Dynamics

Crowley6595

New member
Hi guys,

I was just wondering if anyone has any tips on how to reduce dynamic range without the use of compression/limiting!
Are there even other ways? I just feel the RMS on my track is slightly too low compared to my peaks and I don't want to destroy it by over-compressing/over-limiting it.

All help is appreciated and many thanks in advance!
 
I'm sure there's going to be people with better advice than I have, but I was thinking that envelopes to further sculpt the sound can address this. Whether that be the ADSR envelopes on a specific drum sound/programmed loop, or automated envelopes within the tracks of the DAW. You can usually create envelopes on each individual track (or sound within each track) so that you have more control over the response of the sound(s) of each track. I think this is how I would approach it, at first.

I think you can also achieve this with some of the psychoacoustic plugins that allow you to further sculpt the perception of certain frequency ranges? These would include sonic maximizers, exciters, sub enhancers.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but can't you also control this by riding the volume fader on the track of whatever you are attempting to lower the dynamic range in?

Are you looking to reduce the dynamic range of an entire project/track or a specific sound?
 
I'm sure there's going to be people with better advice than I have, but I was thinking that envelopes to further sculpt the sound can address this. Whether that be the ADSR envelopes on a specific drum sound/programmed loop, or automated envelopes within the tracks of the DAW. You can usually create envelopes on each individual track (or sound within each track) so that you have more control over the response of the sound(s) of each track. I think this is how I would approach it, at first.

I think you can also achieve this with some of the psychoacoustic plugins that allow you to further sculpt the perception of certain frequency ranges? These would include sonic maximizers, exciters, sub enhancers.

Someone please correct me if I am wrong, but can't you also control this by riding the volume fader on the track of whatever you are attempting to lower the dynamic range in?

Are you looking to reduce the dynamic range of an entire project/track or a specific sound?

Hi,

First of all, thanks a million for the reply. It is my whole track/project I'm looking to reduce dynamic range on, before the mastering stage.

I think an exciter will work really so I'll definitely try that.

However I don't understand how sculpting ASDR envelopes will help. I have already sculpted them in a way that sounds good and sits well in the mix so surely further sculpting will take them out of balance?

I also see a lot of people who say envelope automation is generally very positive for a mix and while I have used it up to my drop, I just can't see any room for it in the drop which is obviously the busiest part of the mix and has the highest dynamic range. Any tips here?

I don't understand what you mean by 'rising' the volume fader.

Thanks a million again for the advice!
 
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Hi guys,

I was just wondering if anyone has any tips on how to reduce dynamic range without the use of compression/limiting!
Are there even other ways? I just feel the RMS on my track is slightly too low compared to my peaks and I don't want to destroy it by over-compressing/over-limiting it.

All help is appreciated and many thanks in advance!

The issue is not only one about dynamics in this case, it is rather about what is the amount of information left after you have placed your mix in a desired integrated LUFS/RMS/fundamental frequency sweet spot, the better the monitoring the closer you naturally get to this sweet spot, but you can use various techniques also to help achieve it. So in other words, it is about the amount of information present in the signal on all tracks before the RMS increase is performed. Then when you increase the RMS, you need to ensure that all compressors act on the content differently and at different times, so that you do not get 90% of the RMS increase through peak reduction. In other words do not make the peak limiters hit the content too hard.
 
The issue is not only one about dynamics in this case, it is rather about what is the amount of information left after you have placed your mix in a desired integrated LUFS/RMS/fundamental frequency sweet spot, the better the monitoring the closer you naturally get to this sweet spot, but you can use various techniques also to help achieve it.

My question was supposed to sound more along the lines of tips for getting my mix into the desired integrated LUFS/RMS/fundamental frequency sweet spot. My conundrum is that I have my mix sounding the way I want with each track having presence and sitting well in the mix with enough headroom for mastering. Unfortunately, I still feel that my RMS should be around 2/3 dBFS higher before I master to prevent over-limiting over-compressing there.

I was looking for tips/techniques for this.

Thank you for the reply though, I'm still learning lots about music production and every insight helps!
 
My question was supposed to sound more along the lines of tips for getting my mix into the desired integrated LUFS/RMS/fundamental frequency sweet spot. My conundrum is that I have my mix sounding the way I want with each track having presence and sitting well in the mix with enough headroom for mastering. Unfortunately, I still feel that my RMS should be around 2/3 dBFS higher before I master to prevent over-limiting over-compressing there.

I was looking for tips/techniques for this.

Thank you for the reply though, I'm still learning lots about music production and every insight helps!

When you have a mix with a certain RMS and peak content you may or may not be in a position that you can gain all input tracks in the whole project a little or 50% on each side of the compressors, to achieve these extra dBs. The issue is most commonly though that the mix signal is at this point already rather fatigued by peak reduction, which means that when you push the mix even more it will simply become numb. This particular issue is most commonly due to wrong compression on the input track level earlier on.

So, the issue is wrong use of compression on the first compression stage. So for instance the vocals might need a FET compressor first that deals with the very dynamic issues as little as possible but much enough, a Tube compressor afterwards that rounds off the remaining transients (the louder the transients are the harder the compression, because the ratio increases with gain reduction) and some RMS based compression afterwards (opto type) that ensures it does not jump around too much in RMS. So this is 3 different types of compression FET, Tube, Opto on a single sound source that effectively deals with the dynamics. When you with very good accuracy apply the compression on all sound sources tailored around the dynamic issues in the first stage, you have a mix that has a very good signal and RMS level on each track in the first stage of compression. So that means with this type of compression quality at the very core of the content, you can now bring up the RMS levels by adding additional stages of compression, for instance side-chained compression, parallel compression (incl. two stage compression), multiband compression and some rather gentle peak limiting at the end. The combination gives you a full waveform with the right loudness and dynamic characteristics.

So the art of compression is to a great extent about applying the right types of compression in the right order on the tracks early enough. Different sound sources vary in their dynamic characteristics, vocals for instance can jump around in their dynamics quite a lot and hence need to be very well controlled with compression. It is also important that the various compressor types act on the content in the right dosages, for instance you do not want mostly fast compression of the content, because that means the mix becomes hard in the punch. Instead you want more of Tube type compression that softens the sound sources a lot, which means the mix becomes softer also. And then you want also the FET compression that kind of stabilizes the dynamics, so that they are easier to control with other types of compressors afterwards.

The overall issue is hence that when the dynamics are not treated according to what is necessary to create certain dynamic characteristics, then later on when you deal with more mix level compression you might face some issues when you are applying additional compression. That is why the first stage of compression is the most important.

So bring up the RMS levels by having compressors act on the content at different times in different ways. In this way the waveform is not as much altered, so it becomes a more natural and more smooth type of compression.
 
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I don't understand what you mean by 'rising' the volume fader.

I meant to say "riding" the volume fader. It's just an old technique where you respond to the mix by change the volume, over time, keeping your hand on the volume fader/slider, changing it as desired throughout the track. It doesn't work as well in a digital environment where there are tools (vst, plugins) that respond much quicker and accurate than a human response (so I am told by an engineering friend). I've seen people using this technique with mixing on analog equipment though.

DarkRed just dropped wayyy more knowledge than I could have expressed and I think you would be well learned after employing some of his advice.
 
I meant to say "riding" the volume fader. It's just an old technique where you respond to the mix by change the volume, over time, keeping your hand on the volume fader/slider, changing it as desired throughout the track. It doesn't work as well in a digital environment where there are tools (vst, plugins) that respond much quicker and accurate than a human response (so I am told by an engineering friend). I've seen people using this technique with mixing on analog equipment though.

DarkRed just dropped wayyy more knowledge than I could have expressed and I think you would be well learned after employing some of his advice.

Yeah thank you guys both so much for the info. It is very much appreciated!!
 
really you have to automate the EQ and volume. You can reserve a frequency range specifically for certain things, bring up bass volume, reduce kick, side chainin isnt bad though, just learn to round off the volume clipping, variate attack, decay, threshold, etc....
 
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