of audio engineers. Some producers just want to do what they do best; make beats. Others want to do everything themselves. People can tell the difference between a pro and amateur when listening to music. Fans, crew, and sales are what matters most.
You're right, about most producers wear every hat of the production process and doing everything themselves. But this doesn't mean they should.
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