How do i count bars? (Yes google i know)

Status
Not open for further replies.

Moses619

New member
Hello everyone i'm learning how to count bars and in a predicament because i hear people saying that claps/snares happen in 2nd and 4th beat when counting bars. However i found two popular hip hop songs where that doesn't happen for their listed BPM. In that case, there is a discrepancy on that advice.

I created video demonstrating that the clap isn't happening in 2nd and 4th beat for Lil Uzi Xo Tour Life



Also this style of bar counting doesn't happen on Playboi Carti - Magnolia in which the song is at 163bpm

Please go and see for your self....i could be wrong
 
In general, yes, 2&4. There are other styles of music and other time signatures, though. In 4/4 time, there is also what's called "half-time," as well as different variations and syncopations (such as what you cited above).

Nonetheless, it is 4/4 time, and you can count the "bars" (or "measures") easily-- 1,2,3,4.

In your video above, you are counting twice as fast as you should, imho. Also, your metronome is out of sync with the track, which is causing you to hear the backbeat differently. It's still really 2 & 4.


GJ
 
But doesn't the metronome taps in every beat therefore you count by "beats" when counting bars? Ex. 1234-1234-1234 (that's 12 beats total for 3 bars)
If yes, then i would believe the counting in my video demonstration was right since i was counting the same speed as the metronome. Maybe i'm going twice the speed?
 
Last edited:
Your theory is correct. Your sync and counting weren’t. The backbeat is still on 2 & 4.


GJ
 
Another thing I notice, watching your video again... You are counting too fast; exactly double time, as I see it. You should be counting 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & ("one-and-two-and-three-and-four-and..."), but you are counting each metronome 8th note as a quarter note-- "1234, 1234, etc. ..."

8th notes counted as quarter notes will munk you up every time...

GJ
 
Another thing I notice, watching your video again... You are counting too fast; exactly double time, as I see it. You should be counting 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & ("one-and-two-and-three-and-four-and..."), but you are counting each metronome 8th note as a quarter note-- "1234, 1234, etc. ..."

8th notes counted as quarter notes will munk you up every time...

GJ

Yes i of course i know if i count in 1 & 2 & 3 & 4 & (i think that would be called half time?) that the clap will be on 2 & 4 beat. However going double-time (which i was doing) it won't.

I have question, if counting in half time would 1 & 2 & 3 &4 be total of 7 beats?
 
There's an "and" after 4, so no, 8 beats.


GJ
Sorry, yes correct.

In your example of "1 & 2 & 3 & 4 &" i believe it's in half-time speed if i'm correct, so the clap will always be in 2&4 but if you were going double-time speed wouldn't the clap be on the "3" always?

That explains why in my video i was always on the 3
 
Last edited:
Right. But you wouldn’t count it “double time.” You’d just count it where the major beats are— 1 2 3 4. The backbeat is always on 2&4 in backbeat music (which your example is). It’s just 4/4 time, 1234, snare/claps on 2 and 4.

Absolutely that simple. You were counting wrong.


GJ
 
Right. But you wouldn’t count it “double time.” You’d just count it where the major beats are— 1 2 3 4. The backbeat is always on 2&4 in backbeat music (which your example is). It’s just 4/4 time, 1234, snare/claps on 2 and 4.

Absolutely that simple. You were counting wrong.


GJ

I understand what is a backbeat now, i also watched a couple videos on backbeats. Thanks alot for helping me out with this, i really appreciate it.

Now i need to now my issue with counting bars in my video.

You said my metronome is out of sync. How is it out of sync? i don't understand what you mean

 
In "Regular Time" back beats are on 2 & 4. In "Half Time" back beats are on beat 3. In "Double Time" back beats are on the up beats or the "&" of each beat.

Most current hip hop "Trap", Future Bass, Reggae, and Dubstep are almost always in "Half Time". Which is why the BPM is so high at 155BPM. If you were to cut this in half and have it still feel the same pulse you would put the snares on 2 & 4.

So, you are correct that the snares (claps) or backbeats are on beat 3.

Hope this helped. If you have any further questions let me know.

Keep makin' them BANGERS!


Kyle Morris
 
If you listen carefully, it is slightly out-of-sync with the track at various points. It might just be a sync issue (didn’t start exactly on-beat), or it might be that your tempo is close but incorrect (154, 156, 155.5, etc.).

As long as you understand where the backbeat is— which is to say that you can find where the actual beat/pulse of the track is— you will be fine. Many people think that a track is “faster” than it is when they hear double-time parts such as shakers, tambourines, or other percussion, or the hi-hats and extra snare elements of trap type music that give it so much movement and forward momentum. But that is only because they haven’t understood sub-dividing beats and scope of tempo properly yet. You are well on your way now.

If the snare is on 2&4, then you can figure out where 1&3 are, even if there’s a lot more activity and syncopation going on in the track.


GJ
 
In "Regular Time" back beats are on 2 & 4. In "Half Time" back beats are on beat 3. In "Double Time" back beats are on the up beats or the "&" of each beat.

Most current hip hop "Trap", Future Bass, Reggae, and Dubstep are almost always in "Half Time". Which is why the BPM is so high at 155BPM. If you were to cut this in half and have it still feel the same pulse you would put the snares on 2 & 4.

So, you are correct that the snares (claps) or backbeats are on beat 3.

Hope this helped. If you have any further questions let me know.

Keep makin' them BANGERS!


Kyle Morris


I would strongly disagree. Many people say this about reggae as well, but in my humble estimation, they are incorrect. It is still “1, 2, 3, 4,” with the backbeats on 2&4. The rest is ear candy.


GJ
 
Last edited:
S
Maybe this can help. This is TM88 breaking down the track and you can see it he has it set to 155bpm. So you’re correct with the snare and clap being on the 3.
YouTube

While it might be correct to place the snare and/or claps on “beat 3” in your piano roll to achieve what is often called a half-time feel, I assure you that no professional musician would count the resulting rhythm with the emphasis on “3”— “1 2 *3* 4, 1 2 *3* 4;” they would simply count the rhythm as a normal backbeat— “1 + *2* + 3 + *4* +”... The reason things are done in “double time” is to make programming the percussive elements that propel the track, and are perceived as “faster,” easier, because otherwise you’d need to work with 32nd and 64th notes instead of 16ths. Again, this is really about sub-dividing and feeling the pulse properly. As a side-note, a.f.a.i.k., there is no such concept designated as “double time” or “half time” in traditional music theory; there _is_ however, the concept of cut time.


Watch this video carefully, and listen to what he says about “double time.” It is just a rhythmic illusion, nothing more:

YouTube



GJ
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top