Doing/releasing a cover, legally

[DJ Synner]

I had a longer message written out but I lost it so I'll try to sum up briefly what I want to ask.

Basically, I'm producing a Trance remix of 'I See You' by Leona Lewis BUT I'm getting another vocalist to do the vocals, which kind of makes it a cross between a remix and a cover, but probably closer to cover.

So I need to know what I need to do to basically make this legal if I want to release it, whether it be for profit or not. What is the process of getting the legal rights to do a cover and what organisations/companies would I need to talk to? Also, what kind of money am I looking at?

Your help is much appreciated.

 

[dwells]

I recommend getting an entertainment lawyer. I'm not sure exactly, but I'm pretty sure it the same as sampling and that is a headache.

 

[DJ Synner]

I recommend getting an entertainment lawyer. I'm not sure exactly, but I'm pretty sure it the same as sampling and that is a headache.

I think it's a little different actually. I've read about getting 'mechanical' licences' to release music. In America I know there's the Harry Fox Agency that takes care of that but I'm in Australia so they're not much good to me.

Also, I'm not in a position where I want to fork out the cash to hire a lawer for overpriced advice on one track.

 

[BigAshley]

You can release the track publicly no profit but you cannot make money from it, then there may be problems, that is depending on how big the track gets, lets say you started selling it on iTunes for 2$, plus you released it on youtube and it got 1 million views, expect a big problem.

It's mainly like that for most mixtapes too. eg: Asher Roth.

 

[galacticboy]

That would be a cover version of the original song. You either need a mechanical license from the owner of the musical composition copyright - check the Harry Fox Agency, as they serve as an administrator for a large number of songwriters - or you can go the compulsory licensing route, as described in this circular: http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ73.pdf

 

[BigAshley]

That would be a cover version of the original song. You either need a mechanical license from the owner of the musical composition copyright - check the Harry Fox Agency, as they serve as an administrator for a large number of songwriters - or you can go the compulsory licensing route, as described in this circular: http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ73.pdf

Yeah, cover of a song, remix = slightly the same thing, you could get sued for selling it online. Or am I wrong? Although if its free release, then its fine..Right?

 

[dwells]

I'm not sure how international copyright laws are in Australia. But trying to do business without a lawyer is just foolish

 

[DJ Synner]

I'm not sure how international copyright laws are in Australia. But trying to do business without a lawyer is just foolish

Yeah I understand but I'm not really trying to do 'buisness' of any sort, just figure out what licences I'd need and who I'd need to go to for them.

And I know pretty much what to do now except I'm not sure what rights organisation I need to go to.

 

[dvyce]

I had a longer message written out but I lost it so I'll try to sum up briefly what I want to ask.

Basically, I'm producing a Trance remix of 'I See You' by Leona Lewis BUT I'm getting another vocalist to do the vocals, which kind of makes it a cross between a remix and a cover, but probably closer to cover.

So I need to know what I need to do to basically make this legal if I want to release it, whether it be for profit or not. What is the process of getting the legal rights to do a cover and what organisations/companies would I need to talk to? Also, what kind of money am I looking at?

Your help is much appreciated.

this is 100% a cover... not a remix... you are not using any portions of the original song... you are doing your own versdion of it... that is the definition of a "cover."

You get a mechanical license.

You can easily do this through Harry Fox where you will simply have to pay the statutory royalty rate (which is something like 9 cents per song per CD/download... they increase the amount every so often so I do not know what it currently is... and you pay it in advance.)

Or you can do this by contacting the publisher directly and negotiating a reduced rate.


And (to make it all legal) you must do this whether you are profiting or not.

 

[dvyce]

I recommend getting an entertainment lawyer. I'm not sure exactly, but I'm pretty sure it the same as sampling and that is a headache.

No. It is not at all like sampling.

With sampling, you have to get permission to use the sample and the copyright owner can charge you whatever he wants.

With a cover, you need no permission... Copyright law provides for a "compulsory license" which means the copyright owner is "legally compelled" to allow people to record cover versions for use on albums and downloads as long as you pay an amount not to exceed the statutory rate of the mechanical license royalty.

You have to get a mechanical license and pay the mechanical royalty.

Easy.

But you must get permission from the copyright holder if you want to license the song for a commercial or a movie or a TV show... basically, anything other than putting it on an album.

...and the Copyright holder does not have to grant permission for this and they can charge whatever they want.

 

[dvyce]

I think it's a little different actually. I've read about getting 'mechanical' licences' to release music. In America I know there's the Harry Fox Agency that takes care of that but I'm in Australia so they're not much good to me.

Also, I'm not in a position where I want to fork out the cash to hire a lawer for overpriced advice on one track.

Contact Harry Fox.

This is not something for a lawyer.

 

[dvyce]

You can release the track publicly no profit but you cannot make money from it, then there may be problems, that is depending on how big the track gets, lets say you started selling it on iTunes for 2$, plus you released it on youtube and it got 1 million views, expect a big problem.

It's mainly like that for most mixtapes too. eg: Asher Roth.

100% false.

Legally, you need to pay the mechanical royalty regardless of whether you personally make money or not.

 

[dvyce]

Yeah, cover of a song, remix = slightly the same thing, you could get sued for selling it online. Or am I wrong?

You are wrong. They are different things. A "cover" is a new version of the song. A "remix" is using some portion of the original song you are remixing (typically the vocal at a minimum).

...but you are right that you can get sued.

Although if its free release, then its fine..Right?

WRONG!!!!!!!!

 

[dvyce]

Yeah I understand but I'm not really trying to do 'buisness' of any sort, just figure out what licences I'd need and who I'd need to go to for them.

And I know pretty much what to do now except I'm not sure what rights organisation I need to go to.

Contact Harry Fox... They will be able to help you.

 

[DJ Synner]

Contact Harry Fox... They will be able to help you.

Wow thanks dvyce for clearing things up.

One final question... Realistically, what are the chances of getting in trouble for releasing it if I don't get a licence, and what would be the degree of that trouble?

And also I want to offer this as a free download, a promo track, so how would I get a licence to release it if I don't even know how many downloads/plays it's gunna get?

EDIT: The FAQ at the HFA site says the following: 17. How do I license a new arrangement of a copyright-protected song, or a medley?
A new version or arrangement of an existing song that alters the melody or character of the song, or a medley of existing songs, is called a derivative work. You need to obtain permission from the publisher directly to create a derivative work, and include that permission when you apply for a mechanical license using HFA's regular licensing form which you can obtain here.

Does this throw a spanner in the works?

 

[dvyce]

Wow thanks dvyce for clearing things up.

One final question... Realistically, what are the chances of getting in trouble for releasing it if I don't get a licence, and what would be the degree of that trouble?

And also I want to offer this as a free download, a promo track, so how would I get a licence to release it if I don't even know how many downloads/plays it's gunna get?

EDIT: The FAQ at the HFA site says the following: 17. How do I license a new arrangement of a copyright-protected song, or a medley?
A new version or arrangement of an existing song that alters the melody or character of the song, or a medley of existing songs, is called a derivative work. You need to obtain permission from the publisher directly to create a derivative work, and include that permission when you apply for a mechanical license using HFA's regular licensing form which you can obtain here.

Does this throw a spanner in the works?

What are tha chances anybody would even notice you did a cover? Probably very slim.

Derivative work? You are doing a cover. The things they are describing, a "medley" which is putting multiple songs together... And the stuff they are talking about with "altering" the song which is really referring to things like the way Flo Rida used Dead Or Alive's "You Spin Me Round" do not apply to you if you are just doing the song in your own style.

Are you just doing your trance version (or whatever) of this song? Then it is a cover.

How do you get the license if you don't know how many you will sell? They ask you to estimate how many you "expect" to sell... If you are going to get the license, just estimate the smallest amount possible, which, no offense, is most likely an accurate estimate anyway... It's the nature of the business... That's record sales for ya'!

 

[DJ Synner]

Ok I get that. I actually misread 'medley' for 'melody.'

I tried to get a licence from the HFA, but they stopped me when I ticked the box of 'distributing outside of US.' Apparently they only have juristiction inside the US, which is fair enough, but how the hell and I going to choose who downloads my song?? I was applying for a digital download licence, but the internet is international, so what's even the point of them offering one?

It's pretty fustrating actually. I've sent an email to apra|amcos which is the Australian equivilant of the HFA but still haven't got a reply.

Got any advice on what to do next?

 

[A-Zar]

It's great that you are trying to do this the right way but realistically you should just release it for free on your site. One look at the thousands of cover versions of songs on YouTube will spell out the fact that the average person doesn't even know HFA exists. They sit on their bed with a guitar and record themselves singing Leona Lewis' latest hit and post it up 5 minutes later.

If you happen to attract attention from your release, the rights owner will spell out exactly what you need to do to comply with the law in your country. At that point, you can thank them for doing the legal work for you and decide if it's worth it to comply. The only reason they would contact you is if your work is making money (which they want their share of) or if it's so bad they want it to go away.

Release the track. Post a link in here so we can check it out. Good Luck!