Good daw to start with!
- Thread starter Provenza
- Start date
I think I am going to use Logic!
I say FL Studio or Ableton Live.
Ableton is awesome imo cause it's a lot easier transition between producing tracks and performing them, if that's what you're looking to do.
I use FL Studio still, but trying to jump onto the Ableton boat...just gotta put some time and effort.
And about FL Studio, it is a PERFECTLY fine DAW, and actually it's got one of the best mixers out there, in terms of flexibility imo. You can make anything you want with it.
I hate how techno-kiddies gave FL Studio such a bad name...
P.
Ableton is awesome imo cause it's a lot easier transition between producing tracks and performing them, if that's what you're looking to do.
I use FL Studio still, but trying to jump onto the Ableton boat...just gotta put some time and effort.
And about FL Studio, it is a PERFECTLY fine DAW, and actually it's got one of the best mixers out there, in terms of flexibility imo. You can make anything you want with it.
I hate how techno-kiddies gave FL Studio such a bad name...
P.
logic7
old school
FL can do everything any other DAW can.
---------- Post added at 08:36 PM ---------- Previous post was at 08:34 PM ----------
no, it wasn't Techno guys that did it, it's the glut of cats that downloaded pirated copies over the years, made a "hot" beat and suddenly they're declaring themselves a "producer".
That's where the problem started. Electronic musicians are doing great things with FL. The entire Dubstep genre owes it's existence to FL as it's pioneers used it exclusively.
Ok.
But I always had the feeling that FL was more for Hip Hop and such not like pop music!
saturatedskillz
New member
I would have to say FL Studios & Reaper:
http://www.reaper.fm/index.php
http://flstudio.image-line.com
http://www.reaper.fm/index.php
http://flstudio.image-line.com
logic7
old school
it's for whatever you feel like making. It's POPULAR with hip hop beatmakers, but it's designed to be used for whatever you want.
~X~
Word+Sound+Power= Music
Reaper + drum samples + vsti. Learning to use a real multitrack recording software will benefit you greatly. The grid snapping and midi programming found in reaper makes it very easy to make instrumentals. You will also learn mixing, routing, and eventually use it to record vocals and everything else.
Trusty
I use reason and logic.
I'm sorry, but Sonar X1 is the baddest thing out there, or will be when it comes out. Especially on PC. For everything the producer version will have packed in it, it can't be beat.
Go ahead and buy Sonar 8.5 PE, as the upgrade to X1 will be free anyway.
Why it beats FL Studio:
1. Out of the box, the sounds are garbage. Sonar has all the right instruments, sound content, effects, and so forth to make those great sounding drums and melodies in your head be delivered with a high quality sound.
2. The workflow is convoluted, as everything in it "that any other DAW has" is "bolted on" around the step sequencer, which relatively few FL Studio users even bother using anymore.
3. FL Studio is still way overpriced in the long run, even for the Signature Edition and lifetime updates. The reason is because even to get it close to Sonar's value per dollar ratio, you'd end up spending several hundred dollars more in the Image-Line shop or elsewhere to get the same quality Sonar PE has shipped in the box.
Why it is better than Reason + Record for the same money:
1. Once you get Reason and Record, you are stuck living in that environment and enslaved to Propellerheads' development cycle for anything new other than refills to feed the same old stuff.
2. Sonar is open (like everything else besides Reason), so you can add on according to taste. Even for people using Reason and VSTs in other hosts, the VAST majority of them find better sounds and instruments and effects elsewhere in the VST world, and eventually drop Reason along the way anyway when they've moved on to other things where they should have started in the first place. Look at all the Reason heads that still wish it had VST support for further evidence.
3. Record is too new and too incomplete to compete in the DAW recording, mixing department.
Why it is better than Ableton Live:
1. It is about the same price if not less in some cases, and comes with so much more and of higher quality in terms of out of the box content.
2. Live's UI will always be ass no matter how fun the program is, but Sonar has consistently gotten better over the years while Live still looks like ass. With Skylight, Sonar's workflow and UI has gone through the roof in terms of usability, customization, and workflow. Live's screen interface, where it is either session or arrangement view but never both at the same time has been a hassle for years, and an ignored fix by the Ableton team since its inception. Sonar has never had this problem of not being able to see what you want, and the new Skylight takes this flexibility to a whole other level. People harp how good Ableton's workflow is all the time, but for new users that haven't been with it since at least version 3 or 4 have a hard time getting on with it, especially if they come from a composition/musician background rather than a DJ one...generally speaking of course. Sonar is designed for musicians and engineers, but it's live capabilities have vastly improved and it can now be a blank slate customized however one wishes to use it.
3. The stable-ness and customer support for Live has gone way down the toilet in recent years while Cakewalk's has always been top notch on both counts for the vast majority of users.
Live is a great program, and I do use it for certain things, especially for doing actual "live" stuff and for some good sample-based beat-making (though Geist is doing the job nicely in its place since it came out), but for serious production and studio work, I look to Sonar, and I wish Live would refocus its efforts on being a "live" performance host and quit trying to be a jack of all trades, master of few.
Why it is better than Reaper:
1. It has way more features and content.
2. It is easier to use for actually composing music, where Reaper still lags in midi.
3. Reaper has a serious "boring" factor to it for the most part. (This is my opinion though) There is little about it to get excited over it unless you are one of the Reaper zealot crowd that thinks it is awesome because it is "cheap" and "open" or whatever. Don't be fooled by the zealots, it offers little to the market, no offense to Reaper heads.
Why it is better than Cubarse:
1. Cubarse is overpriced garbage for software snobs. Enough said.
Seriously, if you are on PC, Cakewalk is who you should turn to in order to get started with everything you will need, very quickly, and for a great price.
Flame on!
Go ahead and buy Sonar 8.5 PE, as the upgrade to X1 will be free anyway.
Why it beats FL Studio:
1. Out of the box, the sounds are garbage. Sonar has all the right instruments, sound content, effects, and so forth to make those great sounding drums and melodies in your head be delivered with a high quality sound.
2. The workflow is convoluted, as everything in it "that any other DAW has" is "bolted on" around the step sequencer, which relatively few FL Studio users even bother using anymore.
3. FL Studio is still way overpriced in the long run, even for the Signature Edition and lifetime updates. The reason is because even to get it close to Sonar's value per dollar ratio, you'd end up spending several hundred dollars more in the Image-Line shop or elsewhere to get the same quality Sonar PE has shipped in the box.
Why it is better than Reason + Record for the same money:
1. Once you get Reason and Record, you are stuck living in that environment and enslaved to Propellerheads' development cycle for anything new other than refills to feed the same old stuff.
2. Sonar is open (like everything else besides Reason), so you can add on according to taste. Even for people using Reason and VSTs in other hosts, the VAST majority of them find better sounds and instruments and effects elsewhere in the VST world, and eventually drop Reason along the way anyway when they've moved on to other things where they should have started in the first place. Look at all the Reason heads that still wish it had VST support for further evidence.
3. Record is too new and too incomplete to compete in the DAW recording, mixing department.
Why it is better than Ableton Live:
1. It is about the same price if not less in some cases, and comes with so much more and of higher quality in terms of out of the box content.
2. Live's UI will always be ass no matter how fun the program is, but Sonar has consistently gotten better over the years while Live still looks like ass. With Skylight, Sonar's workflow and UI has gone through the roof in terms of usability, customization, and workflow. Live's screen interface, where it is either session or arrangement view but never both at the same time has been a hassle for years, and an ignored fix by the Ableton team since its inception. Sonar has never had this problem of not being able to see what you want, and the new Skylight takes this flexibility to a whole other level. People harp how good Ableton's workflow is all the time, but for new users that haven't been with it since at least version 3 or 4 have a hard time getting on with it, especially if they come from a composition/musician background rather than a DJ one...generally speaking of course. Sonar is designed for musicians and engineers, but it's live capabilities have vastly improved and it can now be a blank slate customized however one wishes to use it.
3. The stable-ness and customer support for Live has gone way down the toilet in recent years while Cakewalk's has always been top notch on both counts for the vast majority of users.
Live is a great program, and I do use it for certain things, especially for doing actual "live" stuff and for some good sample-based beat-making (though Geist is doing the job nicely in its place since it came out), but for serious production and studio work, I look to Sonar, and I wish Live would refocus its efforts on being a "live" performance host and quit trying to be a jack of all trades, master of few.
Why it is better than Reaper:
1. It has way more features and content.
2. It is easier to use for actually composing music, where Reaper still lags in midi.
3. Reaper has a serious "boring" factor to it for the most part. (This is my opinion though) There is little about it to get excited over it unless you are one of the Reaper zealot crowd that thinks it is awesome because it is "cheap" and "open" or whatever. Don't be fooled by the zealots, it offers little to the market, no offense to Reaper heads.
Why it is better than Cubarse:
1. Cubarse is overpriced garbage for software snobs. Enough said.
Seriously, if you are on PC, Cakewalk is who you should turn to in order to get started with everything you will need, very quickly, and for a great price.
Flame on!
what exactly is rewiring? i keep hearing about rewiring reason into FL studio etc.. explain it in baby talk if possible
Trusty
I use reason and logic.
Rewire is where you are allowed to have two host/DAW programs open at once, with one controlling the other. In fact, it is the only way to use Reason with anything else besides Record (because Reason shows up in Record automatically). But Rewire can be used for any two host/DAW programs that have it and allow themselves to either control, be controlled by other host/DAW programs, or both. In rewire, the one being controlled feeds its audio and into the one controlling it, and the one controlling it feeds its midi data to the one being controlled in order to trigger the audio the controlled one is feeding back to the one controlling it.
For example, you open FL Studio as your first host/DAW and then open Reason rewired into it. From FL, acting as the controller, you send midi to trigger Reason's stuff, from inside FL studio, because it is the one being controlled, and Reason sends its audio back into FL studio. All instantaneously.
I guess it is hard to make it simpler than that.
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logic7
old school
whole lotta opinion in that, very little fact.
Trusty, your "value to dollar" ratio comparison is totally invalid, since what you're saying is that Sonar is more valuable because it has more value per dollar...
And what is "bolted on" supposed to mean even?! Everything in FL Studio is laid out in plain view, if you say that most producers don't even bother using the step sequencer, I don't feel comfortable with you representing mine and others voice.
Whether or not a DAW is better than any other one is purely relative. And "Out of the Box" content (I believe you are only referring to samples, as Ableton's instruments are very good), I doubt any real professional producer uses much out of the box content coming with any DAW...it doesn't play that big of a role, what does is how the DAW serves you long term, so usability and work-flow.
As a whole, I don't see any substance in your claims or argument, I say leave it the OP to decide from Demo's which DAW suites him the best.
BTW, @ Provenza, I can't send PM's because apparently FP likes abusing new comers...but I don't use Ableton full time, I'm still very much learning it...
P.
And what is "bolted on" supposed to mean even?! Everything in FL Studio is laid out in plain view, if you say that most producers don't even bother using the step sequencer, I don't feel comfortable with you representing mine and others voice.
Whether or not a DAW is better than any other one is purely relative. And "Out of the Box" content (I believe you are only referring to samples, as Ableton's instruments are very good), I doubt any real professional producer uses much out of the box content coming with any DAW...it doesn't play that big of a role, what does is how the DAW serves you long term, so usability and work-flow.
As a whole, I don't see any substance in your claims or argument, I say leave it the OP to decide from Demo's which DAW suites him the best.
BTW, @ Provenza, I can't send PM's because apparently FP likes abusing new comers...but I don't use Ableton full time, I'm still very much learning it...
P.
Trusty
I use reason and logic.
This is future producers. What did you expect? I gave my opinion.
logic7
old school
but you presented it as fact, which is a problem.
I can disqualify Sonar as a serious threat to FL Studio by mentioning FL's Directwave sampler... which Sonar lacks. The only DAW to include a sampler of its caliber is Logic.
Cakewalk "bolted on" a step sequencer to Sonar in an attempt to lure FL users away... It's kinda awkward to use... I don't like it one bit.
As for FL's out of the box sounds being "garbage", again, it's purely opinion. I really doubt you've sat down and listened to all of the sounds in all of the synths included with FL. Having said that, I also doubt you've auditioned every sound included with Sonar. Since neither of these events have taken place, you would hardly be qualified to speak on whether FL's sounds are "garbage".
Besides... only lazy @sses rely on preset sounds. The whole point of the synths is to make your own sounds... Even if all you do is tweak the presets to tailor them to your needs you're still better off than some preset junkie that uses the same sounds every other wannabe "producer" uses.
