Panning, Stereo Windener, Dimension Expander...what is the difference?

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maximedupre

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Is it all the same thing (making the sound go the the extremities of the speakers, rather than in the center )? And when I say panning, I mean hard panning, like duplicating a sample on 2 different tracks and panning them to the opposite extremities.
 
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my google search was algorithm for stereo widener which gave a page of results some of which were obviously ads for individual products, some of which were targeted at explaining - the dsp archive is a great tool for those who are starting out on the road to creating their own code and vsts
 
bandcoach said:
some reading for your education

Processing Stereo Audio Files

How to Boost Your Audio's Stereo Image

Mixing Secrets For The Small Studio: Additional Resources (Cambridge Music Technology)

http://www.musicdsp.org/archive.php?classid=4#173 and the following two articles/posts if you want to start understanding the math behind the processes
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I have read parts of those links and some other links, but I can't get a fix idea on all those terms (stereo imaging, stereo enhancement, stereo wideness, dimension expander...). I think they probably all mean the same thing. But how do they differ from panning?

Stereo enhancement might be the fact that not every sounds are in the middle of the speakers, some are at the outer extremety. Can this be done by duplicating two tracks and panning them hard left and hard right? For one track, this would make the sound go all on speaker left or right, but is that enough to go to the extremeties of one speakers? For example, the side of speaker left? Is it enough to create stereo enhancement? If it is and that it is that simple, why are there some stereo enhancement/widener/expander vsts? I guess panning is not enough to create a stereo enhancement.

I think stereo imaging is the fact that some sounds seem farther away than some other sound. Or is it the fact that the same sound on speakers left or right have some particularities? For example, the sound on the right speaker could be delayed for a short amount of time or whatever makes it a bit different than the sound on speaker left.

Also, what is panning compared to all of these concepts? I know it can be used to make a sound pop out in a mix, but how does it relate to stereo enhancement/imaging/windeness///////////?
 
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maximedupre said:
I have read parts of those links and some other links, but I can't get a fix idea on all those terms (stereo imaging, stereo enhancement, stereo wideness, dimension expander...). I think they probably all mean the same thing. But how do they differ from panning?

Stereo enhancement might be the fact that not every sounds are in the middle of the speakers, some are at the outer extremety. Can this be done by duplicating two tracks and panning them hard left and hard right? For one track, this would make the sound go all on speaker left or right, but is that enough to go to the extremeties of one speakers? For example, the side of speaker left? Is it enough to create stereo enhancement? If it is and that it is that simple, why are there some stereo enhancement/widener/expander vsts? I guess panning is not enough to create a stereo enhancement.

I think stereo imaging is the fact that some sounds seem farther away than some other sound. Or is it the fact that the same sound on speakers left or right have some particularities? For example, the sound on the right speaker could be delayed for a short amount of time or whatever makes it a bit different than the sound on speaker left.

Also, what is panning compared to all of these concepts? I know it can be used to make a sound pop out in a mix, but how does it relate to stereo enhancement/imaging/windeness///////////?
Click to expand...

let's take these in order of ease of understanding

Panning - a panorama or pan circuit in a daw or piece of hardware directs the signal to two paths; in the center it directs equal amounts of the signal to each path; at any other position the signal is split in a ratio that reflects the position of the sound across the two paths. The two targets can be a stereo channel pair Left-Right in any master or group section in your daw/hardware device.

Where panning differs from simple balance controls (what most of experience in using domestic hi-fi gear) is that the center point is designed to produce a signal level that is either -3db - -6db down from the side signal strength (to compensate for center summing boosts) or provides a gradually tapered boost of +3db - +6db to the target side channel as the control is turned left or right - see this for more Panning Laws Revealed - Harmony Central

stereo imaging is the design of your mix so that different elements are placed in different positions within the stereo panorama

stereo enhancement is the application of tools such as delay, reverb, eq to give different sides of the stereo signal unique features to maker the sound more prominent in one channel or the other

stereo widening or dimensioning comes from the extreme application of delays, phase shifting and reverb to individual signal sources to place them in one channel or the other
 
bandcoach said:
let's take these in order of ease of understanding

Panning - a panorama or pan circuit in a daw or piece of hardware directs the signal to two paths; in the center it directs equal amounts of the signal to each path; at any other position the signal is split in a ratio that reflects the position of the sound across the two paths. The two targets can be a stereo channel pair Left-Right in any master or group section in your daw/hardware device.

Where panning differs from simple balance controls (what most of experience in using domestic hi-fi gear) is that the center point is designed to produce a signal level that is either -3db - -6db down from the side signal strength (to compensate for center summing boosts) or provides a gradually tapered boost of +3db - +6db to the target side channel as the control is turned left or right - see this for more Panning Laws Revealed - Harmony Central

stereo imaging is the design of your mix so that different elements are placed in different positions within the stereo panorama

stereo enhancement is the application of tools such as delay, reverb, eq to give different sides of the stereo signal unique features to maker the sound more prominent in one channel or the other

stereo widening or dimensioning comes from the extreme application of delays, phase shifting and reverb to individual signal sources to place them in one channel or the other
Click to expand...

I found this image on google: XTrim_Panning.webp

If it is a good representation: panning is to give a position to a certain sound in the stereo field and width is how much space it takes in this stereo field. I don't quite understand how the width can exceed the stereo field though (maybe everything that exceeds the stereo field becomes inaudible) (image 4).

So is panning a way to do stereo imaging, since it can place elements in different positions within the stereo panorama? Is it the only way to do some stereo image?

Also I guess stereo widening is a word to represent "width" on this image. So you are saying that to make a sound wider I should use extreme application of delays, phase shifting and reverb? It does not seem clear to me yet how these effects can widen the sound.
 
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