Confused - would very much appreciate any help given.

ashinblu

New member
Hi, I'm an amateur producer (very amateur) and I've been using FP for a long time, but haven't posted. It's been an invaluable resource to me, and I was just wondering if I could get that help. I been doin' beats for roughly 2 years, on and off, but I am dedicated. (only reason I went off is due to personal reasons)

I wanna produce trap beats, or hip hop sampled beats, in the style of Kanye and Blaze, but not exactly like it, cuz i know each producer need their own style. But I also wanna produce in the style of Young Chop. I know very basic music theory, like what a scale is, what a chord is, and I've figured out some stuff on my own. The equipment is as follows:

Tascam US 144 MK II
Akai MPK 49

And Dell Inspiron 1545

So basic setup, I just started out. Though I did use a studio around the block, I knew the guy who owned it, but I moved house, so I can't use that anymore. Anyway, I'm confused about chord progressions, and melodies. Particularly, how do I know how to match up a chord progression to melody, and how to make a melody in the first place. Then how to make the chord progression. I know the roman numerals part, and going from the home chord and back, and some of that stuff, but when I make my progressions, I never know which chords to choose, when starting from the home chord. Moreover, I do not know how to make a melody. I spend hours attempting to do it by ear, but it never sounds good. Then I hear Young Chop made "3hunna" in 15-20 minutes, and I'm in awe.

I'm not looking to be spoonfed, so please do not take this the wrong way, however merely some guidance in the right direction would be greatly appreciated. I have googled, searched, bought books, read books, but nothing quite seems to answer my question. I have read Bandcoach's posts, upteen times, yet putting them into my own original ideas I fall short. I have made good beats, yet they are merely luck rather than deliberate action.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, and would go a long way.

Thank you.
 
I have rearranged your post to let me answer in a logical sequence....
Moreover, I do not know how to make a melody.

I spend hours attempting to do it by ear, but it never sounds good.

There are five distinct parts to writing a (good) melody:
  • Rhythm: sounds and silences
  • Scale/mode: different scales and modes bring different note choices to the equation
    • Major - natural minor - same note choices different home note
    • Harmonic minor and its modes - can have a dark and middle eastern feel depending on which mode is used
    • Melodic minor and its modes (if treated as a single concept) - tends to be more jazzy in feel
    • Dorian mode - minor with an upbeat nature
    • Phrygian mode - minor with a darker character, almost Spanish in some respects
    • Lydian mode - major with twist
    • Mixolydian mode - major with a lighter character.
    • Synthetic scales - each as its own identity
  • Direction and distance:
    • move up
    • move down or
    • stay on the same note
    • move by step to the next note in the scale/mode or
    • move by leap to other notes in the scale/mode or
  • Dynamics and expressive techniques:
    • Loud
    • Soft
    • moving from one of the above to the other
    • staccato: short notes
    • legato - smooth movement
    • accents - making individual notes louder than those around them

These can be reduced to just three ideas to begin with: Rhythm, direction and distance

In addition to these ideas, you should be looking to create a melody that reuses material either directly or partially.

A common technique for exam writing of melodic materials is to write an initial phrase.

[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/harmMel2-01.mp3[/mp3]

harmMel2-01.png


(yes, it is a rip of Beethoven - it serves to demonstrate the point to be made)

Then rewrite the phrase starting one note below its original starting note.

[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/harmMel2-02.mp3[/mp3]

harmMel2-02.png


Rewrite the phrase starting on any other note in the scale as well.

[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/harmMel2-03.mp3[/mp3]

harmMel2-03.png


[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/harmMel2-04.mp3[/mp3]

harmMel2-04.png


This creates contrast and similarity at the same time.

The contrast arises because the phrase will need to be harmonised with a different chord.

The similarity occurs because the phrase is still recognisable even if moved to a distant part of the scale - the melodic contour is the same even if the notes are kept in the same scale (tonal transposition) or are accurately rewritten in a new key (chromatic transposition).

A chromatic transposition keeps the intervals between notes the same as the original phrase:

[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/harmMel2-05.mp3[/mp3]

harmMel2-05.png


this has shifted the scale/key to D[sup]b[/sup] major

Just because this is an exam technique, you can still use it to create pop music - the techniques described are the same as those described in elementary texts on melody writing.

Anyway, I'm confused about chord progressions, and melodies.

Particularly, how do I know how to match up a chord progression to melody, and how to make a melody in the first place.

This is the key to harmonising your own tunes: matching chords to the melody.

Use the melody notes to identify the chord to use rather than writing a melody based on the chords.

You should use at least a bars worth of notes per chord unless there is some obvious reason to switch each half bar or each beat - i.e. you are changing chords for effect or you are changing chords to push the progression forward.

Regardless of the speed at which you change your chords, you should look to see how many times a particular chord is suggested by the melody

Here is a melodic fragment that is one bar long:

[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/harmMelFragment-01.mp3[/mp3]

harmMelFragment-01.png


The notes are C-C'-E-F-G-A-G-C'-B-A. There are many possible chords to harmonise this melody:

Triads that match each scale tone in the major

Scale tonePossible triadsExamples in C
1I | IV | vi CC | F | Am
2ii | V | vii[sup]b5[/sup]DDm | G | Bm[sup]b5[/sup]
3I | iii | viEC | Em | Am
4IV | vii[sup]b5[/sup] | iiFF | Bm[sup]b5[/sup] | Dm
5V | I | iiiGG | C | Em
6vi | ii | IVAAm | Dm | F
7vii[sup]b5[/sup] | iii | VBBm[sup]b5[/sup] | Em | G

In this case, we could harmonise the melody with
  • chord I - C major (C-E-G) as 6 of the 10 notes are found in this chord.
  • chord vi - A minor (A-C-E) as 6 of the 10 notes are found in this chord
  • chord IV - F major (F-A-C) as 6 of the 10 notes are found in this chord
  • chord iii - E minor (E-G-B) as 4 of the 10 notes are found in this chord
  • chord ii - D minor (D-F-A) as 3 of the 10 notes are found in this chord
  • chord V - G major (G-B-D) as 2 of the 10 notes are found in this chord
  • chord vii[sup]b5[/sup] - Bm[sup]b5[/sup] (B-D-F) as 2 of the 10 notes are found in this chord

The first 3 choices are the most likely

[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/harmMelFragment-02.mp3[/mp3]

harmMelFragment-02.png


Sus4 triads that match each scale tone in the major

A sus 4 triad replaces the 3rd of the chord with the scale tone above. It can be used as a colour chord, or as part of a larger progression where it resolves (moves towards) the non-sus4 triad and then the chord for which it is chord V (consider secondary dominant chords)

Scale tonePossible triadsExamples in C
1I[sup]4[/sup] | V[sup]4[/sup]CC[sup]sus4[/sup] | G[sup]sus4[/sup]
2II[sup]4[/sup] | V[sup]4[/sup] | VI[sup]4[/sup]DD[sup]sus4[/sup] | G[sup]sus4[/sup] | A[sup]sus4[/sup]
3III[sup]4[/sup] | VI[sup]4[/sup] | vii[sup]4b5[/sup]EE[sup]sus4[/sup] | A[sup]sus4[/sup] | B[sup]sus4b5[/sup]
4I[sup]4[/sup] | vii[sup]4b5[/sup] FC[sup]sus4[/sup] | B[sup]sus4b5[/sup]
5V[sup]4[/sup] | I[sup]4[/sup] | II[sup]4[/sup]GG[sup]sus4[/sup] | C[sup]sus4[/sup] | D[sup]sus4[/sup]
6VI[sup]4[/sup] | II[sup]4[/sup] | III[sup]4[/sup]AA[sup]sus4[/sup] | D[sup]sus4[/sup] | E[sup]sus4[/sup]
7vii[sup]4b5[/sup] | III[sup]4[/sup]BB[sup]sus4b5[/sup] | E[sup]sus4[/sup]

The sus 4 built above F is a [sup]#[/sup]4 and should be avoided until you understand more about voice leading and advanced harmony....

In this case we could harmonise the melody with chord V[sup]4[/sup] - G major (G-C-D) as 4 of the 10 notes are found in this chord

[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/harmMelFragment-03.mp3[/mp3]

harmMelFragment-03.png


Extend to the 7th

Scale tonePossible 7thsExamples in C
1I[sup]7[/sup] | IV[sup]7[/sup] | vi[sup]7[/sup] | ii[sup]7[/sup]CC[sup]maj7[/sup] | F[sup]maj7[/sup] | Am[sup]7[/sup] | Dm[sup]7[/sup]
2ii[sup]7[/sup] | V[sup]7[/sup] | vii[sup]7b5[/sup] | iii[sup]7[/sup]DDm[sup]7[/sup] | G[sup]7[/sup] | Bm[sup]7b5[/sup] | Em[sup]7[/sup]
3I[sup]7[/sup] | iii[sup]7[/sup] | vi[sup]7[/sup] | IV[sup]7[/sup]EC[sup]maj7[/sup] | Em[sup]7[/sup] | Am[sup]7[/sup] | F[sup]maj7[/sup]
4IV[sup]7[/sup] | vii[sup]7b5[/sup] | ii[sup]7[/sup] | V[sup]7[/sup]FF[sup]maj7[/sup] | Bm[sup]7b5[/sup] | Dm7 |G[sup]7[/sup]
5V[sup]7[/sup] | I[sup]7[/sup] | iii[sup]7[/sup] | vi[sup]7[/sup]GG[sup]7[/sup] | C[sup]maj7[/sup] | Em[sup]7[/sup] | Am[sup]7[/sup]
6vi[sup]7[/sup] | ii[sup]7[/sup] | IV[sup]7[/sup] | vii[sup]7b5[/sup]AAm[sup]7[/sup] | Dm[sup]7[/sup] | F[sup]maj7[/sup] | Bm[sup]7b5[/sup]
7vii[sup]7b5[/sup] | iii[sup]7[/sup] | V[sup]7[/sup] | I[sup]7[/sup]BBm[sup]7b5[/sup] | Em[sup]7[/sup] | G[sup]7[/sup] | C[sup]maj7[/sup]

You can delete the 3rd and add the sus4 to each of these 7ths as well, remembering that the sus4 built above F should not be used without careful consideration.

In this case, we could harmonise the melody with
  • chord vi[sup]7[/sup] - Am[sup]7[/sup] (A-C-E-G) as 8 of the 10 notes are found in this chord
  • chord I[sup]7[/sup] - C[sup]maj7[/sup] (C-E-G-B) as 7 of the 10 notes are found in this chord.
  • chord IV[sup]7[/sup] - F[sup]7[/sup] (F-A-C-E) as 7 of the 10 notes are found in this chord
  • chord V[sup]7sus4[/sup] - G[sup]7sus4[/sup] (G-C-D-F) as 6 of the 10 notes are found in this chord
  • chord ii[sup]7[/sup] - Dm[sup]7[/sup] (D-F-A-C) as 6 of the 10 notes are found in this chord
  • chord iii[sup]7[/sup] - Em[sup]7[/sup] (E-G-B-D) as 4 of the 10 notes are found in this chord
  • chord vii[sup]7b5[/sup] - Bm[sup]7b5[/sup] (B-D-F-A) as 4 of the 10 notes are found in this chord

Most likely choices are the first 4

[mp3]http://www.bandcoach.org/fp/audio/harmMelFragment-04.mp3[/mp3]

harmMelFragment-04.png


Try this set of ideas on the first set of melodic ideas that I used in this post (the Beethoven one) seeing which chords fit each melodic fragment.....

post your results for confirmation.....

Then how to make the chord progression.

I know the roman numerals part, and going from the home chord and back, and some of that stuff, but when I make my progressions, I never know which chords to choose, when starting from the home chord.

see this thread for more info Chord Progressions in the major - some tips and tricks

I'm not looking to be spoonfed, so please do not take this the wrong way, however merely some guidance in the right direction would be greatly appreciated.

I have googled, searched, bought books, read books, but nothing quite seems to answer my question.

I have read Bandcoach's posts, upteen times, yet putting them into my own original ideas I fall short.

I have made good beats, yet they are merely luck rather than deliberate action.

Any help would be greatly appreciated, and would go a long way.

Thank you.

Keep asking questions, particularly where something doesn't make sense.

Learning is a case of having a teacher or mentor present material, you apply the material, ask questions where you do not understand and seek feedback on your projects or exercises.

It is also a case of having material presented to you that is just a little bit harder than the last grouping that you understood - if we move the bar too high too quickly, there is a very real chance that you will not understand and be very unsettled/disappointed/angry as result.
 
Last edited:
Thank You!

Thank you Bandcoach for putting in the effort to make such a comprehensive and detailed help post for me, and others I'm sure. This is definitely appreciated, and I appreciate the time you put in. This has been so helpful. I will post the results for confirmation, however, I'm not sure when, because I don't have the amount of time I would like to dedicate to my music.


Once more, thank you so much.
 
Thank you bandcoach!! I've been struggling with my melodies as well. Trying to create chords and melodies all at the same time.
This opened up a lot of ideas for me. Cheers!!
 
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