The Verdict is in: Online Beat selling Producers lose. (Must read)

  • Thread starter Thread starter SFTRAXX
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SFTRAXX

SFTRAXX

West Coast Rap Producer
As some of you may remember a while back I posted a thread discussing chargebacks, PayPal and alternative means of collecting payment.

When I posted that thread I was going through an unfortunate chargeback scenario in which an individual made a purchase, used the music, (see video below) and 4-5 months later disputed the purchase.




Well the verdict is in and Here's the update to my case:

When all was said and done I lost the dispute.
Additionally, Paypal claimed it would "fight" the decision on my behalf but I still lost.
The payment ultimately went back to the buyer.

Even though I felt that my case was compelling and I had enough evidence to win...no dice.

So to all producers, beatmakers, or anybody selling digital goods online do yourself a favor and keep all documentation.

And above all, use common sense. If the transaction seems faulty [eg: the buyers name or info seems shady like it could be fake] do yourself a favor and try to contract the buyer. If some time has past and they haven't responded, refund the payment.

All money ain't good money and hanging on to it now could cost you more in the future.

Good luck out there.
 
That sucks man, sorry to hear you lost out on your hard work

There are always people out there who won't bat an eyelid at putting another human being in a difficult situation

However karma will usually come knocking at some point, and they'll be put in their place
 
jbaptist said:
That sucks man, sorry to hear you lost out on your hard work

There are always people out there who won't bat an eyelid at putting another human being in a difficult situation

However karma will usually come knocking at some point, and they'll be put in their place
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No worries.

It stung at first but I've since moved on.

I just want cats to be cautious and 'watch for the signs' so they can see it coming and avoid one of these scenarios.
 
So what's the lesson here?
Surely there must be a better way than to be paranoid about your customers and chargebacks. I read somewhere that you could lay out your contract so that the buyer pays for your SERVICE not for the beat.
After this experience have you made any change in your business model which protects you from such behaviour? I'm kinda defiant on accepting business conditions marked by uncertainty.
 
The lesson here is that if you sell digital goods online there is risk and uncertainty involved.

Since You can't control where payments come from, or who they come from (until after the fact) the best thing you can try and do is cover your bases by watching your transactions and engaging more with your buyers.

Regarding your contract: you can lay out your contract out however you want but it ain't worth sh*t if the person on the other end is claiming they never bought anything from you. (Which is essentially what they do in these scenarios) They tell their cc company: " hey, I never made that transaction". The cc company takes their word for it and contacts PayPal and says the purchase was unauthorized and just like that *poof* money gone...
 
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Stop selling beats online!!!

I see people working harder to make a nickel selling beats online than they do working at a job for a dollar. Do people think they will "become popular or rich from selling beats to random buyers online? A few will. The majority will not. It is a loser's game.


 
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Desire Inspires said:
Stop selling beats online!!!
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I wish it were that easy.

For people like myself who have seen significant results from doing business online - it is not an option.

Desire Inspires said:
I see people working harder to make a nickel selling beats online than they do working at a job for a dollar. Do people think they will "become popular or rich from selling beats to random buyers online? A few will. The majority will not. It is a loser's game.
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I agree with you there. To see consistent results, it is hard, and at times you do work harder then most but IMO its worth it if the numbers add up. It only becomes a losers game if you approach it with an unrealistic (lottery ticket) mindset.


Desire Inspires said:
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Not to bash that cat in the video (because he seems like a cool dude trying to help cats out ) but he really didn't explain "how to sell beats online the safe way".
He basically reiterated the same things I've said about keeping proof and being cautious when using PayPal and doing business online.

Here's the bottom line.

Alot of people doing 'music business online' would not be in business without the 'online' part of the equation so you just gotta take the good with the bad if you want to play the game.

I think the best thing you can do for yourself when using PayPal is to contact the buyer directly (immediately after the purchase was made) through the email address/info that the payment came from and discuss the transaction. This way if the payment is faulty you will know immediately or if it gets disputed in the future you have proof that you talked to the individual with the Paypal account and that you sent your goods or service and they received it.
 
Playing Devils Advocate here.... In a way, you're making a case for the benefit of 3rd-party sites like SoundClick and GotInstrumentals. There are disadvantages to using those sites, but an advantage is that buyers would have a hard time asking for a refund 4 months with those companies' legal agreement in place.
 
IPM Music said:
Playing Devils Advocate here.... In a way, you're making a case for the benefit of 3rd-party sites like SoundClick and GotInstrumentals. There are disadvantages to using those sites, but an advantage is that buyers would have a hard time asking for a refund 4 months with those companies' legal agreement in place.
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I thought about that. (Well, at least with SC.)

But since:

1. your music is not safe on soundclick (people can jack your music there easily)
2. SC they can ban you and suspend your business for whatever reason they want
3. Using their store there is a $20 cap on your prices

and a number of other reasons I am willing to deal with the small amount of chargebacks that come though.
 
How much do you have to give up to SC for one song when having used their store? Can somebody give me an example with an example price for a song?
 
ftxn said:
How much do you have to give up to SC for one song when having used their store? Can somebody give me an example with an example price for a song?
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I believe its 10%.
 
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