Please help me get into hardware!

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Pson101

New member
Peace to all FP fam.

So I been producing for a while now, but only using software like Ableton Live, Reason 3.0, FruityLoops, SoundForge, etc...
I want to take my stuff to another level, since I feel like I'm missing something... maybe the organic feel that hardware transmits.
I'm really ignorant in this matter so I hope y'all enlightened heads can help me out!

I want to build a home-production studio, on a low budget:
-I would like to get a sampler/editor to sample, play and edit drums or breaks and loops (MPC vs SP?) (stuff like DJ Premier, RZA, Beatminerz, Pete Rock use)
-A keyboard to play some synth and melodies (Korg vs ASR-10?) (stuff like J.Dilla, Just Blaze, Dr. Dre, Illmind use)
...and other stuff I might not know of! I guess I will need a turntable to sample from vinyl, and I don't know what the hell monitors are, nor "16 track"...

Also soundcards: I guess I should go for Pro Tools? Which model y'all recommend that includes a good soundcard on a low price?

Obviously I plan to study on this, buy books and all... but I just want to know what the general feel is before, to know better where to head at when buying material.

Hope y'all can help,
PEACE
 
What’s wrong with Ableton Live, Reason 3.0, Fruity Loops,
If you need something to feel on you can get midi controls
Like a midi keyboard or midi pad control.

but what your budget you trying to work with
 
Yes I see what you mean, you do have a point. My plan is to continue workin' on FL & Reason, but using an MPC or SP to make my samples more organic and hard hitting, a nice and simple MIDI keyboard to play basslines and melodies, and sampling from vinyl.
AND a very good soundcard is a must: I see like 5 different versions of ProTools but I just don't know which ones are recommended... plus the HD ones start at 8000 dollars.

The budget... hum maybe between 5000 and 10000 USD.

What do you reccomend me? And what the hell are monitors lol...

Thanks for the reply.
 
This is what I think of your budget..............:bigeyes:


LEts see what we can do.

If you wanna do things like Rza, he has roland products that he likes to use. If u wanna get real serious, u could go for an MV8000, or maybe even the newer version. I would settle for an MC909, but yea, rza uses an MV8000 sumtimes.


What are u trying to produce? R&B? If so i would go with a yamaha motif. BUt if you want more of a dirty sotuh vibe, go wit a roland fantom as a keyboard. Tritons are kewl to, its all on what you want.


I would throw some monitors in there to if you want an accurate mix. Try some Krk`s. You can get the RP5`s to save money, but any of the KRK`s are great monitors.

For your soundcard, I would settle for http://www.zzounds.com/a--2676837/item--MDOAP192
assuming that your using a computer to seqence your hardware.

And any turntable is kewl, just as long as it has a line out so you can get it to your comp and sample into some program like Audacity.

shoot, i think im missed your 10,000 budget, lol. I didnt go over it. This is my oppinion, you can change stuff around, but this`d be a good setup for me. Maybe a mixer and some sound modules would help, but thats basically what I would do with the "small budget" you have.

HAVE FUN!!!! I KNOW I WOULD!!!! ^_^
 
Chi said:
This is what I think of your budget..............:bigeyes:


LEts see what we can do.

If you wanna do things like Rza, he has roland products that he likes to use. If u wanna get real serious, u could go for an MV8000, or maybe even the newer version. I would settle for an MC909, but yea, rza uses an MV8000 sumtimes.


What are u trying to produce? R&B? If so i would go with a yamaha motif. BUt if you want more of a dirty sotuh vibe, go wit a roland fantom as a keyboard. Tritons are kewl to, its all on what you want.


I would throw some monitors in there to if you want an accurate mix. Try some Krk`s. You can get the RP5`s to save money, but any of the KRK`s are great monitors.

For your soundcard, I would settle for http://www.zzounds.com/a--2676837/item--MDOAP192
assuming that your using a computer to seqence your hardware.

And any turntable is kewl, just as long as it has a line out so you can get it to your comp and sample into some program like Audacity.

shoot, i think im missed your 10,000 budget, lol. I didnt go over it. This is my oppinion, you can change stuff around, but this`d be a good setup for me. Maybe a mixer and some sound modules would help, but thats basically what I would do with the "small budget" you have.

HAVE FUN!!!! I KNOW I WOULD!!!! ^_^
Click to expand...

LMAO :D you crazy man... but thank you very much for the reply :)

So basically you think a Roland MV model sh*t's on any MPC or SP-1200? I know what you mean though, I forgot that one... RZA would not exhange his Roland MV for nothing, neither Pete Rock with his MPC nor Da Beatminerz with their SP-1200!

I'm trying to produce hardcore Rap (Pete Rock, RZA, Stoupe, DJ Premier) mixing some more commercial flavor (Just Blaze, Neptunes, J.Dilla), I mean depending on the beats ;) I know The Neptunes use a Korg Triton keyboard, while others the ASR-10.
I just wanted a keyboard to drop some ill basslines or some synth over samples, I don't plan using it to produce tunes from scratch. So a simple keyboard would be nice!

And thanks for the M-Audio soundcard, I'll definatly go with that since it seems great! Yes a PC is what I'm using, and I will keep using software as well.

Thanks for all your tips, I appreciate that a lot!
RESPECT man!
 
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No prob.


I mean, if you just want some nice synths and some good stuff for basslines, u could alwayz save space and get a nice sound module, like a motif es rack which dont go for too much (especially if u get it on ebay.)

I just really like da MV because it comes wit Roland sounds. I think an MPC just comes wit drum sounds (like, da roland will have synths I thinK.)

Roland Fantom is really good for makin some manny fresh soundin beatz, considering thats what he uses, lol. He uses alot of stuff though, u might wanna download da minimouge VST online somewhere, dat makes a good sound.
 
hmmmmm with a $10k budget there is alot you can do. Honestly I would start with what you need first though. What type of room are you working with? Is it treated? If not that would be a good place to start. Then get yourself a quality pair of monitors. KRK are nice but if you are working with that kind of budget at least step it up to HR824's. Then as far as recording goes I would just get a digi 002 setup and call it a day. The one with the control surface. Then for hardware. This is what I would probably get.

MPC3k.
Rackmount sampler that supports multisamples.
Motif, Triton or Fantom module or modules.
Analog or analog modeling synth.
You got plenty of choices for a turntable.
A nice controller. Maybe CME?

I know it's kind of general but it all really comes down to preference. I like the older MPC's because they were built better than the newer ones. If you want that grit you could go with a 60. The sp-1200 has a dope sound but it's still pretty expensive and is really limited. I would only use it for drums.
 
I was in a similar situation about a month ago. I was using Reason, Ableton, and SoundForge (to record from decks). I started switching to hardware and did a lot of research on what to get -- before you spend $10K, I really recommend you spend some time researching. I love the FP board for advice, but nothing beats spending a lot of time researching reviews and spending time in the store figuring out what you need.

I ended up getting a Focusrite Saffire soundcard/interface because the recording quality was higher than others in its price range (about $3-400). I highly recommend it after using it, but I wish there were more inputs. My reading was not all that favorable to Mbox Pro 2. I don't want to start a debate, but I wanted to use Ableton and a good interface for that... if Pro Tools is your route, more power to you. It is an industry standard.

I went with a Motif ES8. I checked out the Triton Extreme and Fantom, but at the end of the day, you can customize a machine the way you want it over time and I liked the feel of the Motif better. But, it was a hard choice - I think any of the 3 you'll be off to a good start, just make sure you've used it and like the feel.

I bought KRK monitors (which to answer your question, are speakers designed to get an accurate sound out of your production). I went with V6's. They suit me very well, but as someone else said, if you have more cash, you may go with something better. I just recommend NOT getting M-Audio monitors... after sitting in the store going back and forth, there are far better ways to spend your money.

I still use Reason - rewired into Ableton, and use Ableton as the main sequencer, with hardware going into it as well as Reason. You can use a good controller to control reason and Ableton, and use each of Reason's intruments as "hardware" and record independently in Ableton.

There are a ton of options and with your budget, just make sure you don't rush out and buy stuff because you heard it was good. Get the stuff that suits you and your style so you don't end up re-buying stuff you already spent cash on.
 
@ Chi: I definatly feel you. I don't plan in buying sound modules right away, but after seeing an interview with RZA about the MV8000 I think I'm gonna pay more attention to Roland equipment. The MV8000 and the Fantom module are now strong possibilities!
I plan to make drums an important feature on my production style, so I might look for an SP-1200 as well. Thank you again homie! :)

@ Cameron Thomas: Thank you very much for all the tips, KRK monitors are what I'll look for, as well as properly isolating the room hehe... at a later phase I'll also look for a rackmount sampler and analog modeling synth, since I don't find them indispensable right now.

@ Ray Chappell: Glad you stop by to help me as well, even better if you were in the same situation, that way you know perfectly what I'm talkin' about!
Definatly, knowledge first, practice second. No point in buying all this if I can't handle them. I plan to carefuly study each machine, I just made this thread to know the specific hardware I should focus on!
I just added the Focusrite Saffire to my soundcard list, since I never heard of it. Thank you for that tip. KRK monitors and the modules you examplified confirmed what the other posters told, so I'll keep that in mind! Thank you again for your input.

So I know I have to go for KRK monitors, and either an M-Audio soundcard, a ProTools interface or the Focusrite Saffire. For samplers/sequencers the ones recommended are the Akai MPC, E-mu SP1200 or the Roland MV8000, while MIDI keyboards point to Korg TRITON, Yamaha MOTIF or Roland FANTOM. I thank you all a thousand times since I have multiple possibilities to go for and I feel they are indeed the best.
And you all got a point on that preference tip. What I REALLY want is make my drums sound as hard-hitting as Pete Rock's, chopping and arranging samples (really play around with them) like DJ Premier, throwing earthshaking basslines like Da Beatminerz, playing some ill synth reminiscent of Ayatollah or J.Dilla, all retaining RZA's undeground grittiness. Any final words on this, considering the possibilities on the table?
 
Oh yeah, don't forget about room treatment. If you have some cash, and you're investing into professional equipment, treating the room to get accurate sound is really important! Check for posts on here from MASSIVE, he has been a huge help to me and room treatment - to make sure your room sounds accurate when you are producing - seems to be the one thing that is overlooked when setting up a home studio. I'm just starting treatment, and jusy by moving my loudspeakers and monitors, I've noticed that tracks sound far different (more accurate).

Good luck! Let us know what you end up going with. :cheers:
 
I will definatly pay attention to room treatment, now that I think of it you do have a big point! Getting the max of the sound is a must. Massive? I will definatly dig and check his posts then! Thank you very much for all your tips, I appreciate that a lot :)

Yes indeed, I will let y'all know what I will get, though it may take some time ;) and good luck to you as well with the isolation and everything, keep me posted on your career!

Thank you again, stay blessed.
 
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Ok judging from the sound you are saying you want I would do this.

MPC60II or SP-1200 - These are the units you are gonna get that good old hip hop grit from. I would personally go for the MPC60. It's a little more advanced as far as features. Pete Rock uses the 2k but I would recommend the previous units if grit is what you are after. You can chop your samples manually from the vinyl. Dilla worked with the 3k and I believe Premiere does too. The 3k won't give you grit but it has a little warmth to it. With the limited sample time I would try to just use these units for drums and use a rackmount sampler for vinyl chops and loops.

The reason I recommend a rackmount sampler. - The only MPC that supports multisamples is the 4k. The MV-8000 supports them as well but you aren't going to get the same grit or warmth from these units as you will from an older MPC or SP. You can find rackmounts pretty inexpensively and it will increase your sampling time for vinyl chops.

Rackmount module - I would go with a rackmount module and a midi controller opposed to a full on workstation. You don't need to pay for those sequencing features if you aren't going to use them. I believe the Fantom module samples and supports multisamples so you could ex the rackmount module off your list by going that route.

Analog or Modeling Synth - If you want nice deep bass and crazy synth sounds that's how you're gonna get those. Even if it's just a Microkorg or MS2000.

I beg of you to please consider the room you work in and monitoring first...lol Even with all the gear in the world if you can't hear what you are making correctly it's not going to sound good. Room treatment first. Monitoring next and like I said the KRK Rokits are nice but they are a budget speaker. For KRK go with the V8's or check out the Mackie HR824's. Yamaha's new HS80m's are getting good reviews and then there's always your higher quality Dynaudio, Genelecs, Etc. You'll have to listen to a bunch and figure out which are best for you but don't fall for an exagerated sound. The M-Audio's for example tend to have an exagerated high end that makes them sound crisp. It may sound appealing at first but it's not going to help your mix.
 
Damn, thank you for such a complete reply Cameron.

I knew those were the adequate choices for gritiness, BUT I'm not thinking THAT gritty if you know what I mean: I might wanna do some more light-hearted, or even dirty south type of beats. Another producer I like is Marco Polo, and the reason why he sounds so much as Pete Rock is because he uses the MPC2000 as well.
Since I want to do versatile productions, balancing between the "dark" and "light" styles, which one is the better choice: MPC2k, 3k, (I guess 4k isn't that grimey) or MV-8000? Or should I buy one of those focusing on sample processing only, and keep a SP-1200 or MPC60II for drums?

And yes, the keyboard would be to play deep basslines and crazy synth, nothing else. Should I forget the expensive ones like Triton or Fantom and go for those you pointed? (Microkorg)

And having that in mind, do you still recommend rackmount samplers and modules?

Lol I'll definatly give the room proper treatment then! It is indeed indispensable... and I'll go with KRK's as monitors!

PEACE
 
Pson101 said:
Damn, thank you for such a complete reply Cameron.

I knew those were the adequate choices for gritiness, BUT I'm not thinking THAT gritty if you know what I mean: I might wanna do some more light-hearted, or even dirty south type of beats. Another producer I like is Marco Polo, and the reason why he sounds so much as Pete Rock is because he uses the MPC2000 as well.
Since I want to do versatile productions, balancing between the "dark" and "light" styles, which one is the better choice: MPC2k, 3k, (I guess 4k isn't that grimey) or MV-8000? Or should I buy one of those focusing on sample processing only, and keep a SP-1200 or MPC60II for drums?

And yes, the keyboard would be to play deep basslines and crazy synth, nothing else. Should I forget the expensive ones like Triton or Fantom and go for those you pointed? (Microkorg)

And having that in mind, do you still recommend rackmount samplers and modules?

Lol I'll definatly give the room proper treatment then! It is indeed indispensable... and I'll go with KRK's as monitors!

PEACE
Click to expand...

The MPC60 isn't super gritty like the SP. The SP is 12 bit but has a sample rate of 26040Hz. The MPC is 12 bit but has a higher sample rate. I think 40kHz. The 3000 is your standard 16-bit, 44.1kHz but the A/D converters are supposed to have a warmth that the early versions don't have. The 2kxl has new features like time stretch and chopping. It's really just preference. I wouldn't mind having an MPC but it's hard for me to choose which one too. If you go with something with limited sample time pick up a rack sampler too. Plus like I was saying the multisamples. The s-1000 sample cds have really nice sounds. The sound module is basicaly going to be good for your bread and butter type sounds. Your pianos, guitars, synths, etc. You can always get expansions but they cost a little more than s-1000 sample discs and you're going to be limited to a certain number of expansion boards. An analog or analog modeling synth is going to allow you to create nice bass and synth patches and will basically just expand your sound capabilities. The newer MPC's and MV series are nice samplers but honestly I would just use software over going that route. A nice mixture of older and modern gear is gonna help you achieve a really nice sound.

P.S. I think I was reading about the fantom sound module recently and I believe it samples, supports multisamples and has editing features like chopping. If I'm right about this than something like this would be dope.

MPC3k - Drums
Fantom module - Bread and butter sounds, multisamples, chops.
Rack Mount Minimoog Voyager - This is pricey but it's a true analog synth. I think they run around 2k. You can always go for a less expensive analog modeling synth. There's alot to choose from.
 
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I feel you, I might go for the MPC2kXL though! I'm really liking those features... I still don't know what "multisamples" nor "s-1000 sample cd's" are! Is it disks for the MPC or the sound module? And if I upgrade the 2mb memory of the MPC to 32mb I think it would be enough :)

And I should connect my sound module to the Rack Mount Minimoog Voyager to create some hard basslines, is that it? 'Cause I also don't understand rackmounts (I'm really ignorant regarding hardware right now, I must study).

Another thing I'm totally unaware... the sound module and sampler/sequencer, I plug that directly to the sound card or I need a mixer? 'Cause I heard an interview by The RZA where he says you don't need a mixer for the MV8000 and you can even plug a turntable directly on the MV, I was wonderin' if it's the same with other brands/models...

What I feel you the most too is that I should not pay for features I will not use: that way I rather get a fully equiped Sampler/Sequencer/Drum Machine, 'cause I'm sure I'll use that the most, and a more simple sound module 'cause I'll only use that for basslines and basic synth, if you know what I mean! The Fantom seems "too much", it looks like a spaceship...
And are you familiar with the new Snoop Dogg song produced by Nottz feat R.Kelly called "That's That Sh*t"? That's EXACTLY what I wanna do on a keyboard homie, both synth-wise and bassline... I can post it if you don't know it. I don't want to get REALLY technical on a keyboard like Timbaland or Neptunes, I just want some basic stuff like Just Blaze or J.Dilla... what's the IDEAL keyboard for makin' a track like the Snoop one? :) And what do you think about the ASR-10 keyboard since I hear so much about it and I think its what Nottz uses?

PEACE
 
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I'm not much of a help but I was reading all the replies, and ****, well a brotha learned a lot so I wanted to thank all of ya'll too... that info is going to come in handy.....
 
Hello, its not about the equipment you have, and i;m guessing that you know that. If I were you i would go with a keyboard workstation. I have one and I'm very happy. I own a roland fantom x6 and have a few other synths. try teaching yourself how to edit songs and cutting samples after you get that down, then everything should be a breeze. no one taught me anything, so if you got questions e-mail me peace..
 
skinnymike said:
Hello, its not about the equipment you have, and i;m guessing that you know that. If I were you i would go with a keyboard workstation. I have one and I'm very happy. I own a roland fantom x6 and have a few other synths. try teaching yourself how to edit songs and cutting samples after you get that down, then everything should be a breeze. no one taught me anything, so if you got questions e-mail me peace..
Click to expand...
certain gear does certain things and have certain sounds. He says hes lookin for a lofi sound so in this case the gear would be a better choice. Im not sure that he will enjoy the work arounds that come with this gear.
 
@ Shank: glad I'm not the only one thankful for these tips! :)

@ Skinnymike: thanks for your feedback, I appreciate it a lot. I certainly know what you mean, but you know the right tools for the right person can make miracles ;) I think I chose my gear though, I think I'll go with the Ensoniq ASR-10 as sound module and MPC 2000 XL as sampler/sequencer/drum machine. I may look for a Moog at a later time too, as well as a few other things...

@ Xabiton: that's what I'm talkin' about my friend! I think the gear I named will do the job, for real... thanks for stopping by as well!!

ONE LOVE
 
I think you should do some more looking because the ASR10 is a sampler/sequencer in fact a lot of people combo it with mpcs because it has great fx and a great sound to it but a poor sequencer and the mpc has poor fx. Best of both worlds. Off the top of my head I know Kanye West uses his asr10 as a sampler and has a mpc 2000 that he mainly sequences on everything else is done on the asr. Take a look into some of the cheaper Roland sound modules if u need a module and maybe a mpc 2000 (3000 if u want that real old school sound) or even an EPS classic for an old sound as well. But it has no fx and the sequencer eats sample time. Its basically a first generation ASR10. I think you may like it
 
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