Boss Sp-505

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DJQRS1

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Is this a good FIRST sampler. It has up to 128 megs of memory a lmited sequencer a lofi effect a jog wheel for graphic sample editing auto chop. I heard some beats do on a 303 madlib and a guy named djandreas and their ish is raw. I think the 505 is better and wanted to if it is good. Is the pitch shifting decent?
 
its def better than the 303, but they both good first samplers
 
i had this friend when i first started getting into this stuff. and he used a 303 with some boss drum machine (nothing pricey) and i gotta say he had some raw beats.... i eventualy got into beatsmithing myself and started with an mp-7 then got a mpc 2000xl really cheap. the mp-7 is not a sampler it's more of a all in one synth drum machine seq. but it's great to learn on and i still use it alot.
if i were you though and wanted to start off #1 choice would be an asr x.
i just got my cousin (he's 15) into this and he got one for about 275 and it's easy to use has awsome fx and you can make your full beats on it.... good luck
 
no drum machine he used was like one of those dr. series

not a sampler
 
Yep. It's basically a SP606 without the Cakewalk software and USB.

Perfetly decent if you're looking to do DJ-style sampling.

-Hoax
 
i'm not sure if your confused by what i stated... the sp 303 is a sampler not drum machine persay. he used it inconjunction with a boss drum machine,it was one of the doctor series i think it was like a 660 or somthen...k.... p.s. if you wanna be pick i think it'scalled the sp 303 phrase sampler right?... i could be wrong ;-)
 
i have question about the sp505...
it has 4trks sequencer but
if i want to use it with ext sequencer, is it still 4 part..?

and can sp505 record/sample while it is playing drumloop or beat, w/o the sound of drums or beat that was playing..?
 
Yo, I started making beats (underground hip-hop ish) about 5 months ago and the SP505 was my first investment. Well worth it! For the price and functionality, I don't know of anything better. The alternatives are probably an ASR or a Korg Electribe ES-1...With the ASR you lose the sampling ability (from what I understand of it, which is limited) and with the ES-1 you can only do sequencing of 2 parts. Which basically means you can do a verse and chorus or intro and main beat or whatever...but tossing in a bridge, outro, or any sort of change is out of the question...so that sucks. The 505 only allows for 4 parts, but that is twice as many as the Korg and will give you what you need when you're starting to create full sounding beats with enough changes to make it interesting.

The question you have to answer with the 505 is how are you going to get the beat off the machine and recorded into another format (ie, a cd...so you can bump it in the ride or wherever)? Now, you'll probably be running your 505 into a mixer of even straight into a receiver via rca cables to get the audio playing, but your going to want a way to record it.

What I do is run the audio through a mixer and into my computer (the mixer is somewhat optional, you can do basic EQ'ing on the 505) and into my computer. I use the Tascam US-122 as my computer's audio input...that allows me to take RCA cable input into the computer (it is also MIDI capable--I think--and it definitely has those three prong mic in's as well). When I bought the US-122, it came packaged with Cubasis (now Cubase SE) which allows me to do basic sequencing, multi-tracking, mixing, and mastering. Cubasis also allows you to use VST plug-ins, if you want to do beat-making or effects in the software. Once I've got the track sequenced how I want, I convert it to an audio file and burn it to a cd...and boom it's done.

This may sound like a lot of pieces but here is the cost breakdown...

505 $300
US-122 (came bundled with the Cubasis software): $200
Used mixer: $120
--almost forgot the turntable
$50-400, depending on whether you want to be able to scratch or just use it as an audio source...
So, total= $800
And you can probably start with just the 505 and the turntable and be perfectly content (at least I was) for a couple months, before you'll have **** hot enough to want to share with yer peoples.


Obviously, there's lots of other ways to record it...mini-disc, cd-burner, tape, four-track...but none of those ways give you much sequencing, effects, mixing, or mastering control, if any at all. And, those are the areas that are going to take a nice beat and give it that "produced" feel. In fact, my next purchase is to get the next version up of Cubase which will allow me to mix a lot more tracks and will make sequencing a lot easier. But, for the money I've put into what I have now, I'm definitely way happy with the results I've achieved.

Another reason you will probably want some sort of recording/sequencing/mixing/mastering software is that it will allow you treat the song in a more linear fashion. What I mean by that is that you may have a beat that is 4 bars long and you only want a certain vocal sample to play once every 16 bars...Well you can either make the part 16 bars long then, which will take an assload of programming, or you can use up one of your parts to trigger it once every 16 bars. Neither option is very good. In software, that's way easy to do. You just drop in the sample on a new track and yer done. Still, I'd much rather use my 505 to create the backbone, basic parts of the beat because it is so easy to use in terms of programming a single part. As a beat plays, you can just hit yer pads and it will remember where you hit it. You can erase those hits or edit them as necessary. Very easy.

Oh...one other thing...if you buy the 505 or any other sampler, do yourself a favor and buy a good drum loop sample cd in whatever type of musical form you want to do. I spent $100 on a release called "Strictly Hip-Hop" from e-Lab and it was well worth it. Programming drum parts is time consuming and a loop cd is a good way to take that challenge out of the way when you start. Now I go back and dig for individual drums off of vinyl...but just as often I still use drum loops. Plus, with the 505 you can cut up those loops and re-assemble them ( use delay a lot to do that) and create totally new beats anyway, if you're concerned you'll have the same drum track as someone else.

And, get as much vinyl as you can...I make my beat off of samples from all sorts of ****...80's synth pop, jazz, funk, rock, classical, film soundtracks...whatever. The 505 will let you apply 30 different effects, plus once you chop it and rearrange it and put it to your drum beat it is gonna sound radically different than the original source. Some of my best beats come from unbelievably lame original songs.

So, there you go...a ton of info that may or may not be of value. Either way.

But my final verdict? Go buy the 505.
 
Or another way is to use all four tracks to sequence drums with kick on 1, snare on 2, hi-hat on 3 and cymbal/fills on 4. Then resample it and you got your loop.

For completely sample based hip-hop... in all honesty, 8 voices in enough to get it done. Look at this.
1. Kick - mono
2. Snare - mono
3. Hi-Hat- mono
4. cymbal/fill -mono
5. Bass - mono
6. Synth/Lead/background - Mono
7. & 8. Stereo sample phrase from vinyl.

You can squeeze hits and stabs and bleeps and whot-not whenever the kick and/or snare isn't sounding as well.

People whine when something is only 32 or less voices when most of the time they never use more than 14-20 (at once) for a whole beat and never know it. :rolleyes:
Even with their 128 voice workstations... lol
 
To put it more plainly, if you worked the SP-505 correctly, you could make 'Through the Wire' beats on it. :) :rolleyes:
 
Funny that someone mentioned "Through the Wire." I saw the Chaka Khan record for $1 at a record store and picked it up. And, while I got love for Kanye's music and production, that beat is nothing complicated. Not that that makes me like that song any less. Anyway, I made my own version of it (different drums, same samples) in no time at all. So, yeah, I can vouch for the fact that you could make a "Through the Wire" beat on a 505.

The process to make that type of beat is a lot different than how I normally make beats, though. The 505 has way more capability than that simple of a technique. Personally, I do a lot of resampling and heavy effects processing with my 505 and I rarely ever would just loop a sample to a drum beat. In general, I use the 505's Delay (especially), Filter and Drive, Flange, Flange and Slice, Center Canceller, Wah, Tape Echo, and the Isolator a lot.

Anyway, when I was researching what equipment to buy, I always wished that I could find a description of how someone actually makes a beat. So, in very basic terms, here is what I do:

1. Find a sample:
I use all sorts of different genres. The most important thing, I think, about picking a sample is finding something that is in the 85-110 bpm range. I'll use the 12% in pitch shifting my turntable gives me to get it there, but if it isn't in the 85-110 bpm range after that, I won't **** with it. When I am taking a few loops from a single source, I won't truncate them each down to size until I know what the beats per minute for each one is. Once I know what the variance is in the bpm between 2 or 3 different samples that are all the same number of bars, I'll use the BPM adjust and set it at an average. For example, if sample 1 is 92.1, Sample 2 is 92.2, and Sample 3 is 92.3, I'll set it to 92.2, since that is the average. If the BPM is more than a few tenths off, I scrap the whole thing and find a new sample. The 505 doesn't have the technology to compensate for the BPM difference without getting drums doing double hits and the whole thing eventually getting out of phase. Once I have 2-4 good 1-4 bar loops (usually from all sorts of genres on old vinyl), I'll start working with the drum track.

2. Matching a drum track:

I'll typically start by using one of the sample loops I really like and I'll see if it sounds good with a generic drum track (from a drum loop cd). The next thing I'll do is just try to notice if the kicks and snares on the drum track, match the sample's kicks and snares. If they sound like a match, I'll sample the drum track into the 505.

3. Tweaking the drums:

If I like what I'm hearing, I'll normally start with one bar of a drum loop and then I'll take that and chop it into quarters or half notes if I have 2 bars. You can do a lot with that and the delay function on the 505. I don't have any philosophical reservation about using a drum track straight from a sample cd, and I'll do it if I find one that fits perfect, but I prefer rearranging it a bit. I'll then mess around (sometimes using delay) and resample until I have a couple drum loops that I intend to use for the verse and chorus or whatever. After that I usually will try to resample the drums to get it all to a single pad--that way I don't have to use up one of the Parts.

4. Starting to build the beat (putting the sample to the drums):

I'll just loop that drum track and go back to my 2-4 different samples from the vinyl. As the drum loop is playing I'll start trigger samples over the loop to see if they sound better on the 1's, 2's, 3's, or 4's or halves and how long I should hold the gate for on each one, etc, etc. When I think I have an idea of how and when to trigger the samples on top of the drum track, I use the "live record" functionality of the 505 to save when I am triggering the samples--so basic sequencing.

5. Rebuilding the beat:

At this point, you essentially have completed what it would take to do a "Through the Wire" type beat. You've got a loop matched to a drum beat. Something like through the wire has no real programming on the loop, it just triggers the loop for 4 or 8 bars and repeats. But, I put too much energy, focus, and work into my beats to stop at a point when somebody could just say that all I did was jack a loop. And, even if it is sounding hot already, I'll be making it better with whatever I do next. So what I do then is start listening to the beat and figuring out how to rearrange it. A lot of it is just figuring out how to arrange 1/8, 1/4, 1/2, whole note sections of the samples I already have. This part is pretty tedious on the 505, because there is a lot of setting the time for each sample to play and then going back to listen to it and see if it should be a quarter note ahead or behind or how long it plays or whatever. But this is the part that is the most rewarding because this is when something starts to sound totally different than it originally did. Sometimes, it's as simple as playing the first half of my sample twice in a row and then playing the full loop. Sometimes, in the space of one measure, I trigger 5 different pads/samples and some of them might actually trigger at, maybe, up to 16 times. Depends on the sample. Depends on the beat. The more granular I get with it though, the more control I have and, consequently, the closer I tend to get the beat to sounding like what I want.

6. Resampling with effects:
I really like effects that dramatically alter the sound of the original source for 2 interrelated reasons. First, I like heavy effects because they obscure the original source material. Secondly, applying and setting effects gives me the control to make some plain sounding stuff sound crazy and processed. This might not be a plus for a hip-hop producer going for a more subtle, analog vibe...but for me, I like **** that sounds digitized and warped. Anyway, I've usually been experimenting with different effects as I've built the beat, but by this step in the process I'm definitely focusing on it. One of the ****ty things about the 505 is that you can't have the Filter and Drive set for sample 5 and the Wah, for example, on sample 6. You can select which pads to have assigned to the effect (so others on the same bank have no effect), but you can't have two separate effects on the same pad pank. So, that means that you gotta resample if you want to use more than 1 effect. This sucks. I don't see why Roland did this...it seems like it wouldn't be that hard to allow for multiple effects...but I digress.

7. Creating different parts:
I'll do steps 4-6 4 times for each one of the Parts the 505 allows. Typically, two of the parts will function as a beat that stands alone. Then I usually use the other 2 parts as changes to the other 2 main beat tracks. So what I mean is the second 2 parts will be mean to played in combination with a main part. So, I will just have more subtle changes...fills, flourishes, vocal samples, the same thing but with an effect--that type of stuff.

8. Figuring out an order to the parts:
The 505 allows you to set the sequence in which you play the parts, as well. So, you can play Part 1, then Part 2, then go back to Part 1 and add Part3 the second time around, etc. So, even though you only have 4 parts, you have all the combinations of them.

Right there you got your beat and it's just a matter of moving it to somewhere to record it, mix it, and master it.

Overall, I love the 505 and I think it can be used for so much. Its worth the $300 just for the effects. I had no sampling/sequencing/beat-making experience when I bought it and I'm happy with what I can do with it and then some. If somebody played me a beat I've made in the last couple weeks before I bought the 505 and told me that is what I could do with it, I would have been pumped.

The 505 is a complete enough product to really make **** from scratch, but even still I gotta say that I am in the market now for software to expand my capabilities. As a starting point, though, I totally recommend it.
 
I agree. That is a way of working I may need to check out. I am gonna get the SP-606...but the 505 has a place in our studio B set-up...
 
whimsicalpimp u certainly put alot of effort into ur beats, post a link of some stuff u made on the 505.

cos i use that machine two and im always curious to see how other peeps make the machine sound.
 
Trusty...how much is the 606 going for? I read that it has a USB and comes with some Cakewalk software, which sounds like it will dramatically improve on the sequencing capabilities of the 505.
 
messed wit the sp-606 at sam ash today,shyts pretty tight not bad,lovin the screen depth..pads kinda small tho

altho design was kinda flimsy from the looks
 
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