Mastering Vocals and Instrumental..separately or together?

[deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup]

^^^Actually, there's 32 mono/stereo tracks. You can import in stereo.

Specs :

32 simultaneous audio tracks (128 virtual audio tracks), expandable to 48 tracks
Fully integrated MIDI sequencing with 256 simultaneous MIDI tracks

WHAT MORE DO YOU NEED TO MAKE A WHOLE SONG???

 

[noblewordz]

beer and nachos

 

[dvyce]

^^^Actually, there's 32 mono/stereo tracks. You can import in stereo.

a stereo track is comprised of 2 mono tracks linked together in a single track. 32 mono tracks = 16 stereo tracks

a single stereo track uses up 2 voices.

 

[deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup]

^^^I'm aware of that. Now make me aware of why you'd need a stereo track of anything other than a stereo sample or modulated synth with stereo fx. You pan Mono tracks for stereo effect. I assumed you'd use 1 or 2 stereo tracks and have another 28-30 audio tracks left. I must've walked into the hate on pro tools convention of people who can't afford to upgrade to 48 tracks, don't know how to import instruments and control them with the 256 channels of midi, don't understand automation and virtual audio tracks, but keep biching about 2 audio tracks used in stereo. That's better specs than a triton, what's the f**king problem!!!

 

[dvyce]

^^^I'm aware of that. Now make me aware of why you'd need a stereo track of anything other than a stereo sample or modulated synth with stereo fx. You pan Mono tracks for stereo effect. I assumed you'd use 1 or 2 stereo tracks and have another 28-30 audio tracks left. I must've walked into the hate on pro tools convention of people who can't afford to upgrade to 48 tracks, don't know how to import instruments and control them with the 256 channels of midi, don't understand automation and virtual audio tracks, but keep biching about 2 audio tracks used in stereo. That's better specs than a triton, what's the f**king problem!!!

First of all, i am not sure why you are yelling at me.

second, I made previous post because it seemed that you were responding to me where i said "32 mono tracks is 16 stereo tracks" and you said "Actually, there's 32 mono/stereo tracks. You can import in stereo"

third, i never said anything about needing a stereo track for anything other than a stereo source... In fact, I never said anything about why someone would need a stereo track... I just said that if you were talking about stereo tracks that you would have 16 rather than 32.


fourth, I don't see how it is hating on anyone to say "it is not unusual to use more than 32 tracks in a single session"... i did not even say that it happens in every song or even in most songs... I just said it is not so unusual... not so crazy to imagine that someone may need more than 32 tracks for a song.

 

[noblewordz]

That upgrade is expensive as hell, I would rather make the 32 tracks work.

 

[deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup]

First of all, i am not sure why you are yelling at me.

second, I made previous post because it seemed that you were responding to me where i said "32 mono tracks is 16 stereo tracks" and you said "Actually, there's 32 mono/stereo tracks. You can import in stereo"

third, i never said anything about needing a stereo track for anything other than a stereo source... In fact, I never said anything about why someone would need a stereo track... I just said that if you were talking about stereo tracks that you would have 16 rather than 32.


fourth, I don't see how it is hating on anyone to say "it is not unusual to use more than 32 tracks in a single session"... i did not even say that it happens in every song or even in most songs... I just said it is not so unusual... not so crazy to imagine that someone may need more than 32 tracks for a song.

1st, How can type translate to me "yelling at you?" lol

2nd, assuming makes an azz out of you doesn't it?

3rd, you tried to correct me on an irrelevant to the discussion subject that I was already completely aware of. Often on this site, rather than adressing the issue at hand people try to find the most random flaws in your statements. That is annoying.

4th, I never called you a "hater" that word's not in my vocabulary because I don't need to boost my self esteem by making it seem people are envious of anything going on around me.

All I said is if you learn to correctly use Pro Tools, it's more than enough tracks, especially in comparison to the specs of a Motif, Triton, MPC, ect.

Seems like you got issues with yourself that you think I'm targeting, bruh.

That upgrade is expensive as hell, I would rather make the 32 tracks work.

LOL yeah, every PT upgrade is expensive as hell. I just keep the bare minimal for client requests. But I still can't knock the program.

 

[dvyce]

1st, How can type translate to me "yelling at you?" lol

when you say:

what's the f**king problem!!!

I take that as yelling... between the cursing and the multiple exclamation points

2nd, assuming makes an azz out of you doesn't it?

well, I never said i "assumed" anything (regarding that whole "when you assume it makes an ass out of U and me" line)

I responded to something that was directly related to my earlier post

3rd, you tried to correct me on an irrelevant to the discussion subject that I was already completely aware of. Often on this site, rather than adressing the issue at hand people try to find the most random flaws in your statements. That is annoying.

Once again, I was not trying to correct you on any irrelevant topic...

if anything, it looks like you were trying to correct me


...and with regard to the "issue at hand"... the only thing i see being talked aboput for the last 2 pages is "32 tracks this" and "32 tracks that"

4th, I never called you a "hater" that word's not in my vocabulary because I don't need to boost my self esteem by making it seem people are envious of anything going on around me.

here is where you called me a hater:

I must've walked into the hate on pro tools convention of people who can't afford to upgrade to 48 tracks, don't know how to import instruments and control them with the 256 channels of midi, don't understand automation and virtual audio tracks, but keep biching about 2 audio tracks used in stereo.

All I said is if you learn to correctly use Pro Tools, it's more than enough tracks, especially in comparison to the specs of a Motif, Triton, MPC, ect.

I know how to use ProTools correctly...

...and you have no way of knowing what is more than enough tracks for me... you don't even know what type of music i make.


...don't assume

Seems like you got issues with yourself that you think I'm targeting, bruh.

I don't know what you mean when you say that i think that you are targeting...

but I did respond to a post you made directly toward me... directly responding to my post.

LOL yeah, every PT upgrade is expensive as hell. I just keep the bare minimal for client requests. But I still can't knock the program.

yes, the protools upgrades are expensive.




and i just have to say, i really don't know if you have some problem with me or why you would...

But i was just having a friendly discussion

I just mentioned that 32 tracks gets knocked down pretty quick if you need stereo tracks... then you responded... then i responded...


...all seemed friendly to me up to then


i don't know if you thought i was saying something else that i wasn't... but whatever... it is no big deal...

I have no problem with you (I don't know you nor do i have any issue with you)

In fact, I was just about to make a post in another thread complementing you on some good things you were saying there before i got all cought up in this here.

 

[deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup]

To DVyce, I just reread the thread, I apologize, I've been in 3 threads with the same topic of "32 tracks in PT" in the last 24hrs. I can see how you thought my statements were directly towards you, but they were just general statements, I confused this thread with another on the exact same topic called "Cubase vs. PT"

 

[Karl_tone]

48 tracks or 2240 tracks...ufck it to each their own. I personally don't even record individual tracks that aren't vocals or live instuments. That's the beauty of MIDI baby. I got 48 midi tracks, 4 total audio tracks going into two track master using automated mixdowns. Everybody has their individual preference and each has pros and cons. In short, do you...

 

[008]

^^^Quincy jones is also from an analog era. He had to waste a whole track just to emphasise on one word. 32 tracks for a beat???That's way too much in a digital world.

What do you originally make the beats on? Because you can just make it in pro tools and use your 128 virtual audio tracks, or your 256 midi tracks? If you're using FL, Ableton(I believe) or Reason, you can rewire it to one audio track and mix from both PT and your Beatmaking Program.

And if you use automation, the most complex song's vocals can be put into 6-12 audio tracks. If you're using more than 32 tracks, you're limiting yourself, your CPU's drained!

wtf?

In this day and age,
if i cant do whatever i can imagine,musically
on a computer.....

i would violently fix that thing with a hammer.


If you have the trx ,and you use them for your song, its not wasting.
analog or digital

74 trax doesnt even budge my system.
Im not scared to spend 32 trx on a beat if it needs it.

& one of the best things about computer production is,
people like us can have as many trax as we want.....
and not have to bounce em,
and be able to edit individual parts all the way throughout the song
.....so much control.

you dont wanna to go back to 4 trk tape machines dog...

 

[deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup]

I give up. I use FL and SONAR anyway. But I've never needed more than 32 mono(I stressed it)audio tracks and 256 channels of rtas/dxi/vsti's and midi. Guess I'm just not that deep in the game. LOL.

 

[moses]

talking about the track-amount:

here is a typical rock project:

~16 or more drum tracks
~2 bass-amp mics (tracks)
~2-4 guitar mics (tracks)
~2-3 stereo keyboards (4-6 mono tracks)
~5-10 main vocals
~12 or much more backing vocals.

using more than 32 tracks is not unusual, it's normal. it's just a few hiphop and techno guys that need less.



"That upgrade is expensive as hell, I would rather make the 32 tracks work."

hehe, no. simply get another multitrack software. it's cheaper, more flexible, you have an unlimited track amount, 100% glitch free offline rendering, full midi support, better plugin support, elastic audio, full stereo and multichannel support, convertion-hardware independent, ect... ...it's really funny how people still believe digidesigns marketing! pro-toonz is crap, i feel it was never updated since the 80's, the gui looks like windows 95, and still lacks of full stereo support.

 

[noblewordz]

"That upgrade is expensive as hell, I would rather make the 32 tracks work."

hehe, no. simply get another multitrack software. it's cheaper, more flexible, you have an unlimited track amount, 100% glitch free offline rendering, full midi support, better plugin support, elastic audio, full stereo and multichannel support, convertion-hardware independent, ect... ...it's really funny how people still believe digidesigns marketing! pro-toonz is crap, i feel it was never updated since the 80's, the gui looks like windows 95, and still lacks of full stereo support.

Yeah, I don't have PT, but if i did i would never spend that much on an upgrade, its expensive as hell

Adobe Audition 1.5 does the job for me, 128 tracks baby yeaaah

 

[deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup]

talking about the track-amount:

here is a typical rock project:

~16 or more drum tracks
~2 bass-amp mics (tracks)
~2-4 guitar mics (tracks)
~2-3 stereo keyboards (4-6 mono tracks)
~5-10 main vocals
~12 or much more backing vocals.

using more than 32 tracks is not unusual, it's normal. it's just a few hiphop and techno guys that need less.



"That upgrade is expensive as hell, I would rather make the 32 tracks work."

hehe, no. simply get another multitrack software. it's cheaper, more flexible, you have an unlimited track amount, 100% glitch free offline rendering, full midi support, better plugin support, elastic audio, full stereo and multichannel support, convertion-hardware independent, ect... ...it's really funny how people still believe digidesigns marketing! pro-toonz is crap, i feel it was never updated since the 80's, the gui looks like windows 95, and still lacks of full stereo support.

I would agree, but let's use common sense here. What rock band is recording thru an M-Audio Interface, M-Box or Digi002 even? Pro Tools LE isn't for your genre in the 1st place. We're talking about a BEAT. Not 16 audio tracks of Drums. And if you've got a studio to fit a live band or orchestra, you've got to be a moron to be running it off of LE. That's when you're leaving the realms of homestudio and entering the realms of pro studio. Homestudio = LE Pro Studio = HD.

I hate that I always end up on the side of Pro Tools in these debates. Especially being that I use SONAR. But you guys just go on these anti Pro Tools campaigns and babble the biggest bunch of nonsesnse.

 

[moses]

I would agree, but let's use common sense here. What rock band is recording thru an M-Audio Interface, M-Box or Digi002 even? Pro Tools LE isn't for your genre in the 1st place. We're talking about a BEAT. Not 16 audio tracks of Drums. And if you've got a studio to fit a live band or orchestra, you've got to be a moron to be running it off of LE. That's when you're leaving the realms of homestudio and entering the realms of pro studio.

well, many rock band actually use 8 track recording interfaces. you don't have to record all tracks at the same time or put a full orchestra in your studio (is it really something new to you?). even hiphop production use a similar amount of tracks, even with the beat approach:

-rythmic stuff stereo track (or more if it's serious)
-bassline track mono track
-melodic stuff, let's say 2 stereo tracks (or much more if it isn't just a "preview production")
-main rap mono track (although i always have variations of it)
-addlibs 4-8 mono tracks (usually more to be flexible in the mix)
-main singer mono track (or more)
-singer backing/layering vocals (10 tracks or even much more in current high end productions)

no serious mixing engineer (even if it's one of dre's engineers) would use a stereo file containing the whole "beat" during mixing. he will ask for as many individual tracks as possible.

 

[deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup]

well, many rock band actually use 8 track recording interfaces. you don't have to record all tracks at the same time or put a full orchestra in your studio (is it really something new to you?). even hiphop production use a similar amount of tracks, even with the beat approach:

-rythmic stuff stereo track (or more if it's serious)
-bassline track mono track
-melodic stuff, let's say 2 stereo tracks (or much more if it isn't just a "preview production")
-main rap mono track (although i always have variations of it)
-addlibs 4-8 mono tracks (usually more to be flexible in the mix)
-main singer mono track (or more)
-singer backing/layering vocals (10 tracks or even much more in current high end productions)

no serious mixing engineer (even if it's one of dre's engineers) would use a stereo file containing the whole "beat" during mixing. he will ask for as many individual tracks as possible.

Now you're talking nonsense and contradicting yourself. If you use an 8 track recording interface then 32 tracks is more than enough(if you know what you're doing). You're not recording by pro standards anyway, so why are you complaining?

I'm done with this, you guys continue to rant what you know nothing about. Thanks to Automation, 256 tracks of midi, and virtual tracks, you don't need all this crap you guys are talking, and I do tracks for major artists. They take Stereo tracks of beats all the time. I'm also an engineer, so I know how to fix a bad stereo track beat. I take what I'm given and make it sound pro.

I also know how to properly mix a beat down to stereo tracks or mix directly from hardware into a stereo track while making a song.

If you're such amateurs that all you know is transferring seperate audio tracks into a sequencer, use what you use, 95% of the industry uses pro tools, whether HD or LE, period, so they make that sh*t work.

I'm done trying to tell you guys anything, this is where I pull out my dic.

I been in the studio with timbo, nottz, yukmouth, wyclef, mobb deep, mr.cheeks, sean price, numerous others, too many to name. Right in front the boards while they did their thing, most of them use LE systems, so they're dealing with 32 tracks too. So tell me again who you seen do otherwise?

 

[codexlf]

Well last I checked the guy said he was making beats, not recording full rock band projects with overdubs, or a studio orchestra. If you can't fit a beat in 32 tracks, something is usually wrong. I've used about half that for plenty of beats, and if you get into extreme cases where you need a couple more (which again, normally doesn't happen when it comes to beats), it's usually simple enough to bounce part of the song/vocals to a stem or mini-stem so you can go on mixing with the 32.

 

[noblewordz]

I been in the studio with timbo, nottz, yukmouth, wyclef, mobb deep, mr.cheeks, sean price, numerous others, too many to name. Right in front the boards while they did their thing, most of them use LE systems, so they're dealing with 32 tracks too. So tell me again who you seen do otherwise?

Aww man thats my dream.

 

[deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup]

FP Disclaimer :

I hate I always have to put that I deal with major artists in statements for weighing power, but it's amazing how many people tell me what pro's are doing when I've seen what pro's are using. I'm not trying to say that I'm doing anything big, or I'm better than anyone, we're all future producers, it's just amazing to me how many people keep these urban legends of music adrift.

You can tell when you listen to a G-Unit or Dipset album that most of the beats were mixed down by the producer(amateur mixes in most cases)and later cleaned up in the mastering process. It's even noticeable on Jay-Z's black album. If you've got an engineering ear, you know what I'm talking about.