modern day hiphop/ R&B songs composed in a pentatonic scale??

[mrpoppinovski]

Whoa.....you've said some things that I've no idea about like a 12-note pentatonic scale. A 12-note scale is called chromatic. I think that you found a website and was ready to prove yourself and you did, wrong. I answered the question of "what's the difference in using 2 more notes". You took a 2min math course and now you think you know combinatorics. I went school for CompE bud....that's through Partial Differential Equations. So, a scale is 7 notes for MOST POPULAR MUSIC and with that 0 - 7 makes an octal numerical group. Yaknow like octave (why did you think that 12 notes would be called an octave.....because only 8 are useful in the majority of the situations). So 7! combinations I don't care about repeating occurrences of permutations because the point is that the 2 notes cause the producer to miss out on other melody combinations and the more the merrier. Your formula would exclude going down the scale backwards. Did you know that? Sorry bandcoach you aren't on a tangent, but instead the secant. Have a nice day, math whiz! Thanks for the lesson on 12! permutations without duplicates instead of all possible combinations. As the professor woulda said, "There's a difference!"

 

[bandcoach]

again, a BLUES Scale is a Pentatonic with an extra note, lets not act like that's some extra-terrestrial shit because it's not. Used Pentatonics and Dorians WAY MORE in Blues, Jazz, Rock and everything else than I have a "Blues Scale".

guess what? They have "Jazz Scales" too . . . doesn't mean those ******* pop up more than regular Minor/Major Scales or Pentatonics in Jazz music either.

again, the loss of "two notes" ain't shit -- so lets stop acting like "Pentatonics" are useless when they contain more than 3/4's of the notes of a regular scale.

as far as that last line goes, lol thats just elitism.

Let's look at this rationally: examples built on a C starting note for simplicity of presentation

Common forms of the major Pentatonic:
C-D-E-G-A-(C) 1-2-3-5-6-(1)

Single play
[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/pentatonicBlues-01.mp3[/mp3]

Faster multiple plays
[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/pentatonicBlues-06.mp3[/mp3]

C-D-F-G-A-(C) 1-2-4-5-6-(1)

Single play
[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/pentatonicBlues-02.mp3[/mp3]

Faster multiple plays
[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/pentatonicBlues-07.mp3[/mp3]

Interesting thought: if we were to start this on F we would have the same scale form as the original (1-2-3-5-6-(1))

Common forms of the Minor Pentatonic
C-E[sup]b[/sup]-F-G-B[sup]b[/sup]-(C) 1-[sup]b[/sup]3-4-5-[sup]b[/sup]7-(1)

Single play
[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/pentatonicBlues-03.mp3[/mp3]

Faster multiple plays
[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/pentatonicBlues-08.mp3[/mp3]

C-D[sup]b[/sup]-E[sup]b[/sup]-G-A[sup]b[/sup]-(C) 1-[sup]b[/sup]2-[sup]b[/sup]3-5-[sup]b[/sup]6-(1) (common structure found in Balinese minor pentatonics)

Single play
[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/pentatonicBlues-04.mp3[/mp3]

Faster multiple plays
[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/pentatonicBlues-09.mp3[/mp3]

The Blues scale- a minor Hexatonic
C-E[sup]b[/sup]-F-F[sup]#[/sup]/G[sup]b[/sup]-G-B[sup]b[/sup]-(C) 1-[sup]b[/sup]3-4-[sup]#[/sup]4/[sup]b[/sup]5-[sup]b[/sup]7-(1)

Single play
[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/pentatonicBlues-05.mp3[/mp3]

Faster multiple plays
[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/pentatonicBlues-10.mp3[/mp3]

The Blue notes in this scale are the flat 3rd, 5th and 7th

Commonalities between the Blues scale and one of the minor pentatonic forms is that there is a single missing blue note, the [sup]#[/sup]4/[sup]b[/sup]5

Minor Pentatonic	1	[sup]b[/sup]3	4		5	[sup]b[/sup]7	(1)
Blues scale	1	[sup]b[/sup]3	4	[sup]#[/sup]4/[sup]b[/sup]5	5	[sup]b[/sup]7	(1)

Shawty1 I feel your pain lol.

To the op yes pentatonic is main scale used in most urban(african american) music, from gospel to rnb, and quite a bit of rap. You rarely hear the blues scale in modern urban music. I guess we are not that blue anymore

The 1st form of the pentatonic minor I quote was known for sometime as the blues scale, at least in the early history of the blues. Someone innovated and added the [sup]#[/sup]4/[sup]b[/sup]5 to the scale and named it the Blues scale - when I'm teaching this, I make the distinction between original and modern blues scales and illustrate the differences. As far as its use in Urban Music it is still up there with the other scale forms discussed elsewhere in this thread.

 

[mrpoppinovski]

I think you missed the point dude.

 

[bandcoach]

Whoa.....you've said some things that I've no idea about like a 12-note pentatonic scale.

Go back and read it again it says 12 note pentatonic melody - aka a pentatonic melody that has a sequence length of 12 notes. I am sorry that your math brain can't understand the concept..........

It is important to distinguish between the possible permutations/combinations of notes within a scale and how a specific scale can be laid out as a single, unique, melodic sequence of a given length. That is what I demonstrated

A 12-note scale is called chromatic.

if you had bothered to read further down the page you would know that I know that

I think that you found a website and was ready to prove yourself and you did, wrong.

Sorry, wrong....

I answered the question of "what's the difference in using 2 more notes".

No all you did was use a factorial on each note set to show nothing other than your erudition and lack of understanding of how to apply it.

You took a 2min math course and now you think you know combinatorics. I went school for CompE bud....that's through Partial Differential Equations.

Give me a break....., we did partial differentials in high school back in the late 70's

Me, I went to school and did both Software engineering (that's math through set theory/logic/probabilities/number systems etc) as well as composition - separate degrees.

So, a scale is 7 notes for MOST POPULAR MUSIC and with that 0 - 7 makes an octal numerical group. Yaknow like octave (why did you think that 12 notes would be called an octave.....because only 8 are useful in the majority of the situations).

7 note scales are a heptal numerical groups (you do not count the repeated octave note in naming it nor in categorising it)

So 7! combinations I don't care about repeating occurrences of permutations because the point is that the 2 notes cause the producer to miss out on other melody combinations and the more the merrier.

I don't think that my numbers suggest any differently nor does any of my theory writing here at fp

Your formula would exclude going down the scale backwards. Did you know that?

Actually no, that would be a unique sequence, that is accounted for in the combinations

Sorry bandcoach you aren't on a tangent, but instead the secant. Have a nice day, math whiz! Thanks for the lesson on 12! permutations without duplicates instead of all possible combinations. As the professor woulda said, "There's a difference!"

Your knowledge has failed you, because you are trying to treat the scale as an isolated example rather than as a source for any (potentially infinite) length note sequences - that is what a melody is: a sequence of notes from a specific source set of notes. The length of the sequence impacts on the possible unique sequences with repetition that can occur. At one level it really is a simple appliction of Pascal's Triangle as illustrated at The Fabulous Pascal's Triangle. However given that the numbers can get murderously large, it is better to use the calculator I coded this morning to do the math for you

The topic under discussion is do we use the pentatonic scales more than we use the major/minor/modal variants in urban music - the math is irrelevant as far as answering the question concerned, but enlightening as to the potential sequences that can be created for any given melodic length.......

try re-reading my original response to your dissertation in futility to better understand what is being discussed

I think you missed the point dude.

I think you don't know how to read a multi-threaded conversation that may not immediately reference back to the post immediately above it - check my quotes in the post above this comment to see who I was talking to and why