Is using REAL instruments in your production the G.O.A.T.?

[98bullz]

In a generation like OURS, where MOST of the music is digital, made by digital/VST sounds, wouldn't you agree that producing using primarily REAL INSTRUMENTS is the GREATEST thing of all time?

I THINK IT IS.

1, stand out from the competition cuz you use real instruments

2, you can't replace a Fender, with a VST instrument.

3, separating yourself from the crowd.

4, can actually call yourself a musician because you can ACTUALLY play musical instruments

5, more skill is involved

6, shows how serious you are about your craft.




In conclusion, guys who produce using REAL instruments are better than losers who SOELY depend on electronic sounds to craft a body of work. It's okay to use electronic/VST's SOMETIMES, but if you're using it for 100% of your music, and you don't produce EDM, or some chit, then I have some bad news for you... You're doing it wrong.

lol @ you poverty producers who only use computer generated sound (excluding EDM people)

/rant.

Discuss.

 

[Pumpthrust]

You sound like one of those guys who watched a music theory tutorial and now thinks they are a musician because they can play all the white keys on their midi controller.
And this is coming from someone who plays instruments. Composing with instruments is nothing special. You think you're separating yourself from the crowd, but you're joining a MUCH larger crowd that really isn't all that impressed, tbh.

 

[98bullz]

You sound like one of those guys who watched a music theory tutorial and now thinks they are a musician because they can play all the white keys on their midi controller.
And this is coming from someone who plays instruments. Composing with instruments is nothing special. You think you're separating yourself from the crowd, but you're joining a MUCH larger crowd that really isn't all that impressed, tbh.

More like a guy with over 20 years of music theory experience, playing both the keys, and guitar (acoustic, electric, and bass). Just because YOU can't play instruments well is no reason to go again facts, guys who play real instruments, and who have a DEEP background in music theory, produce better music than schmos who don't. If you just wanna be a play ground producer and make shitty hip-hop beats.. Then sure. All you need is a Casio keyboard and a drum machine. If you want to produce MELODIC, vibrant music, then you're gunna need a lot more than a MPC, and a key board.. You're gunna need to use REAL instruments.

 

[Paschalis I.]

lol @ you poverty producers who only use computer generated sound (excluding EDM people)

I was trying really hard to maintain some respect for you throughout the post, but really hit the limit here.

You're wrong on so many levels but trying to make you understand will cost me time and the result won't change at all.

 

[Psalm]

I really really really hope you are trolling here but...
I don't have a problem with people using real instruments but I don't understand why you have such a hatred towards virtual instruments.

To stand out from the competition you need to do something different and innovative, not just use real instruments.

I agree, you can't replace a Fender with a VST but you also can't replace a synth sound with a real instrument.

If you wan't people to consider you a musician that's fine but you shouldn't be worried about what you are being labelled as. I don't care if people call me a producer, a beat maker, a bedroom producer, a musician or anything else, I just make music and I don't care what I'm labelled as.

Correct, more skill is involved, also more time is involved taken to learn each different instrument which could be spent learning one and then applying that to your different VSTs. The beauty of music production to me is being able to create a full song on your own unlike a band that has to be coordinated with eachother and who can't do it all by themselves (Some obvious exceptions there but you get my point).

Why on earth does using a real instrument make you more 'serious' about your craft? That makes no logical sense to me. The only thing that defines if you are serious about music or not, is your mind set, nothing else.

Also, have you ever considered that VSTs can provide 10 x more possibilities than using real instruments?

Everyone has different styles and you need to accept that. If everyone used real instruments, we wouldn't be producers...
I have no problem if you or anyone else wants to use real instruments in your production but how can you call DJ Mustard a loser for using virtual instruments with the amount of hits he has under his belt... He would not have got there with real instruments and he is not the only one!
It's ok to have your opinion but there's no need to call people who don't agree with you 'losers' or better yet 'poverty producers'.
If you could explain to me why you think producers who use computer generated sounds are all in a bad financial situation, I'm sure that would bring me some great insight.

 

[Pumpthrust]

I really really really hope you are trolling here but...
I don't have a problem with people using real instruments but I don't understand why you have such a hatred towards virtual instruments.

To stand out from the competition you need to do something different and innovative, not just use real instruments.

I agree, you can't replace a Fender with a VST but you also can't replace a synth sound with a real instrument.

If you wan't people to consider you a musician that's fine but you shouldn't be worried about what you are being labelled as. I don't care if people call me a producer, a beat maker, a bedroom producer, a musician or anything else, I just make music and I don't care what I'm labelled as.

Correct, more skill is involved, also more time is involved taken to learn each different instrument which could be spent learning one and then applying that to your different VSTs. The beauty of music production to me is being able to create a full song on your own unlike a band that has to be coordinated with eachother and who can't do it all by themselves (Some obvious exceptions there but you get my point).

Why on earth does using a real instrument make you more 'serious' about your craft? That makes no logical sense to me. The only thing that defines if you are serious about music or not, is your mind set, nothing else.

Also, have you ever considered that VSTs can provide 10 x more possibilities than using real instruments?

Everyone has different styles and you need to accept that. If everyone used real instruments, we wouldn't be producers...
I have no problem if you or anyone else wants to use real instruments in your production but how can you call DJ Mustard a loser for using virtual instruments with the amount of hits he has under his belt... He would not have got there with real instruments and he is not the only one!
It's ok to have your opinion but there's no need to call people who don't agree with you 'losers' or better yet 'poverty producers'.
If you could explain to me why you think producers who use computer generated sounds are all in a bad financial situation, I'm sure that would bring me some great insight.

Ummmm....you do realize there was a time when everyone played real instruments...and there were producers?

 

[Psalm]

I have now just read this other thread you posted here; https://www.futureproducers.com/for...ering/how-does-process-beat-making-go-485855/ which shows me you have no knowledge about music production yet you are bagging it out. Learn what it is all about before throwing you're hate all over it.
Also you say you are serious about production yet you say that you are just doing this as a 'side hustle', go figure.

Ummmm....you do realize there was a time when everyone played real instruments...and there were producers?

Yes, but now, in 2014, not everyone plays real instruments.

 

[98bullz]

I really really really hope you are trolling here but...
I don't have a problem with people using real instruments but I don't understand why you have such a hatred towards virtual instruments.

To stand out from the competition you need to do something different and innovative, not just use real instruments.

I agree, you can't replace a Fender with a VST but you also can't replace a synth sound with a real instrument.

If you wan't people to consider you a musician that's fine but you shouldn't be worried about what you are being labelled as. I don't care if people call me a producer, a beat maker, a bedroom producer, a musician or anything else, I just make music and I don't care what I'm labelled as.

Correct, more skill is involved, also more time is involved taken to learn each different instrument which could be spent learning one and then applying that to your different VSTs. The beauty of music production to me is being able to create a full song on your own unlike a band that has to be coordinated with eachother and who can't do it all by themselves (Some obvious exceptions there but you get my point).

Why on earth does using a real instrument make you more 'serious' about your craft? That makes no logical sense to me. The only thing that defines if you are serious about music or not, is your mind set, nothing else.

Also, have you ever considered that VSTs can provide 10 x more possibilities than using real instruments?

Everyone has different styles and you need to accept that. If everyone used real instruments, we wouldn't be producers...
I have no problem if you or anyone else wants to use real instruments in your production but how can you call DJ Mustard a loser for using virtual instruments with the amount of hits he has under his belt... He would not have got there with real instruments and he is not the only one!
It's ok to have your opinion but there's no need to call people who don't agree with you 'losers' or better yet 'poverty producers'.
If you could explain to me why you think producers who use computer generated sounds are all in a bad financial situation, I'm sure that would bring me some great insight.

I think you guys are misinterpreting the OP. I'm not saying that you can't use VST's, but I'm saying that more producers should focus their energies on using REAL instruments, as opposed to the same boring synths, and drum kicks. Now a days, it doesn't take much to be a music producer, all you need is a synth, MPC/Drum machine, and a couple VST's and you're set, which is why I'm so obviously pissed.

It's funny that you mention DJ Mustard, because he IS a loser, the beats he makes can be made by a third grader. His music is SO simple, and doesn't require much skill or talent, DJ Mustard gets by off of using "hot" artist, and by "hot" I mean GARBAGE rappers who currently have a big hype.

You're right! "VSTs CAN provide 10 x more possibilities than using real instruments?", but you should use VST's in conjunction with real instruments. It's gotten to the point where you have 15 year old kids making a living off of music because their mummy and datty, bought them a drum machine, after they've cracked a demo version of FL studio that they found online.. Is THIS where you want music to go to?

Being able to play an instrument proves that you have the discipline and dedication to sit down and be GOOD at something, there's no quantizing when you're playing live guitar, nor is there anyway to cheat learning musical theory. If more producers had the balls to master an instrument or two, the dynamic of todays music would change GREATLY. But they'd rather not, they'd rather play three chords and loop it, then add a heavy ass bass, and call it a "hit".. lol. This is why almost ALL of the songs on the radio, and "promotional" mixtapes, sound the same.

Producers are equally to blame for killing music, and part of this is because they're not experienced in music, they can't play an instrument. Inb4 some schmo calls me a "troll" because they make the same watered down remedial beats that I just mentioned above.

 

[Pumpthrust]

I think you guys are misinterpreting the OP. I'm not saying that you can't use VST's, but I'm saying that more producers should focus their energies on using REAL instruments, as opposed to the same boring synths, and drum kicks. Now a days, it doesn't take much to be a music producer, all you need is a synth, MPC/Drum machine, and a couple VST's and you're set, which is why I'm so obviously pissed.

It's funny that you mention DJ Mustard, because he IS a loser, the beats he makes can be made by a third grader. His music is SO simple, and doesn't require much skill or talent, DJ Mustard gets by off of using "hot" artist, and by "hot" I mean GARBAGE rappers who currently have a big hype.

You're right! "VSTs CAN provide 10 x more possibilities than using real instruments?", but you should use VST's in conjunction with real instruments. It's gotten to the point where you have 15 year old kids making a living off of music because their mummy and datty, bought them a drum machine, after they've cracked a demo version of FL studio that they found online.. Is THIS where you want music to go to?

Being able to play an instrument proves that you have the discipline and dedication to sit down and be GOOD at something, there's no quantizing when you're playing live guitar, nor is there anyway to cheat learning musical theory. If more producers had the balls to master an instrument or two, the dynamic of todays music would change GREATLY. But they'd rather not, they'd rather play three chords and loop it, then add a heavy ass bass, and call it a "hit".. lol. This is why almost ALL of the songs on the radio, and "promotional" mixtapes, sound the same.

Producers are equally to blame for killing music, and part of this is because they're not experienced in music, they can't play an instrument. Inb4 some schmo calls me a "troll" because they make the same watered down remedial beats that I just mentioned above.

Agreed. Totally.

 

[Pumpthrust]

That was to mock other posts of the nature.

You're just bringing a dope perspective to this forum. I can appreciate that. So many nonmusicians here, its frustrating. Welcome to the forum

 

[KonKossKang]

...Why...why is this, of all things an argument?Synthesizers and real instruments are two sides of the same coin.
Digital and acoustic devices created to generate noises and sounds.
Let's brag about 20 years of music theory knowledge.Yes brag about being in the field longer than I've been on the planet to justify such claims :/

Complaining gets nobody anywhere

 

[Pumpthrust]

Complaining gets nobody anywhere

Unless you're Bill O'Reilly.

KonKossKang make the track BANG!

 

[KonKossKang]

Meh, beats are easy.Everybody can do beats with little effort.Scales and melody practice with synths/instrus and stuff... the gap of guts required for this field makes all of this worth it though.

Hm...seems like that's the thrill for me.The difficulty.Like a noisy rpg of some sort I guess.

 

[98bullz]

Meh, beats are easy.Everybody can do beats with little effort.Scales and melody practice with synths/instrus and stuff... the gap of guts required for this field makes all of this worth it though.

Hm...seems like that's the thrill for me.The difficulty.Like a noisy rpg of some sort I guess.

But that's my point. Do you just want to be an "everybody", or do you want to be a SOMEBODY? It's okay to make simple mediocre beats/instrumentals from time to time. But if your idea of "production" are three chords and a bass drum, then please go with your poverty beat catalog, and I'm not necessarily talking about you (unless you're one of the poverty producers I was talking about), I'm talking to EVERYBODY who calls themselves "producers". I think playing an instrument for at LEAST 5 years should be a pre-requisite for music production. Too many kids hiding behind their gear, it don't take rocket science to loop a beat.

 

[Psalm]

I think you guys are misinterpreting the OP. I'm not saying that you can't use VST's, but I'm saying that more producers should focus their energies on using REAL instruments, as opposed to the same boring synths, and drum kicks. Now a days, it doesn't take much to be a music producer, all you need is a synth, MPC/Drum machine, and a couple VST's and you're set, which is why I'm so obviously pissed.

It's funny that you mention DJ Mustard, because he IS a loser, the beats he makes can be made by a third grader. His music is SO simple, and doesn't require much skill or talent, DJ Mustard gets by off of using "hot" artist, and by "hot" I mean GARBAGE rappers who currently have a big hype.

You're right! "VSTs CAN provide 10 x more possibilities than using real instruments?", but you should use VST's in conjunction with real instruments. It's gotten to the point where you have 15 year old kids making a living off of music because their mummy and datty, bought them a drum machine, after they've cracked a demo version of FL studio that they found online.. Is THIS where you want music to go to?

Being able to play an instrument proves that you have the discipline and dedication to sit down and be GOOD at something, there's no quantizing when you're playing live guitar, nor is there anyway to cheat learning musical theory. If more producers had the balls to master an instrument or two, the dynamic of todays music would change GREATLY. But they'd rather not, they'd rather play three chords and loop it, then add a heavy ass bass, and call it a "hit".. lol. This is why almost ALL of the songs on the radio, and "promotional" mixtapes, sound the same.

Producers are equally to blame for killing music, and part of this is because they're not experienced in music, they can't play an instrument. Inb4 some schmo calls me a "troll" because they make the same watered down remedial beats that I just mentioned above.

Thank you, I appreciate that you are actually having a proper discussion now.
I understand your frustration, you have spent 20 years learning and perfecting your music and someone with 2 years experience can come and in make generic sounding songs that people love, but the way I see it, if the music sounds good then it's good music regardless of whether or not the producer used any real instruments or even if he had any music theory knowledge. I just don't think it matters how a song is made as long as the end product sounds good.
I know there is a lot of bad music that is being put out due to this but on the same token there are also heaps and heaps of great music that is being created because music production is so accessible.

DJ Mustard was a bad example to use for the music's sake, I am personally not the biggest fan of his music either, but I used him as an example because he has been extremely successful with what seems like little music theory knowledge overall and no use of real instruments. If a third grader could make what he is making then we would all have made it big by now. Maybe producers like Dr. Dre, Pharrell or Timbaland, or even someone newer like hitboy is a better example. They have all produced really good songs that have no real instruments in them.

I am just saying it's possible to create good music without the use of a real instrument. If you don't like any songs with no real instruments in them then it is obviously just down to a case of your personal musical taste.
I think you are just butthurt that you can't create a great song after all the years of study you have put in and other producers are making great music with a quarter of the experience that you have.

 

[mycbeats]

More like a guy with over 20 years of music theory experience, playing both the keys, and guitar (acoustic, electric, and bass). Just because YOU can't play instruments well is no reason to go again facts, guys who play real instruments, and who have a DEEP background in music theory, produce better music than schmos who don't. If you just wanna be a play ground producer and make shitty hip-hop beats.. Then sure. All you need is a Casio keyboard and a drum machine. If you want to produce MELODIC, vibrant music, then you're gunna need a lot more than a MPC, and a key board.. You're gunna need to use REAL instruments.

Acoustic, electric, and bass are all basically the same instrument...

Try piano, guitar, violin and saxophone.

There is nothing wrong with creating music with instruments you can't play.

You think Mozart was able to play every section of an orchestra? At most he composed everything while sitting behind a piano.

Get off your high horse and put your music where your mouth is.

 

[98bullz]

Acoustic, electric, and bass are all basically the same instrument...

Try piano, guitar, violin and saxophone.

There is nothing wrong with creating music with instruments you can't play.

You think Mozart was able to play every section of an orchestra? At most he composed everything while sitting behind a piano.

Get off your high horse and put your music where your mouth is.

LOL brb, played saxophone from grade 7 to grade 10 in the Jr high/High school band...

And I ALREADY mentioned in the the VERY statement that you quoted that I play the keys (piano)... Soo I don't see your point O cheeky one.

As far as Mozart goes, piano is like standard stick shift. If you can play the keys, you can damn near compose anything.

Maybe you should try making music with REAL instruments, and tell me how easy it is. No matter what you say, you can't deny that ALL music is sounding the same now-a-days, and it's closed minded people like YOU, who are doing it.

 

[98bullz]

Thank you, I appreciate that you are actually having a proper discussion now.
I understand your frustration, you have spent 20 years learning and perfecting your music and someone with 2 years experience can come and in make generic sounding songs that people love, but the way I see it, if the music sounds good then it's good music regardless of whether or not the producer used any real instruments or even if he had any music theory knowledge. I just don't think it matters how a song is made as long as the end product sounds good.
I know there is a lot of bad music that is being put out due to this but on the same token there are also heaps and heaps of great music that is being created because music production is so accessible.

DJ Mustard was a bad example to use for the music's sake, I am personally not the biggest fan of his music either, but I used him as an example because he has been extremely successful with what seems like little music theory knowledge overall and no use of real instruments. If a third grader could make what he is making then we would all have made it big by now. Maybe producers like Dr. Dre, Pharrell or Timbaland, or even someone newer like hitboy is a better example. They have all produced really good songs that have no real instruments in them.

I am just saying it's possible to create good music without the use of a real instrument. If you don't like any songs with no real instruments in them then it is obviously just down to a case of your personal musical taste.
I think you are just butthurt that you can't create a great song after all the years of study you have put in and other producers are making great music with a quarter of the experience that you have.

LOL, I'm not butthurt. Once again, you're making up your own assumptions to attack me. Like I said in another post. It's OKAY, to have simple beats in your arsenal, that's fine. But when all your beats, are some weird synth, and a big booming bass drum, you need to re-evaluate you life...

On top of that Pharrell and Timbaland make PLENTLY of music with real instruments, Pharrell in fact was involved with band his whole life, and plays a plethora of musical instruments, further supporting my point that if you want to make GOOD/DIVERSE music you MUST be able to play an instrument, or at LEAST understand musical theory to the degree of someone who DOES play a musical instrument. True Dr.Dre has hits, and so does hitboy... But how dynamic are they? How complicated is it to recreate their hits? Aside from finding the right instruments/sounds, it's not very hard, they're all very basic in structure and if you have a BASIC understanding of musical theory, you'll understand what I mean when I said that.

I agree it IS VERY possible to create good music without the use of a real instrument. But how many people are doing that? Remember, that just because something is a radio song, or popular, doesn't mean that it's "good", that can mean anything from the fact that it was "marketed" well, the singer is "hot"(has sex appeal), the singer has a STRONG fan base, or MOST of the consumers of that music are retarded 15 year olds whose idea of GOOD music is a HEAVY base and a looped synth.

Why don't you just admit it, modern music is getting WORSE and WORSE and it's not only the artists fault, but also the producers. If modern producers spend as much time as they did playing in their DAW's to play with an instrument, I bet you the current wave of music would be more sonic-ally pleasing.

 

[Psalm]

LOL brb, played saxophone from grade 7 to grade 10 in the Jr high/High school band...

And I ALREADY mentioned in the the VERY statement that you quoted that I play the keys (piano)... Soo I don't see your point O cheeky one.

As far as Mozart goes, piano is like standard stick shift. If you can play the keys, you can damn near compose anything.

Maybe you should try making music with REAL instruments, and tell me how easy it is. No matter what you say, you can't deny that ALL music is sounding the same now-a-days, and it's closed minded people like YOU, who are doing it.

So if playing the keys means you can play anything, why not do that. If you wan't to create a saxophone driven track why force yourself to learn that instrument when you can load up a VST and play it on your MIDI controller, if the quality sounds crap then you can always pay someone to play it on the real instrument.

 

[98bullz]

So if playing the keys means you can play anything, why not do that. If you wan't to create a saxophone driven track why force yourself to learn that instrument when you can load up a VST and play it on your MIDI controller, if the quality sounds crap then you can always pay someone to play it on the real instrument.

As stated in another point, you don't have to be able to play everything. That's damn near impossible, and not the point of the OP. My point is musical instruments should be used in CONJUNCTION to VST's with a heavier emphasis on real instruments. Regardless, in the instance you need a saxophone you're better off hiring someone who actually plays, as opposed to using a VST, from my experience you'll NEVER find a VST that sounds EXACTLY like a sax.