Question on using the Shure SM58 for recording rap vocals

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tuneitdown

New member
Hey guys not sure if this is the right subreddit to be asking this but since i couldn't find anything else I just went for it.
So when I record my rap vocals on the Shure SM58 it has this very closed off/deep feel to the recording even though I'm real up close to the mic. I'm not quite sure what's missing but it just doesn't feel like it has that professional sounding effect on it. Should I try for a condenser mic, is it worth it? I use a Behringer Xenyx 302 USB for a preamp. Does anyone have any recommendations on the ''proper'' way to use an SM58 for a rapper? Should I get a better pre-amp and if so any recommendations (low budget, but I can spend money for a scarlet if that's whats necessary)?


I'm just trying to maximize sound quality within the home studio.


Thanks!
 
audio is always a good guide for us

however, if you are getting a somewhat boomy/bassy sound and you are up close to the mic then this is to be expected as your are utilising the proximity effect that sm58s are known for when sung or spoken into close up

A good way of getting a decent separation distance is to put your right hand in front of your face with fingers extended up and your thumb extended towards your mouth (as near to 90[sup]o[/sup] angle between fingers and thumb) - the mic should then be placed so that it sits on the other side of you hand at the top third of your palm. Get a pop filter and place that at the point where your index finger would be in the above positioning strategy; this will ensure that yuo maintain your distance from the mic; you may need to bump your input gain a fraction up (possible 1-2db) to have the same levels going in but otherwise this should work.
 
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Also, the "deep feel" probably is what's known as the "proximity effect" - emphazised lows when very close to the mic.
 
Just back up off the mic a bit. SM58's can take a lot of noise. Use the room to your advantage. But, since it's a directional mic, make sure you're singing in the direction it is placed. Otherwise, just back off a tad and try again, adding a pop filter. SM58's sound perfectly fine to record vocals on -- I saw a video of Juicy J and Wiz Khalifa in their tour bus recording some mixtape w an sm58 and a sock on it. It gets the job done, for sure.
 
bandcoach said:
audio is always a good guide for us

however, if you are getting a somewhat boomy/bassy sound and you are up close to the mic then this is to be expected as your are utilising the proximity effect that sm58s are known for when sung or spoken into close up

A good way of getting a decent separation distance is to put your right hand in front of your face with fingers extended up and your thumb extended towards your mouth (as near to 90[SUP]o[/SUP] angle between fingers and thumb) - the mic should then be placed so that it sits on the other side of you hand at the top third of your palm. Get a pop filter and place that at the point where your index finger would be in the above positioning strategy; this will ensure that yuo maintain your distance from the mic; you may need to bump your input gain a fraction up (possible 1-2db) to have the same levels going in but otherwise this should work.
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Awesome thank you guys! I'll try doing that. Does anyone think that I need a better pre-amp by the way? I bought the Behringer for $50, it really gets the job done but Im not sure if it's limited the sound quality of the mic. Thanks!
 
I think you'd be surprised what you can get out of that mic. Two people mentioned the proximity effect, which sounds exactly like what you described. Two additional things:

1) I don't know how you record, but picking a distance from the mic and staying there is critical. When rapping, if you move your head half an inch back, forward, left or right; It's a huge difference. Keeping your head still will make a nice, consistent performance. Alternatively, if you are having trouble staying still, multiband compression can help keep frequencies consistent. You'll get big low mids real close to the mic. When you back off the first inch or two and the low mids die down, the sound is relatively brighter, but truly you will have less high end the more you back up (at least, that's my understanding). You can multiband compress this accordingly.

2) Experiment with mic placement. Seriously, go nuts. Find a track with the kind of vocal you're looking for, and just put your mic in different places at different angles. Put it pointing dead at your mouth, put it above pointing down, put it below pointing up, put it above pointing straight, put it in all kinds of places offset to the left or right, Put it under different parts of the ceiling and in different relations to the room dimensions. Mic placement is the best eq.
 
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tuneitdown said:
Awesome thank you guys! I'll try doing that. Does anyone think that I need a better pre-amp by the way? I bought the Behringer for $50, it really gets the job done but Im not sure if it's limited the sound quality of the mic. Thanks!
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I would certainly look at a better pre-amp for the longer term - however you need to set your budget with a few things in mid

1) what mic(s) will be using the pre-amp?
2) will I need to use phantom power for any of these mics (note that you never want phantom power going to a ribbon mic and whilst dynamic mics (like the sm58) can cope with phantom power it is safer not to have it sent to them also)
3) what input converters will you be using? - no point in getting a high end pre-amp if the converters are not great and vice versa
 
crimsonhawk47 said:
I think you'd be surprised what you can get out of that mic. Two people mentioned the proximity effect, which sounds exactly like what you described. Two additional things:

1) I don't know how you record, but picking a distance from the mic and staying there is critical. When rapping, if you move your head half an inch back, forward, left or right; It's a huge difference. Keeping your head still will make a nice, consistent performance. Alternatively, if you are having trouble staying still, multiband compression can help keep frequencies consistent. You'll get big low mids real close to the mic. When you back off the first inch or two and the low mids die down, the sound is relatively brighter, but truly you will have less high end the more you back up (at least, that's my understanding). You can multiband compress this accordingly.

2) Experiment with mic placement. Seriously, go nuts. Find a track with the kind of vocal you're looking for, and just put your mic in different places at different angles. Put it pointing dead at your mouth, put it above pointing down, put it below pointing up, put it above pointing straight, put it in all kinds of places offset to the left or right, Put it under different parts of the ceiling and in different relations to the room dimensions. Mic placement is the best eq.
Click to expand...

Great tips! I'll try experimenting with different mic positions, never thought of that, thanks!
 
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bandcoach said:
I would certainly look at a better pre-amp for the longer term - however you need to set your budget with a few things in mid

1) what mic(s) will be using the pre-amp?
2) will I need to use phantom power for any of these mics (note that you never want phantom power going to a ribbon mic and whilst dynamic mics (like the sm58) can cope with phantom power it is safer not to have it sent to them also)
3) what input converters will you be using? - no point in getting a high end pre-amp if the converters are not great and vice versa
Click to expand...

I'll be using the SM58, it seems to be a very good mic from everything I've read about it. When I researched phantom power the general consensus was that it was meant more for condenser mics, so I think I'll leave it out of the equation for now. I checked out what input converters are (I didn't know they were part of the setup too) and from what I understand they are called DACs and they convert sound into analog, and the better ones make a big different in the sound quality.

What DAC do you recommend I use along with a good pre-amp to bring out the best quality from the SM58? My budget is $500. Of course my motto is always to get the best quality using the cheapest option available lol but if I can bring out a noticeably better quality from the mic, I'll put money down.

Thanks!
 
Idk much about DAC's but incase you get impatient, try to hold off until you get a good answer on that. My understanding is an interface is fine and converters are not something you should be worried about right now.

Coinsider that you might be losing the option for condensers with no phantom power. Dynamic mics are great for rap, but so are condenders depending on the voice, and maybe you want a friend to sing at one point? But they might also sound good on an sm58

Every voice is different, some people sound subjectively bad on some mics. Try to focus on what can capture the emotion and, more importantly, delivering the emotion. If people feel that, they could care less if your vocals don't sound Crisp or sexy.
 
crimsonhawk47 said:
Idk much about DAC's but incase you get impatient, try to hold off until you get a good answer on that. My understanding is an interface is fine and converters are not something you should be worried about right now.

Coinsider that you might be losing the option for condensers with no phantom power. Dynamic mics are great for rap, but so are condenders depending on the voice, and maybe you want a friend to sing at one point? But they might also sound good on an sm58

Every voice is different, some people sound subjectively bad on some mics. Try to focus on what can capture the emotion and, more importantly, delivering the emotion. If people feel that, they could care less if your vocals don't sound Crisp or sexy.
Click to expand...

Awesome thanks man! I'll hold off on any big investments for now and just focus on getting better. I appriciate it
 
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