Time signature for game's/adverts/movies

Brownz

New member
Whats up guys whats the time signature used in adverts, games and movies? I would think it's 3/7 time signature?

And am I right in saying that a time signature is just how many bars per loop for e.g. 4/4 Would be a 4 bar loop? So it would be 3 bars/ then 7 bars then a loop back to the 3 bars and another 7 bars

Sorry if I sound noobish and also what tips would you recommend for advert music in terms of suggesting any synths to work with? Thanks
 
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Top number denotes beats in the bar. Bottom number denotes the count/type of note. So with 4/4 there would be 4 beats in the bar and the count is 4, so you're playing crotchets. 3/4 means there is 3 notes to the bar but you're still playing the same type of note, i.e. crotchets. With 6/8 you're playing quavers, and there's 6 of them per bar. 2, 4, 8, 16 being minim, crotchet, quaver, semi-quaver respectively.

Time signatures such as 3/7, where the bottom number isn't divisible by 2, are generally called irrational time signatures. They are tuplets, the most common being triplet. As the composer you can create any sort of time signature you wish, although if you're writing to score it's best to keep the people who are going to read in mind so as to make it easy for them.

Games, movies, adverts have various time signatures, which, i guess, solely depended on how the composer decided to address the scenes and the decision of the director or whatever as to what sound works best. 4/4 being less common in movies, or the ones i seem to watch anyway, but some composers still use a lot of 4/4, Jablonsky for example. In my opinion, those who aren't savvy with various time signatures get less distracted by timing that isn't 4/4, so if you don't want the audience to be distracted by the rhythm but still be affected by the music, stay away from 4/4. But that's a personal observation and maybe i'm completely wrong with it.

The synths would depend on the sounds you're trying to produce which would depend on the scene you're trying to set. So any are viable but not in all situations. Think about the feeling you're trying to evoke and the sound that would help you achieve it, then load up the type of synth that will help you to achieve that sound.
 
Ok so I will link this picture of my fruity loops at the moment:444time signature.jpg

So do you mean four notes per bar in that picture? So them four bars would be a 4/4 time signature if i'm correct? It would be just looping? and 3/7 Would be 3 bar loop with a 7 bar loop, sorry if I sound silly man I just never really understood time signature
 
You would never have a time signature with 7 on the bottom.

Time signatures: a quick recap

A time signature is simply an instruction to divide the bar into the beat (the number on the bottom) and to fill the bar with so many beats (the number on the top).

N
M
where N is any number
where M is any of the numbers in the set {1,2,4,8,16,32,64,128,256}

We usually only see the numbers 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 9, 12 on the top of most pop music time signatures.

We usually see only the numbers 2, 4 or 8 on the bottom of most pop music time signatures.

To further complicate matters we have:
  • Simple time signatures where the beat is divided into groups of 2 and each of these divisions are further divided into groups of two; and
  • Compound time signatures where the beat is divided into groups of 3 and each of these divisions are further divided into groups of two

Common Time Signatures

SimpleCompound
Duple2
2
2
4
2
8
6
4
6
8
Triple3
2
3
4
3
8
9
4
9
8
Quadruple4
2
4
4
4
8
12
4
12
8

We can have irregular time signatures such as 5/8 or 7/4, but the beat is generally divided into groups of 2 and so fall into the simple time signature category. Such irregular time signatures are often internally grouped in groups of 2 or 3 for counting purposes.

We can even have compounded irregular time signatures such as (1-1/3)/2 (i.e. 2 triplet half notes (minims)) - the top half of the time signature is a fraction used to indicate how much of the beat should be used within a bar. Most daws do not bend themselves to this concept....

However, some daws allow numbers like 3 or 6 or 12 on the bottom of their time signatures is that the sw was deigned by people who do not understand how time signatures are supposed to work and so created something to match their incomplete or non-existent knowledge.

These type of pseudo-time signatures represent a bar of triplet half-notes (minims) or quarters (crotchets) or 8ths (quavers); a bar of triplet 16ths (semi-quavers) in this framework would have a time signature with 24 on the bottom.

All of these obtuse interpretations would be better represented by the compound time signatures given above, shifting the number from the bottom to the top and replacing the bottom number with either 2 or 4 or 8 or 16.

The meat of your questions
Now to your main question: what time signatures are used in advertising, music for television series and music for films?

Simple answer: any time signature that takes the composers fancy.

Even bigger answer: there is no need to remain in any one time signature long - shifting meter is a very easy way to create interesting, unique music.

and your last question "so 4/4, your only allowed 4 notes per bar?"

No, you are only allowed 4 quarter notes (crotchets) per bar, these 4 notes can be divided into pairs or triplets or any other permitted divisions

Go read this extended tutorial on durations, rhythm and time signatures: Bandcoach - Time: Sounds, Silences, Signatures and Rhythm
 
4/4 means four beats per bar with the beat being quarter notes. Something like 3/8 means 3 beats per bar with the beat being eighth notes. I'm not sure where you are getting 3 bar loop then a seven bar loop from. And FL is only 4/4
 
Right I think I no what you mean now, so, 1, 2, 3 ,4 next bar 1, 2, 3, 4 next bar 1,2,3,4 next bar 1, 2 , 3 ,4 4/4 complete, loop? If im correct in saying that? and I'm not sure what you mean about only 4 crotchets per bar, sometimes I have alot more then four notes in 1 bar.

I thought time signature ment somthing else I just don't really understand when to actually loop a commercial track. E.g. Hanz zimmer, does he ever loop his orchestrals? Do adverts ever loop there tracks? and at what point do they loop? Or do they loop but use a different melody at the start of the loop and keep the bass the same?
 
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Right I think I no what you mean now, so, 1, 2, 3 ,4 next bar 1, 2, 3, 4 next bar 1,2,3,4 next bar 1, 2 , 3 ,4 4/4 complete, loop? If im correct in saying that? and I'm not sure what you mean about only 4 crotchets per bar, sometimes I have alot more then four notes in 1 bar.

NO
1-2-3-4 is a single bar of 4/4 - there is no length associated with a time signature beyond how many beats in the bar.

To say that you a have a 4/4 loop means that the loop is in 4/4 time or simple quadruple crochet/quarter-note time.

You can say that you have a 4 bar loop in 4/4 and what you wrote initially would then be true.

As for the number of notes in bar, the total duration of the notes appearing must add up to the number of beats x the beat value; if the time sig is 4/4 then you must have the equivalent of 4 quarter notes (crotchets) in the bar, no matter how you divide the beat. So if your bar has 4 quavers (8ths) a crotchet (quarter-note) and a crotchet rest (quarter-note rest) then you have a total of five notes but a total of 4 crotchets (quarter-note) beats

I thought time signature ment somthing else I just don't really understand when to actually loop a commercial track. E.g. Hanz zimmer, does he ever loop his orchestrals? Do adverts ever loop there tracks? and at what point do they loop? Or do they loop but use a different melody at the start of the loop and keep the bass the same?

Hans Zimmer has no need to loop his orchestral work as he uses a real orchestra to record form start to finish.

As for your other questions about types of music and whether they loop, that comes down to individual creative decisions....

Looping as an art form is down to what you want to use and when you want to use it - think in terms of structure:

intro
verse
chorus
verse
chorus
solo
bridge
chorus
verse
chorus
chorus
outro

If you were to compose the music for each of the above sections you would reuse the same material for similar sections: this is lesser form known of looping.

If you are using samples from other records you could use the same loop for all but the bridge or use a different loop for the intro and verse, chorus, solo, bridge. it is a creative choice. As to the length of a loop, that comes back to what information you are using: a chord progression needs to play out, so it will often times dictate the length of the loop. A drum break on then other hand may be 1, 2, 4 or 8 bars long (sometimes 3 bars).
 
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Nice one yeah I understand more, how the hell does hanz zimmer make that kind of orchestral then? he literally creates 3 minutes of the whole track non stop? hows that even possible? he must loop the same chord progression man or do somthing thats repetitive? 32 bar loop or somthing insane?
 
that is a result of practicing his craft and knowing how things fit together. There is a good chance that there are internal structural devices such as chord progressions or sequences, but in the main this type of writing is sustained my melodic writing and melodic variations, including partial or wholesale repetition of ideas in new key areas/chordal structures.

See this recent thread

https://www.futureproducers.com/for...d-very-much-appreciate-any-help-given-435276/

and this

https://www.futureproducers.com/for...ideos/14-tricks-improve-your-melodies-386637/

for insights into the realm of melodic creation and variation
 
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Nice one yeah I understand more, how the hell does hanz zimmer make that kind of orchestral then? he literally creates 3 minutes of the whole track non stop? hows that even possible? he must loop the same chord progression man or do somthing thats repetitive? 32 bar loop or somthing insane?
Wow. Just Wow.

It's called live music.
 
I no he uses a live orchestral but I am unsure how he is able to construct a whole score the way he does without it sounding repetitive
 
I no he uses a live orchestral but I am unsure how he is able to construct a whole score the way he does without it sounding repetitive

Years upon years of being completely submerged in music.

Don't forget, Brownz, that composing for orchestra is much different than making beats.* I'm not saying one is better than the other. But it's apples & oranges. Beats rely on some repetitive factors to allow the emcee to rap with a cadence and rhythm. Orchestra is just different. It's like trying to compare to a Rock guitarist... "how's he playing that guitar solo for 3 minutes?" (That kind of thing isn't even written - it's often improvised on the spot!). It's just what he does, and it's different than what you do. You put all your eggs into the "beats" basket.. he put his into the "rock guitar" basket.

Now, if you were trying to be the next Hans Zimmer - an orchestral composer - I would say you need to know more about time signature, and many different instruments, voicings, and how to write a score. But then you wouldn't need to know much about synths, 808 EQing, delay timings, and how to use compression. They're just different genres, with different needs.

*Of course, there are similarities in creating each genre, too.
 
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Wow. Just Wow.

It's called live music.


I'm going to have sit back and watch that start ot finish some time soon.

Even in the first minute you can see tricks that just don't seem to be in the conscious mind of non-live musicians - the tambourine on the hi-hat is constantly being activated ( the jingles are moving in time) each time the hi-hat is struck or moved up and down by the pedal. Add to that that drummer can then hit the tambourine and still have the hat come through and there you have tow very neat production tricks that you can't duplicate with a drum machine.
 
I'm going to have sit back and watch that start ot finish some time soon.

Even in the first minute you can see tricks that just don't seem to be in the conscious mind of non-live musicians - the tambourine on the hi-hat is constantly being activated ( the jingles are moving in time) each time the hi-hat is struck or moved up and down by the pedal. Add to that that drummer can then hit the tambourine and still have the hat come through and there you have tow very neat production tricks that you can't duplicate with a drum machine.
Ya. They're bad. The drummer Chris Dave does not use toms, all snares. He's a BAD dude. They jamming the whole set!
 
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