Pro Tools help for free!!!

Ebony n' Brian V...

I have a buddy of mine that works at SAE Mastering that could do it for a fee for sure. The only thing is I don't know how much he charges (i can find out if you really want) and what your budget looks like. I can master it for you but not like he could. I just wanna give you the best opportunities. But give me a budget and I'll talk to him and see if can get him to do me a favor (a discount at least). Let me know.
 
samsungwhite: I am sure u have worked with large format consoles like the ssl. And im thinkin it must be a lot of fun. Because most of us only work ITB, i think a lot of folks do not really fully understand signal flow and what the process looks like outside the box.

Anyway my Q: I dont have any outboard gear yet, i love the simplicity of mixing ITB, but i would like to have the know-how of connecting stuff as well. So, how do you route pro tools` channels or any other DAW for that matter, to the ssl so you can process the track in your DAW further outside the box. Like- what does the process look like, both inside and outside the box?
 
Axxe...

If you have ever worked on large console's such as the SSL's then you know that all have a patchbay on the side of them. Every studio organizes their patchbay's differently according to what works with them the most. I can't exactly SHOW you how the Signal flow works but I can take a picture of a conventional signal flow of a SSL 4000 G+ console works in a recording to tape (or Pro Tools) situation (since that is the board your pertaining to).

If you ever get a chance to record your audio into an SSL i don't see why the engineer there won't take care of that problem for you. But in any event THOSE patchbay's use TT (Tiny Telephone) cables. You would route the signal from the Multi-Track Return's into whatever the studio has set up certain channels for the Pro Tools HD I/O's (it's also common that they don't use the digidesign interface and Apogee Rosetta's. Its a little industry seceret..)

For Pro Tools all you need to understand is this. The faders that your seeing from your mix window are ALL RETURN FADERS. Think about that. Your interface (if your also using a pre-amp) is actually playing as your "to tape" faders as well as the AD/DA converters.

What part of the country do you live in? Maybe you could come over to PHX for a weekend sometime and I'll introduce you to the studio that I work at. Its called Chaton Studios (you can visit the website at www.chatonstudios.com). It would be a lot easier to show you on a large console than try to explain it to you.

But in any event I hope that helps you understand a little bit more. As for the SSL signal flow chart, that is some really rare info to come by and I could sell that to you. Just give me a price. Please don't take this as me being a dick but I'm working on a book right now and i'm not even showing this in the book. Its not something you can get in a lot of situations (even for money). Its something that is earned when the engineer's before you decides that you deserve it and believe me, I had to do 3 years of hard grunt ass work for this.
So I honestly don't mean to be rude but since this is just a casual forum, I couldn't post something like that up. Most people actually don't realize the importance of signal flow but I know you obviously do (or else you wouldn't have asked me to begin with). If you give me a good price, I will also give you a very standard arrangement of the patchbay, as well, on SSL consoles and most patches would work into the signal flow. =)

But thank you very much for bringing up this topic! I hope you all understand the importance of signal flow. It can (in some situations...like mine) make or break your chances at being an engineer for the studio (and not just their *****).

Best Question so far~!
 
WOw, awesome of you to invite me to the studio. Unfortunately, I live in Norway so i cant just ``stop by``. And no, u are not being a dick when asking for a price for the chart. I might think that the chart may further confuse things for me though... I have never worked with hardware consoles. I do everything inside of Logic Pro.

I find it hard to understand how everything fits togther when mixing outside the box. Its like, i feel that a lot of people (me included)who are solely mixing inside of a DAW, dont really comprehend the ``whole thing``. You dont have to wire up anything u just click buttons. this is why i really cant envision how the setup u explained looks like, despite of u explaining it. I just wished i could sit down with someone for a day and have them expain stuff u know..

But as for the chart, if you think my amateur engineer mind would benefit from it, i will certaintly buy. I dont know how much its worth, but just PM me and we can discuss a price.

Thanks alot for answering Q`s - its really helpful

Axxe
 
Axxe...

I'm sorry that you have no one near you that you can go to for questions like this. I know that there are several studio's in Norway that have phenominal equipment. So instead of me charging you for something that you might not understand, why not apply for an internship or offer a studio a price for a learning experiment. We are actually in the process of organinzing a meeting (once a week) where a bunch of us (experienced and non) are going to meet up and exchange knowledge and for me to give lesson's for free in the Phoenix area. Maybe you can try to organize something of this nature as well. Most engineer's in this field are very forgiving and willing so i'm sure you won't have too much trouble finding the knowledge your looking for. Just be determined. Life has a funny way of coming together if you just have faith. =)

p.s. Norway is very beautiful. I hope someday my work will take me there and maybe we could even meet up. =)
 
So I realized this would be A LOT easier if we all meet up somewhere and did the Q&A's and I also have a little cirriculum that I can get everyone started on. So for everyone in the Phoenix area, I'm holding a meeting. So me and a friend of mine is going to organize a meeting at a place called The Street on Dobson and southern. Its just a little cafe. Nothing big, its just the only place that I can think of that won't mind a crowd. So if you guys want to finally meet me and just get some face time (and meet each other), then come down to get some of your questions answered and network. =). And of course ITS FREE (thats the whole point)!!! See you there.

Place: The Street
Location: 1116 S. Dobson Rd Mesa, AZ 85202 (Dobson & Southern)
Time: August 8th (Saturday) @ 4:30PM
To RSVP email me @ samsungwhite@gmail.com
 
yeah..hehe...every foreigner seems to find Norway beautiful - though i cant seem to understand why. haha...i guess its the fjords and mountains and all the nature..

it would be cool to be an intern, maybe i will. we`ll see. thanks for the info.

Axxe
 
I don't know if I confused any of you but I just wanted to let you all know that I am still on the forum and even if you can't come down, I can still help you all out to the best of my abilities on here. I just thought that if you lived near me then it would just be a good medium to ask me stuff in person and network. But I'm still here for everyone. =)
 
Hey guys just dropping off another tip…
Topic: Grouping
(pertains only to Pro Tools…. )

Did any of you ever get your faders at the perfect spot only to find out that you need to adjust them once again because it doesn’t match with the rest of your tracks? And maybe you don’t get frustrated at the time but you get into a situation where the tracks that you originally mixed doesn’t sound exactly like they did before and you have to slave hour after hour to get them to sound how they originally did just so they are up to par with the whole coherency of your mix?

Let me introduce you all on how to create “Groups”. Grouping is a function in Pro Tools that allow you to select a number of tracks, and when the group is activated you can move any of the faders in that group, and all others (in the group) will follow. Sounds simple (and it actually is!) but the amount of time and energy that this simple function will save you can be VERY useful. Also, in the function of grouping, not only can you keep your tracks better organized, but when they do move together, they are all moving in a logarithmic fashion (logarithmic basically means that the fader is moving in exponential factors so that the sound isn’t simply getting quieter or louder but is doing so in a manner that is consistent with the other tracks).

How to set up Groups:

• First, select all the tracks that you would like to be in a group by clicking on the track names while holding down the “shift” key.

• Next while hold down the “command” key, press the letter “G” (for WINDOW’s you would hold down the “control” key instead of “command”). This will open up the “Create Groups” window.

• From there, name your group whatever you would like (ex: chorus, verse, etc…) and assign whatever letter that you want the group ID to represent on the right of your name tab (this letter will show up later on the bottom right of the faders that you selected to be in the group, so that you know which group is paired with what letter you assign it to). On the bottom right of the “Create Groups” window you will see another window that shows you a confirmation on what tracks that are going to be in this newly created group.

• When your done with the previous step, just hit the enter key (or return) and now you have just created a Group.

You can confirm that this group has been created by looking at the bottom left of your mix window in the box that is titled “Mix Groups”. You should have two in that group. One that say “All” and other should say whatever you named your group. As another tip, to temporarily suspend your groups (or turn them off because your not always going to want them on) while holding down the “command” and “shift” key, press the letter G (Once again for WINDOW’s you would hold down the “control” key instead of “command”). You can confirm that your groups are on off by looking to see if the letter is next to your fader is there or not. Another way that you can confirm that your groups is on or off is by looking at the “Mix Groups” box and seeing if the group names are in a solid black color or a neutral grayed out color.

Hope everyone is having fun with their projects and if your stressing out about anything don’t be shy and ask!
 
I need your help i am thinking about gettin into pro tools and i have be using FL for everything (except for remixing i use live)

I think i need to use Pro tools but i dont want to get rid of my emu interfaces, any help??
 
chicitybeats...

First off, let me ask you, why do you feel that you need to get Pro Tools? Is it that you are not comfortable with the FL work flow? Is Abelton too much of a live performance DAW for you?

If its just a matter of what DAW your using, the question you should be asking yourself at this point is do you really want to take the time and energy to learn another DAW? I can tell you that for the most part, just because you get Pro Tools doesn't mean that your quality will be any better. Pro Tools is just an industry standard but sometimes standards are only "standard". If you get my drift. They aren't any better or worse than what your using. Its just a different type of workflow that your going to be dealing with. I can tell you right off the bat that Abelton gives you more features as far as beat production goes.

Also, if you do want to run Pro Tools, you must buy one of their interfaces or else you can't even run Pro Tools because it is a proprietary system (so your emu is out of the picture). I'm guessing you would want to run LE (something like an MBox 2 or 003 setup...) so you would need a digidesign interface. Might I also add that emu interfaces are really good to begin with. Digidesign interfaces get their pre-amps from focusrite (which are almost as bad as behringer's) and their AD/DA converters are some of the worst in the industry actually. You might be asking yourself..."well then why do all the pro's use it?" right?

It goes like this....
Pros just use the Pro Tools interface because you have to in order to "run" Pro Tools on the computer. But they don't use the pre-amp or converters built into the interface. They spend thousands of dollars for specific pre's that they like and for a converter that is really accurate on top of buying the interface (which is at least $10,000 to get a HD system up and running). But there are places that specifically focus on upgrading your MBox 2 or 003's components but that will still cost you about 600-1500 more on top of the initial purchase of interface. But like I said, thats what the pro's or serious enthusiasts use. If you just get a stock Pro Tools rig going for your studio, its not going to sound "bad" persay. Its just not going to sound any better or worse than what you got right now. Its not what you got, its how you use your knowledge with whatever is in front of you.

So I hope that helped and if you want to give me a specific reason then please let me know and I'll go more in depth into your situation.
 
samsungwhite said:
any DAW (Digital Audio Workstations) that you work with all share the same characteristics.
Click to expand...

word...

I just decided to stick w/ ProTools exclusively as my "main DAW" and leave Logic and Ableton alone...for now...

i think it's a lot better to master one DAW app before moving on to another...

(preaching to the choir, lol)
 
samsungwhite said:
I just happen to be Pro Tools certified
Click to expand...

which level?

how far have you gone?

Pro_Tools_8_Tree_no_bottom_text.jpg
 
F_or_Deaf...

Lol.... thats cool man. Well in any event I can help you more specifically because that's what I have to use at the studio anyways.

I'm certified at the 210 music production techniques level. Honestly though man, all the head engineers that I have worked with (and believe me, they are HUGE!) aren't even 101 certified and they know so much more than I do. I learn something new from them everyday and they have all learned from previous engineers and projects and, in my opinion, that is the true way to learn. Getting a certificate is just a little boost in confidence but from what I've learned, modesty is the greatest form of knowledge and respect that anyone can have in audio engineering and life. =) Certificates are something that the manufactuer's try and convince their consumers into thinking they need it but really its a scam into making them more money and in the end, it doesn't benifit you at all. Trust me, I learned the hard way. lol
 
F_or_Deaf...

Hey man. Sorry its taken me so long to write back. I've read about 3 books pertaining to Pro Tools (pretty much front to back) and I can't really say that I'd recommend any of them to you. The reason being is because they are all worded in a jargen that is way too complicated. Its almost like they don't want you to understand in a sense (and I try to perceive myself as one of those technical guys so that really says a lot). Its kinda funny that your asking me this because I've started to write a book specifically for hip hop and how it pertains to Pro Tools but I already made a deal with the publishing house and my deadline isn't for another 8-9 months. But how about this... (so i'm not completely leaving you in the dark) email me at samsungwhite@gmail.com and give me your number so that I can break things down for you at least in real time for whatever questions you might have or where to get started. The head engineer at my studio is leaving to Hawaii for the next couple of weeks for a project so I'm just going to be working on my book and some private projects for the time being and It'll be no trouble for me to have some detailed conversations with you.

Hear from you soon.
 
Dropping off some knowledge...
Topic: Pre-amps
(pertains to all DAW’s and Recording in general)

In today’s standard of music, the quality of your equipment is crucial to getting a quality sound out of your recordings. Most people think that if they have a really good microphone, than the sound quality will follow but the truth is that even in the most of basic home studios, they all need a good pre-amp as well. Let me put it this way, all great cars have a even distribution of horsepower and torque. You need both to complement the other and frankly, you just need both period. Same thing applies to audio. You can have a Neumann U87 but if its going directly into your MBox or 003, it just defeats the point. I’d rather advise you guys to get a good mic and pre-amp instead of a really nice mic and no pre-amp.

The function of a pre-amp is this...
In hip-hop almost 99% of the time you are going to be applying vocals on the track via a large diaphragm condenser. And almost 99% of large diaphragm condenser mics produce only millivolts as they transduce your vocal sound into electrical energy. Now the function of a pre-amp is to amplify that small weak signal into a level that is readable by your DAW (about 1.2 volts). Hence the term pre-amp because it amplifies your signal before (pre) your DAW where it is printed onto your hard drive.

The importance of a pre-amp...
If this is the device that “amplifies” your signal then it should start to be apparent to you all now that the quality of this device is crucial to your signal flow. Now although interfaces such as the MBox and 003’s have pre-amps built into them, digidesign pre-amps are, for lack of a better term, shi*t. They are built by a company called focusrite and although the company isn’t exactly “bad” the pre-amps that they put into the digidesign interfaces are horrible. So that is basically the reason that I’m telling you all to make it a point to get a good pre-amp. The reason that some are more expensive than others is basically because of the circuitry. Its kind of the same reason some mics are more than others. The components they use and how they are put together are just some of the factors that determine the price. But I guarantee you all that if you include a descent pre-amp into your signal chain then you will be able to hear the difference immediately.

But there’s my tip for the day. I know most of you are already using one but I just wanted to make it obvious for anyone that doesn’t. Keep up the good work everyone!
 
samsungwhite said:
if its going directly into your MBox or 003, it just defeats the point.
Click to expand...

i don't think the digi preamps are THAT BAD...

they might not "the best"...but they are far from "horrible"...

$.02

if digi's preamps are bad on the 003, then that basically means "most" preamps that are built into "pro-sumer" audio interfaces are less than desireable...right?
 
F_or_DEAF...

I'm just trying to make a point that by getting a descent pre, you will hear a huge difference in your recordings (even before mixing). But the digi pre's are pretty bad man. Not ALL audio interfaces pre's are bad but if a company is focused on anything with their interfaces, its most likely going to be the A/D D/A converters. I've just heard so many pre's and I just wish that I could show you what big of a difference it makes! lol... i hate that there isn't a way to put my experiences into a sound file. But you made a really good point. If you don't feel that your sound isn't bad then it isn't because at the end of the day, you are your most important critic.

p.s. Thank you so much for taking the time to fill out the questions. The book is coming along very well and I love it when I get questions like yours because it makes realize that I need to be more careful with my words. haha. I hope I didn't offend you by the pre-amp post. Thats the last feeling that I want anyone to experience from my words. =)
 
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