What Do You Even Need An Mpc For??????

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when you start doing work in stuidos w/ major top dog producers you will find an MPC very useful when doing a collab with any of those guys...you will find that in most situations like this, they will tend to have more patience working with the MPC...the MPC is also known for having a very warm analog signal...with most software, you have to "tweak the Freq" to emulate that quality...to make a long story short...whether it's an MPC or a damn beat pad the size of a calculator, more is better so tap into all of that **** you got...and find a way to make all of it work together...
 
^Again the mpc is not warm.It's accurate. Akai has always been known for thier accurate samplers that give you exactly what you put in.
Emu, and Ensoniq were the samplers people bought if they wanted a lil' color to thier samples.
I had the 2000, and side by side with a budget audio card will show the mpc is niether warm or superior in any audible way.
As for the groove I could almost nail the groove with my Zoom sampletrak that only has a 24ppqn clock.(60%swing with an amount of 1 on the mpc was almost indentical to 61% with 2x bpm in the Zoom)
It really is as simple as where your midi notes hit in the grid.
If have a groove template then it is infact quantized to the grid in the exact same way it would be with the same settings in the mpc.

I like the mpc, don't get me wrong. It's a great tool with a fantastic workflow.
For me the whole workflow/pad connection was what made/makes the mpc series so popular, and usable after alomost 20 years.
 
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The whole thing about the MPC's quantize isn't based on the "quantize templates" or anything, or the placements of the notes in the grid. It's the clock that controls the playback. The older mpc's had a slightly in-accurate clock, so the playback felt a little sloppy ("groovy").
 
orjanbeats said:
The whole thing about the MPC's quantize isn't based on the "quantize templates" or anything, or the placements of the notes in the grid. It's the clock that controls the playback. The older mpc's had a slightly in-accurate clock, so the playback felt a little sloppy ("groovy").
Click to expand...

Quantizing templates are available to use in most DAWs out there. It's based around the timing imperfections that comes from the mpc's. Not any template in the mpc, but templates are made from the inaccuracy from the mpc
 
So the MPCs 'bad sounding' is considered to be good then? ^^

On a serious note though: No windows (pre Vista) machine will, due to technical issues, have an as tight MIDI timing as an MPC has.
But we are talking about fractions of milliseconds here.
What *IS* true though is that the automatic quantization of the MPC is unique. But not as unique that it can't be reproduced by other programs. Like many others in this same thread already mentioned...
Logic can, FL can....
 
Mattman04 said:
"the sound of it"
"Analog sound over digital"

Misconceptions.
mpc's are in fact digital samplers, and they sound about the same as a $100 audiocard.

Side by side comparisons of my old mpc2000, and my Echo Mia actually showed a slightly wider stereo field in favor of the Echo(IMO).

So the whole analog sound business is nothing more than placebo effect.
Click to expand...


I was talking about the "feeling" of a warmer sound, NOT IT ACTUALLY MAKING ONE. It is a "placebo" effect, I know that, I was just telling folks what people that use it tell me. It doesnt make it true, it is just how they feel about it, and that is the bottomlne, they LOVE to use it..
 
MPC's main advantage is being an all in one box for beatmaking.

You get integrated sampling, sample editing, and midi sequencing.


It has a midi sequencer that is pretty much designed for electronic style music such as Rap.

I still find the Mpc to be the most comfortable workstation made.

IMO Fruityloops just don't have the real time response as a mpc. It doesn't seem suited to low latency playing.

Reason, Live, Sonar on the other hand just doesn't have the feel of an MPC. Even with the Kontakt, MPC pads (i don't even use mine), Sound Forge, Recycle etc.

I hear Cubase is about as close as it gets (although Live does the pattern chaining function even better).



Certain MPC features to look for in a sequencer.

Auto Quantize (Every soft sequencer has this about now, but Project 5 doesn't right now. it will get this shortly).

Metronome with configurable time rates (Cubase has this)

Note repeat (Most sequencers have arpegiattors but are more difficult to use).

Dedicated Overwrite and Overdub functions (most software seqs use a switch to accomplish this. I find the buttons more instant access.)

Unique Overwrite loop record mode which turns into Overdub when loop point is reached (Only a mpc user will know what I am talking about. The advantage is not having to press undo for a bad take. This is what really make the mpc quick to compose).

Not having to arm midi tracks to record (ableton live and Project 5 fail at this)

Being able to record new midi tracks while sequence is playing (older mpcs couldn't do this fully. Live, P5 does this good ).

Sequence chaining (Ableton Live, Project 5, and Cubase does this. Keep in mind Live and P5's way of doing this involves more time setting individual lengths of each track. Mpc doesn't have this problem).

Built-in sampling and editing (this can be done on most computer sequencers. It is just not as pretty. Reason can't do this at all).

Loop/ Tempo calculator with pitch shift adjustments( Sonar has this to a degree (but it doesn't calculate new tempo when speeding up loop).)

Works with external midi devices (Reason can't do this)

Using Pads to mute tracks in real-time. PC users are typically stuck with a mouse unless they have a controller.


When you find something that does all of this on the computer, post back. The computer kills the mpc though when it comes to actually having to edit midi (mpcs are horrible at this), step writing midi, recording vocals, and mixing your song. Also you get a better feel with at least one external midi controller/synth with a mpc like a roland fantom or triton.



Another advantage (on some mpcs) is the sounds of the samples themselves. the 3000, and 60 are some hard hitting machines, but to be fair you can get this (and probably better) effect using plug-ins, hardware samplers like the s950, s3000, ASR 10, sp 1200.
 
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I can't actually think of any program which can't do what you listed here. :)
Besides Reasons MIDI limitation and P5's live quantize stuff...

I can only btw talk to a deep degree about stuff FL can do, and scratch the surface on any other app, but.... the MP is a limited device, man. truely.

edit: that was quite a long post of yours, and i'm not in the mood to tear every word you wrote apart.
 
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jlgrimes11 said:
MPC's main advantage is being an all in one box for beatmaking.

You get integrated sampling, sample editing, and midi sequencing.


It has a midi sequencer that is pretty much designed for electronic style music such as Rap.

I still find the Mpc to be the most comfortable workstation made.

IMO Fruityloops just don't have the real time response as a mpc. It doesn't seem suited to low latency playing.

Reason, Live, Sonar on the other hand just doesn't have the feel of an MPC. Even with the Kontakt, MPC pads (i don't even use mine), Sound Forge, Recycle etc.

I hear Cubase is about as close as it gets (although Live does the pattern chaining function even better).



Certain MPC features to look for in a sequencer.

Auto Quantize (Every soft sequencer has this about now, but Project 5 doesn't right now. it will get this shortly).

Metronome with configurable time rates (Cubase has this)

Note repeat (Most sequencers have arpegiattors but are more difficult to use).

Dedicated Overwrite and Overdub functions (most software seqs use a switch to accomplish this. I find the buttons more instant access.)

Unique Overwrite loop record mode which turns into Overdub when loop point is reached (Only a mpc user will know what I am talking about. The advantage is not having to press undo for a bad take. This is what really make the mpc quick to compose).

Not having to arm midi tracks to record (ableton live and Project 5 fail at this)

Being able to record new midi tracks while sequence is playing (older mpcs couldn't do this fully. Live, P5 does this good ).

Sequence chaining (Ableton Live, Project 5, and Cubase does this. Keep in mind Live and P5's way of doing this involves more time setting individual lengths of each track. Mpc doesn't have this problem).

Built-in sampling and editing (this can be done on most computer sequencers. It is just not as pretty. Reason can't do this at all).

Loop/ Tempo calculator with pitch shift adjustments( Sonar has this to a degree (but it doesn't calculate new tempo when speeding up loop).)

Works with external midi devices (Reason can't do this)

Using Pads to mute tracks in real-time. PC users are typically stuck with a mouse unless they have a controller.


When you find something that does all of this on the computer, post back. The computer kills the mpc though when it comes to actually having to edit midi (mpcs are horrible at this), step writing midi, recording vocals, and mixing your song. Also you get a better feel with at least one external midi controller/synth with a mpc like a roland fantom or triton.



Another advantage (on some mpcs) is the sounds of the samples themselves. the 3000, and 60 are some hard hitting machines, but to be fair you can get this (and probably better) effect using plug-ins, hardware samplers like the s950, s3000, ASR 10, sp 1200.
Click to expand...


All in One Box= True

The other stuff u mentioned= False

Any Software sequencer can do all of that and more..

MPC is all about convience and ease of use, almost every studio has one (cannot say that about software with the exception PT), and once u learn it your pretty much set for life (software is always updating itself and you must learn the new methods to be up to par)

I know ppl will say that the MPC has a learning curve but I will say, Yeah, its kinda like any other instrument, U must learn it first!!!!
 
that just shows me you did not really try something else than your beloved MPC.
I can't actually think of any program which can't do what you listed here.
Besides Reasons MIDI limitation and P5's live quantize stuff...
Click to expand...

I actually don't use a MPC no more. I have 5+ years experience with a MPC and about another 5 years on a computer sequencer.


I use Sonar, Reason, and Ableton Live to do beats. They have do advantages over the MPC and have their own ways of achieving the mpc's functions but I just don't find them as well thought out or elegant as the mpc.

I have Fruityloops at home as well but the latency is so bad on it (pops and clicks at like 2.9ms of latency), I really just can't play the stuff in how I want to.

Sonar is great but lack of pattern chaining functions hinders it.

Ableton is great but too much reliance on the mouse hinders it.

And well Reason (you already know).


I can't think of one program still that does all of those functions I named (I haven't went full in on Fruityloops though). Back up your claims or show me how Fruityloops can do the stuff I mentioned.

Any Software sequencer can do all of that and more..
Click to expand...

False and misleading.

Sonar, Live, and Reason don't have the overwrite/overdub loop record mode I mentioned.

All of those programs starts overwriting your data after the loop point is reached and relies on undoing bad takes. But I'll be willing to listen to your proof.
 
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jlgrimes: I'm sorry your setup does not allow you to set up nice latency and stuff.
All I have to add is that I can run FL with 64 samples of latency (below 1 ms) and still run a lot of DSP stuff while at it. My computer is not one of the fastest either. (AMD Athlon 2800, 1GB Ram, 133 FSB (<-the weakest part of my setup)
So you must be doing something wrong I guess.
Doesn't mean I set it up like this all the time. 5ms @ 512 samples is just fine for me.

jlgrimes11 said:
IAll of those programs starts overwriting your data after the loop point is reached and relies on undoing bad takes. But I'll be willing to listen to your proof.
Click to expand...
ok: FL has an "overdub" switch. :)
It's still the same record button, but you can switch from overdub to "blend" notes mode
 
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I can run at 2.9 ms in Sonar, Reason, and Live all day (as long as I am not trying to cram effects on my plugins) on my PC. Fruityloops doesn't perform as better.


All of those features I mentioned are really small things that seems anal when somebody mentions them, but they make all the difference in the world.

I'm the first person to admit MPCs are not perfect however. I switched from MPC to computer because as you acquire more and more hardware synths and samplers, the MPCs become less practical and a good computer sequencer with program change capability and expandable midi ports becomes a better solution.

Also with more numerous amounts of hardware synths, saving your work in an MPC is a nightmare with its cryptic typing functions. I can save my beats in Sonar in usually under a minute in extreme cases. Now however I use mainly software, saving is just maybe several seconds.

Also add to the fact Mpcs need to be tracked out into a DAW like pro tools or cubase (or maybe even fruityloops) to get a decent mix. I think the 4000 though has better effects (although I never really used them).


But I can't deny the MPC is amazing as a compositional tool.
 
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Sorry if it sounded like I was trying to take MPCs down.
They're fine machines.
But they actually are computers too, and have their latency too.
I guess you could find out how much latency an MPC introduces if you really search for it on the Net e.g.
The fact they are digital devices and output their sound just like any PC or Mac does, implies that their way of outputting sound is not any different.

An MPC just has a nifty LCD display and nice buttons and pads attached to it.
Just like a computer has a mouse a keyboard and a display and whatnot. It's a different way to approach composing music for sure, but actually not all that different..
 
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But they actually are computers too, and have their latency too.
I guess you could find out how much latency an MPC introduces if you really search for it on the Net e.g.
Click to expand...

Most hardware synths are somewhere in the range of 3-5 ms.

Some analog synths and cheaper digital synths can be higher than that.


I know at 5ms I hear a slight delay but 3ms feels dead on.

I'd think the mpc is probably somewhere between 3-4 ms.

An MPC just has a nifty LCD display and nice buttons and pads attached to it.
Just like a computer has a mouse a keyboard and a display and whatnot. It's a different way to approach composing music for sure, but actually not all that different..
Click to expand...

Every brand sequencer is different. In a sense this can lead to a different feel when you create giving you a different sound.

Every sequencer I used changed my sound some and the way I approached compositions so it can make quite a difference.

Some sequencers are suited for live like performances (recording your bad takes and editing out the mistakes by hand). I think Sonar fits this bill.

Others are more suited for step creating songs and creating and chaining patterns (Project 5, Fruityloops, and Reason to some point).

The MPC is kind of a blend between both forms of sequencers.

Its step write mode was horrible and its midi editing was just as bad but the way it had it's auto quantize set up and instant access of the buttons and functions you needed made it equally capable of overcoming those inconsitencies.


I find though on the PC now I tend to prefer their methods of time correction because they allow more control than the mpc.
 
jlgrimes11 said:
I'd think the mpc is probably somewhere between 3-4 ms.
Click to expand...
I have an MPD 16 and can also feel the difference between 128 (~2 ms) samples and 256 (~5ms) @ 44.1 KHz.
So the Latency of the MPC must be somewhere inbetween.
All I was trying to say is that MPCs are nice machines, but highly overrated by people not knowing it better.
They think there's some "magic" behind it, what obviously is not the case.
 
Fact: There's alot of things you can say that will put the mpc on the addict...but there's this thing about legacy as well. It's not what the mpc offers you but rather the exact opposite. How well can you use this machine to get your **** on. Anyone know what I'm saying?
It's a simple machine, but it can render some fierce results under the right fingers. I love it!
 
One can tell exact the same thing about anything else out there capable of sequencing music. ;)
 
True...almost. Contemporary ways of making music is totally different. And it really is a thing called having to many option. In the end it's what's gonna peg you down. I was computerbased for years, before I copped an mpc and it's a totally different way of working. It's liberating to manage without a mouse hehe
 
I just can speak for myself as a "computer freak" and not having any trouble handling a mouse and memorizing weird keyboard shortcuts...
To each his own, you know. :)
 
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