How to gain stage your mic pre and interface

ChaChaBeats said:
Hey Morning star, do you think it's worth just buying the $30 tube or saving up and getting the BlueBird mic and the Presonus Blue Tube Preamp like you recommended?
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That's a good question because that combo sounds so good together. If I wasn't planing on upgrading for a long time I would go with the Bluebird and Bluetube. But for people that already have a mic like the AT2020 or something like that, the ART Tube MP Studio is a great upgrade choice for cheap. I don't even understand how they build it that cheap.
 
Morning_Star said:
This is a quick run down of setting up your mic and mic pre to properly work with your interface to get the highest quality and best recording. I'm posting this because I see so many problems with this.

If you are using Sonar, Cubase, Nuendo, Reaper or FL Studio to record vocals first go here and download PSP vintage meter. There is even a AU version for mac.

http://www.pspaudioware.com/plugins/vmeter.html

If you are using ProTools then you can use the stock BF Meter Bridge.

Now load up your recording software and create a new audio track to record to. Make sure the gain on your mic pre is turned all the way down. (Remember that if you are using an external mic pre that the output needs to go to line in of the audio interface and not the mic input.)

Next make sure that the fader for your channel for recording vocals is at 0db. Now load the PSP Vintage Meter in the first slot. (BF Meter Bridge if using ProTools). Now click on the PSP logo on the plug-in to view the back. Make sure you change the 0vu refer level to -18dbFS. Now click the label to view the front again and make sure that the meter is on VU with the switch in the middle.

(for protools make sure the meter is set with the -18db button pressed in and the switch on peak)

Now while doing a mic check raise the gain knob of the mic pre until the PSP vintage meter reads close to 0db but never over. (BF Meter Bridge for ProTools) Leave it there for your vocal recording. If you change vocalist adjust the gain on the mic pre until you get the same signal in the meter. Enjoy clean vocals. If using a compressor make sure it's bypassed for this tutorial.
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I agree with everyone else that this was a very informative post! Too bad I don't have my Presonus TubePre anymore! it sucks because I would've loved to corrected my error to which I didn't know or understand at the time. I always thought something was wrong with my $100 pre or my Fast Track Pro when it was because I was preamping twice by accident! I would dial my TubePre -><-Fast Track Pro A/D->DAW. So basically I have like 30 sessions that are all screwed up because nobody explained this and I had no idea. So picture my TubePre gained at like 11'oclock, Drive at 9'oclock, and Mic Input XLR knob driven to like 7'oclock. Even then it wouldn't clip but my recordings would come out extremely harsh and scratchy and it would drive me nuts when trying to compress, EQ, and use reverb later on top of the fact the ST55 Condenser mic was recorded in an untreated room at the time!! I know....Disasterous!!

But to clarify, some Preams like the TubePre I had at the time came with a VU meter on it's casing. Now I understand that I was supposed to output from the Preamp to the Insert of the Fast Track Pro but would I will need to use the VU plugin in Cubase/DAW if the Preamp already has one?
 
No, not if you fully understand gain staging. But when using a piece of gear with output gain then this is a good way to make sure you don't clip.
 
Morning_Star said:
No, not if you fully understand gain staging. But when using a piece of gear with output gain then this is a good way to make sure you don't clip.
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Well this is why I'm asking just so I can fully understand. So for those who have a VU meter with their preamp you can safely stage gain into your Audio Interface without using the plugin. But, if your preamp doesn't then this is an alternative way to basically do the same thing?
 
This didn't work for me... I added the Meter Bridge as an insert. I turned my gain down just enough so that on average my voice doesn't go over the 0 mark. But I tried recording some vocals right now and it didn't work at all. Made them way too low. :S
 
Ginsingh said:
This didn't work for me... I added the Meter Bridge as an insert. I turned my gain down just enough so that on average my voice doesn't go over the 0 mark. But I tried recording some vocals right now and it didn't work at all. Made them way too low. :S
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They are not too low. They are gain staged properly. Your instrumental is too loud.
 
But if I make my instrumental lower wouldn't the whole track itself be really quiet because I had to compensate for the lower instrumental volume?
 
You don't have to leave your vocals that low. You are basically trying to run your preamp at it's ideal operating level. Once it's recorded, you can do what you please.
 
Ginsingh said:
But if I make my instrumental lower wouldn't the whole track itself be really quiet because I had to compensate for the lower instrumental volume?
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Usually the problem I see is that the beats are "mastered", which mean squished to hell by compression. The first thing I do when I load a pre-made beat is turn it down to about -7db or lower. Then I record all the vocals. Apply compression to each vocal channel. Buss all vocals and apply more compression until the vocals start to get nice and loud and even and start to match the "power" of the beat. Then you adjust the master fader to make it close to 0db and drop a limiter to protect you from overs.

How loud a song is has to do with two things. The RMS power of the track and the volume of your monitors. Adjusting a fader in the software to turn the track up does NOT make your song louder. So just worry about recording the vocals properly and when you are mixing and something isn't loud enough turn every thing else down. Then once it's mixed properly you can turn it back up.
 
When I recorded my vocals the wavelength was really skinny, thats one thing that made me notice I probably must have done something wrong. I can take a print screen to show you what i'm talking about if necessary.

How can I make my overall track sound loud then? Not loud but, "industry" standard? I would have to make the instrumental a lot lower in volume, then raise the vocals a lot more as well. But that would still make my overall track decrease in volume quite a bit...
 
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Ginsingh said:
When I recorded my vocals the wavelength was really skinny, thats one thing that made me notice I probably must have done something wrong. I can take a print screen to show you what i'm talking about if necessary.

How can I make my overall track sound loud then? Not loud but, "industry" standard? I would have to make the instrumental a lot lower in volume, then raise the vocals a lot more as well. But that would still make my overall track decrease in volume quite a bit...
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It doesn't matter what the wave form looks like. You can actually adjust it so you can make it look like it's too loud. That's the slider at the top right of the screen.

Your just not understanding. You want to get the vocal mix right and after you compress then adjust the make-up gain and your vocals will be loud again. I guess I need to walk you through it.

Import the beat that has been "mastered". Lower that fader to -7db. Turn up your headphones as loud as you need it and record the vocals. If your vocals are too low to hear move your beat down to -10db and turn up the headphones more until you can hear the beat well and yourself in the mic well. Record all the vocals. Compress each vocal track with a 4:1 ratio, med/fast attack, med release, and adjust the threshold until you get between -3 to -5 db of gain reduction max. Pan and mix your vocal tracks. Then buss all your vocals to a stereo track. Then drop a compressor on your vocal buss and use a 2:1 ratio, med attack, med release, and adjust threshold until you can hear the compressor working then back it off until you can barely not hear it anymore. Then adjust the vocal buss fader until it fits perfectly with the beat. Then look at the master fader and read what the peak is. Then move both the beat and vocal buss up until you get about -3db peak on the master fader. Sometimes if the beat is way too squished I'll drop a master limiter on the vocal buss to make it match the beat. Only do this if you can't find the spot where the vocals sit in the beat. Like when it's too loud you turn it down but then it's too low so you have to turn it up. Ect. Now just drop a master limiter on the Master channel just to make sure you don't clip. Then after the limiter drop the TT Dynamic Range Meter. You can download it from Brainworx for free. That will tell you how loud your song really is, kinda. I like to keep my tracks in the yellow and green because I like range in my tracks but if it is in the red it is loud. Trust the meter.
 
That installer keeps crashing for me :/

---------- Post added at 01:48 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:03 PM ----------

No worries i got it working

---------- Post added at 02:01 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:48 PM ----------

Got another problem the meter aint picking up sound when i mic check.
 
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