what computer should i buy?

T

theblackstar01

Guest
hi im pretty new to this,ive been making beats for fun on my computer and stuff
but ive come to make some pretty good sounds,my problem is my computer cant handle the sound,its old,but im conflicted and plz i need help with this some ppl tell me to get a g4 mac
and some say get the imac, and i was told to get a pc,but i want to know what you guys thank is a great computer for me to start of with,b4 i buy my motif rack and mpc.....

cheers
 
For the most power for the best value, you are going to want to build your own. Something with at least 1 gb ram, 2.8 ghz p4 or similar brand, two hard drives (one for programs and one for audio) and a nice interface/soundcard. I get alot of my computer parts from ebay, just because they are cheaper and im broke. Buying an allready made computer from Compusa or other retailer is going to come with cheaper parts to keep the prices down, so you arent going to get the best computer for your money, and you dont get exactly what you want.
 
it depends on what software you wanna run. if you are wanting to run sonar, acid or FL then you NEED a pc as they are PC only. if you want Logic, or Digital Performer then you are in Mac land. Some products are cross platform and work on both. i use work loosly. Nuendo and Cubase are cross platform but perform better on a PC. Pro Tools runs on both, but Mac users get better treatment from digidesign.

as for power either will give it to you. for PCs the best way to go, if you don't have the patience or skills to build one yourself is to get a pre configured computer for music. http://www.adkproaudio.com builds excellent quality DAWs and also have budget solutions. if you want an off the shelf solutions the Dell Optiplex line is good. Myself and about 6 other producers and engineers I know are running Optiplex's for our Nuendo rigs.

If you are going the mac route then i'd go for a G5, even the base model. If you need to save money then get a Dual 1ghz G4 (they still gottem on apple website, and they are always up on ebay) and blow out the RAM.

whichever you use make sure you get a second hard drive for audio. either a second internal IDE drive or an external firewire drive. you NEED this for maximum performance.

also consider a your soundcard. if you go Pro Tools you dont have to worry because you HAVE to use digi hardware. BUT if you go with another software you will need a good soundcard. STAY AWAY from the Sound Blaster and such for an audio computer. M-Audio makes decent soundcards for small budgets. If you have some money to spend then look into MOTU boxes and RME. good stuff. I use a MOTU 2408mk3. it hasn't been perfect but it's been running smooth for quite some time now.
 
mlp has it dead on, however i prefer building my own pc. that way you know exactly what is in your pc and you know what you need to do to upgrade it later.

and as far as macs go definately if you have the money go for a g5, really any of them will do, but stay away from imacs, emacs and the like. theyre way underpowered and you cant expand/upgrade them for $#!+. Powerbooks and ibooks arent bad but make sure you get an external firewire or usb2 hard drive for your audio.

moogman is right about pc's being the best value. its sad but true, i sure wish they lowered the price of macs. theyd have a much larger following if they did. i know many people including myself have held off buying one just cause theyre so damned expensive compared to pc's. someday macs will dominate the market....someday.
 
of course pc's are the better value and you can build them yourself...
but for the reliability...
go for G5 dual 1.8ghz... it's sure expencive but absolutly great...
get logic 6.0 or digital performer with it.. as mlp said... (you've then got the ultimate system!)

but it's just a matter of what you prefer...

cheers
rich
 
Rick J said:
of course pc's are the better value and you can build them yourself...
but for the reliability...
go for G5 dual 1.8ghz... it's sure expencive but absolutly great...
get logic 6.0 or digital performer with it.. as mlp said... (you've then got the ultimate system!)

but it's just a matter of what you prefer...

cheers
rich
Click to expand...
I disagree with the reliablility part.
I built my Workstation over a year ago:
Dual AMD 2400+ = 2.0ghz x2
2GB ram
3 WD2000JB 200GB HDD
MOTU 2408MK3 Soundcard
Etc, etc... (See my site for full specs)

I have had NO Problems with my setup and it runs smooth as a baby's butt.
Meanwhile you goto any Mac Site be it Yahoo, Motu, Cubase any Mac site and you see people with lots of problems.
The same for PC.
I use Cubase SX which utilizes both my Procs. I also have 2GB of ram so VST's run smooth and 3 HDD which are partitioned a certain way. I also have a Dual Boot install one for home use(E-Mail, Internet, Networking etc)
and one with everything turned off and is strictly for Music.

The truth is, If you Build your own PC and do it right you will get better reliability and performance than any Store built Mac/Pc. Because your building a Customized Music Workstation not a Generically built PC/Mac.

But I do agree w/ Rich when he says, It's just a matter of what you prefer.
;)
 
mlp said:


whichever you use make sure you get a second hard drive for audio. either a second internal IDE drive or an external firewire drive. you NEED this for maximum performance.

STAY AWAY from the Sound Blaster and such for an audio computer.
Click to expand...

I know IDE drives are getting better, I would still recommend a SCSI disk over an IDE. I would go with an ultra160, I have one and it never bogs down. You are going to need a SCSI controller card as well.


The Sound Blaster series cards are for the guy who likes to play video games and listen to his MP3's on his computer. I wouldn't use one for audio work.

hope this helps!
 
For your soundcard, I suggest the M-Audio Firewire 410 for stationary use( even thought it's made for portability) and the M-Audio Mobile Pre for portability.
 
i wouldn't recommend scsi unless you are going with an ALL scsi system (scsi cdrw,system drive and audio drive). honestly scsi is not really necessary for audio work anymore. by the time you buy the controller card, drives and hot swap chassis youve spent a few grand when you can get the same or near same results with ATA or Serial ATA.

i have ide drives im my machine and i've had 70 tracks going at once in Nuendo with no problem. i work as an editor and ive had drum tracks with up to 8900 edits with crossfades in a 4 minute song spread across 12 tracks with no disk issues. serial ata gives even better performance than ide at a fraction of the cost. also, the new WD raptor serial ata drives spin at 10,000 rpms and are just as fast as scsi drives, still at a half the price of a 10k scsi drive. plus the sata controller is built into most new motherboards.
i spent a LOT of time researching all of my options, and i went with an IDE setup. no problems in over a year. when i upgrade i'll probably go with serial ata.
 
Same Here.
3 WD2000JB-SE 200GB Hardrives and never ahd any disk issues.
We're not saying IDE gives better performance but why spend the xtra $$$$ if you don't need to.
7200RPM is fine but 10k is just that much better at a fraction of the price.
Put the xtra $$$ into Ram a 2nd/3rd HDD or add it into getting a better soundcard.
 
I think building your own computer is def. best for audio. But that doesn't mean you gotta build it yourself. There are plenty of sites where you can "build" the computer, configure what you want in it and they'll assemble it for you. I recommend looking at sites of DAW builders like ADK,PC audio labs,central computer and see what components they use in their DAWs to get an idea of what is proven to be good for audio, in terms of motherboard and processors, especially.Then you can go to other,less expensive custom computer sites to order the same components. Check out price101.com or monarchcomputer.com or leadcomp.com for this.A couple of forums that are great for resources are Homerecording.com and recording.org.
 
mlp said:
i wouldn't recommend scsi unless you are going with an ALL scsi system (scsi cdrw,system drive and audio drive).
Click to expand...

You dont have to build a whole SCSI system to record audio, that would be plain dumb! You only need a drive to handle the recorded audio, thats all!!

You dont need a SCSI burner unless you have a few of them burning multiple disks at once. And you really dont even need that. IDE burners are fine too.


by the time you buy the controller card, drives and hot swap chassis youve spent a few grand when you can get the same or near same results with ATA or Serial ATA.
Click to expand...


Are you crazy? Spend a few grand? You need to do some research my friend.
I just helped my friend put a SCSI setup in his computer. He has (the same as me) an Adaptec ultra160 controller card and a 17GB seagate ultra160 Hard Disc. It only cost him around $200 brand new, for the whole set-up and it works perfectly.

i have ide drives im my machine and i've had 70 tracks going at once in Nuendo with no problem.
Click to expand...

What were you recording a whole symphony orchestra?
Who the hell uses 70 tracks?

If you did have "70 tracks" I seriously doubt they were ALL playing at the exact same time or your drive would of froze.

Later!
 
i dont know where you got thousands of dollars either. i just looked and a 73.4 gb 10k rpm drive is just about $400 and controller cards are around $100. make sure you have your facts straight before you give advice. as for me, im running on ata-133 drives and have major issues playing back more than 25 tracks at once so i dont see how you can have 70 tracks running at once unless you have a raid setup. and i dont see the point in setting up a raid with ide drives, maybe for sata but it doesn't seem like it would help much for older drives and technologies other than scsi.
 
I can get 32+ tracks out of my 5400rpm drives :P.

But at the moment for most users SATA drives raid mode 0 on the ICH5 is more than enough for any work. Used properly that'll get 100 tracks off it.

SCSI still has its place for really heavy work and with 18GB 10k drives under $80AUD a few of those and a raid controller would make a tasty audio drive.
 
CubaseRox said:


You dont have to build a whole SCSI system to record audio, that would be plain dumb! You only need a drive to handle the recorded audio, thats all!!

You dont need a SCSI burner unless you have a few of them burning multiple disks at once. And you really dont even need that. IDE burners are fine too.





Are you crazy? Spend a few grand? You need to do some research my friend.
I just helped my friend put a SCSI setup in his computer. He has (the same as me) an Adaptec ultra160 controller card and a 17GB seagate ultra160 Hard Disc. It only cost him around $200 brand new, for the whole set-up and it works perfectly.



What were you recording a whole symphony orchestra?
Who the hell uses 70 tracks?

If you did have "70 tracks" I seriously doubt they were ALL playing at the exact same time or your drive would of froze.

Later!
Click to expand...

first, the major benefit of scsi is its speed. you can get WD serial ata raptor drives that spin at 10k rpm and have an average seek time of 4.5 ms which is about that of scsi. and at half the price. most new motherboards support at least 2 sata drives. you could run two raptors in raid 0 if you really needed the speed.

second, the reason to go all scsi is the protocol itself. scsi allows for disk multitasking. meaning that your os drive can seek while your audio drive writes, with no interruptions. ide protocol does not allow multitasking. so when the IDE drive seeks, the rest of the system slows down while the seek is made. that defeats the point of scsi. one of the reasons that it has been a staple in the recording industry so long is due to the fact that is can multitask.

as for price a good scsi system, even without going all scsi will cost you. the card itself will run a couple hundred bucks. a good scsi drive with a decent size will run you about 5 hundred (74 gig cheetah). sorry boss, but 17 gigs doesnt hold a lot of audio. the studio where i used to staff used 36 gig drives and almost ALL of the sessions would have to have several drives around because the 36 gig drives couldnt hold an albums worth of music. ALSO, scsi drives produce more heat than standard ide drives. this is one of the reasons most studios have their drives in an external chassis. a good single bay chassis will run you close to a grand, plus you gotta buy the caddy to put the drive in. then you gotta buy cabling and terminators. easily in the thousands.

im not sayin that scsi isnt a valid option. my point is, if you are gonna spend the money on scsi, then do it right or you wont reap the full benefits of a scsi system.

plus the scsi card will sit on your pci bus. hogging the same bandwidth that your audio card is using. and if you have a PCI card like the UAD for fx, or a firewire card on the bus that is a recipe for trouble. keep as much off of that PCI bus as possible.

as for my track count, it was a LARGE pop session with real drums, programmed drums, loops, synths, bass, synth bass, guitars, and stacks and stacks of vocals. you are correct about not having all 70 tracks playin the whole time, BUT the fact that most of these files were accessed at different times on the same drive while about 20 of the tracks played all the way through speaks of IDE drives capabilities. especially since the drums (16 tracks) had 4600 edits across them all with crossfades.
 
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scsi allows for disk multitasking. meaning that your os drive can seek while your audio drive writes, with no interruptions. ide protocol does not allow multitasking. so when the IDE drive seeks, the rest of the system slows down while the seek is made.
Click to expand...

What are you talking about??? I have had tracks playing accessing the SCSI disk, while my samples and other tasks were being accessed from my IDE disk. No problems nor interruptions there.

the card itself will run a couple hundred bucks. a good scsi drive with a decent size will run you about 5 hundred (74 gig cheetah).
Click to expand...

Where are you getting your prices from?
I just looked up a 73gb ultra320 seagate for $170 and the controller card costs about the same, and thats for the ultra320. So overall your spending around $500 for the set-up.

sorry boss, but 17 gigs doesnt hold a lot of audio.
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For a commercial studio yes but for me thats fine. I have several audio projets in the computer now @ 24bit, and still have over 30 Hrs of recording time left. When a project is finished, it gets backed-up. Did you ever hear of CD-R's? There is no need to keep it in the computer when it is finished.

scsi drives produce more heat than standard ide drives. this is one of the reasons most studios have their drives in an external chassis. a good single bay chassis will run you close to a grand.
Click to expand...

My SCSI drive is directly attached right under my OS drive and heat doesnt seem to cause any problems. Did you ever hear of proper cooling?
If what you are saying is true , my sh*t should of burned out a while ago I guess.

{quote]plus the scsi card will sit on your pci bus. hogging the same bandwidth that your audio card is using.[/quote]

Incorrect! I have no problems at all!

as for my track count, it was a LARGE pop session with real drums, programmed drums, loops, synths, bass, synth bass, guitars, and stacks and stacks of vocals. you are correct about not having all 70 tracks playin the whole time, BUT the fact that most of these files were accessed at different times on the same drive while about 20 of the tracks played all the way through speaks of IDE drives capabilities.
Click to expand...

See I can have all 70 tracks playing at once. In fact, my drive was tested to have the ability to write 128 tracks simultaneously and read I believe 3 times that number. (if my memory is correct). So wouldnt it be better to invest a few more dollars and get a high performance audio disk in your computer?

Summary: Any problems you state can happen, dont exist in my PC, nor any computer that i've seen house the SCSI set-up like myself.


Overall: You get an F as your grade in the field of SCSI. And an F in pricing.

Sorry! we regret to inform you that your final grade is F. I suggest you do some research on SCSI drives vs ATA's and pricing and I will re-test you in the future!
 
im not gonna keep arguing, but you are wrong on most counts.

where are you buying your hardware?
 
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