Beats - Complexity vs Simplicity

j.troup

New member
Since I've been doing Girl Pop records (Katy Perry / Kelly Clarkson / Karmin / Demi Lovato), I've noticed something. The instrumentals are really quite simple, especially as compared to Urban instrumentals.


When you listen to a song like Katy Perry - One That Got Away, or even Part of Me, the beats aren't that complicated. There aren't a bunch of crazy change ups, there aren't a million different snare rolls and high hat tricks. Just a straight forward simple melody, baseline and percussion.

What makes these songs work and appeal to people is their STRONG melodies, and the SONGS over top of them.



So my question is, why does urban music seem to buy into the notion that a beat has to be super duper complex in order to work?











 
It's just the direction that the two genres are going in. Urban music seems to pride itself on being complicated sometimes and forget about some of the simple groves. That's why I like to listen to pop music every once in a while. Give my ears something else to feast on instead of just minor chords, snare rolls and double time hi hats
 
A strong melody can dig its way into someones brain and stay there for HOURS. That's something a complicated drum roll transition could never do. Look at Top 40 radio. It doesn't matter the kind of music. The melodies are ALWAYS on point. Great melody = $$$$$$.
 
its because of where the urban records vs pop records are played. A lot of those pop records are intended for radio play, while a lot of urban records are intended for club play. Melody doesnt really matter in the club, its all about bass, loud and rhythm. So the more things you have going on usually gets the most reaction

but if you look at dance music or house and genres like that, even thats more along the lines of urban music where its all about groove and feel more so than just simple melody and good writing.

like if you listen to a David Guetta pop song compared to a Dr .Luke pop song theyre night and day. Guetta cares more about the transitions and drops with a house more electro complextro feel. Dr. Luke is more along the lines of old school Beach Boys swag, simple writing, simple instruments, simple melody
 
Simplicity sells. You could have the most complicated beat in the world but if it doesn't mesh right then its to much to decipher.

Good progression
Drum Driven, simple melodies
Nice groove on drums
Aggressiveness to calmness
Drops and fills where expected
Emphasis on a baselines
Letting some sounds rest and breathe.
Good artist of course.

All of those things alone by themself can alter the mood of the listener...mind control lol.
 
Always wanted to ask this question, because almost every time I look at beat feedbacks, people always tell the beatmaker ''your beat is too simple''' and im like ??? All radio songs are simple
 
like if you listen to a David Guetta pop song compared to a Dr .Luke pop song theyre night and day. Guetta cares more about the transitions and drops with a house more electro complextro feel. Dr. Luke is more along the lines of old school Beach Boys swag, simple writing, simple instruments, simple melody


That's exactly it. You nailed it with that Dr. Luke comparison. It's kinda like a Beach Boys swag. Lyrics are easy to digest, yet creative and convey a message. Instruments are relatively simple (although there are some really detailed intricacies in there, I'm learning), and a simple melody.

And it works. It's all over the charts. All over the radio. All over EVERYTHING.
 
Is it me or has urban music kinda lost it's grove in the last few years? by groove I mean most urban songs aren't really danceable anymore(imo). not saying that there aren't exceptions, but for the most part I think pop got urban beat on the rhythm right now
 
Is it me or has urban music kinda lost it's grove in the last few years? by groove I mean most urban songs aren't really danceable anymore(imo). not saying that there aren't exceptions, but for the most part I think pop got urban beat on the rhythm right now

they have no groove AT ALL. Urban music is now kinda like punk rock music, you just kinda jump around and mob around to the music like an extra in a Chief Keef video

even indie records like this new band i found Atlas Genius has more groove and swag than a lot of hip hop records



---------- Post added at 01:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:27 PM ----------

and if you listen to that record. its basically a raw katy perry song. Slower, grittier instruments. But records like this can become number 1s cause they still have that simple Beach Boys swag

that feel good summertime, drive to the beach in your drop top corvette type feel. Or if you listen to Karmin and you hear some of that funk? There are def more groove and urban elements added to pop music these days

and its a winning formula
 
they have no groove AT ALL. Urban music is now kinda like punk rock music, you just kinda jump around and mob around to the music like an extra in a Chief Keef video

even indie records like this new band i found Atlas Genius has more groove and swag than a lot of hip hop records



---------- Post added at 01:30 PM ---------- Previous post was at 01:27 PM ----------

and if you listen to that record. its basically a raw katy perry song. Slower, grittier instruments. But records like this can become number 1s cause they still have that simple Beach Boys swag

that feel good summertime, drive to the beach in your drop top corvette type feel. Or if you listen to Karmin and you hear some of that funk? There are def more groove and urban elements added to pop music these days

and its a winning formula




Another post that's right on point. That's exactly what i'm talking about.



Hip Hop is almost going thru an identity crisis right now. On one hand you have the pop-records that are going Electro/Techno. And then on the gritter side of things, it's almost Grunge Hip Hop. You got people like Chief Keef, Waka Flocka, etc, doing those Urban Mosh Pit, jump around and smash shit kinda records.
 
Is it me or has urban music kinda lost it's grove in the last few years? by groove I mean most urban songs aren't really danceable anymore(imo). not saying that there aren't exceptions, but for the most part I think pop got urban beat on the rhythm right now


agreed. im still listening to Teenage Dream and Femme Fatale.


urban music is truthfully, uninspiring right now.
 
I think it was old heads clowin' shit like Crank Dat and Laffy Taffy that made people go harder. The whole Hip Hop is dead movement, then J.L. takin' over the scene. Just forced people to step their game up BUT you have those individuals that go overboard. Oh shit. . .how could I forget Kanye West, and Just Blaze hoppin on the bandwagon too.

Then you have to think about this.

Pop singers collaborate more than rappers do. Most of Katy's music is probably made by either:

1.) Her, songwriter, and producer locking themselves in the studio.

or

2.) Songwriter and producer in the studio.


Most of the rappers get their beats from the net, or producers play premade beats that have all the transitions and change ups and shit.

If rappers collaborated more and actually MADE SONGS TOGETHER, shit would probably tone down.
 
Most people that make Urban music make it by ear. They don't know any intricate details of actually HOW to make music.

It's like somebody that can microwave Kraft macaroni and cheese vs. somebody that can make it on a stove using ingredients.

... plus Urban listeners don't listen that hard. The music is more hook driven than lyric driven. The music has to sound good in a stereo system rather than sound good musically - see Rack City.

The crowds are different. People that listen to pop, listen to it on TV, radio and headphones and people that listen to urban music normally listen to it in the club or in a Caprice Classic with the trunk and license plates rattlin'.
 
The people saying that urban music is no longer danceable must not have been in any clubs/parties etc recently. Unless you're looking for some older form of dancing, or you're just old...
 
The people saying that urban music is no longer danceable must not have been in any clubs/parties etc recently. Unless you're looking for some older form of dancing, or you're just old...

This could be true...

I see my son dancing all the time. The dances look funny but he and his friends seem to have a good time with the music they find.

Somebody called Labyrinth is on his ipod...
 
The people saying that urban music is no longer danceable must not have been in any clubs/parties etc recently. Unless you're looking for some older form of dancing, or you're just old...

lol that's what led me to the conclusion that it isn't danceable. Most urban songs come on and people just stand their and nod awkwardly. A chick with a nice ass looks around, dances for a half a second and then gives up on the idea. When I do see people move. I see them move in a style similar to a mosh pit when those hype bass heavy songs come on.

Only songs I really see move the club to dance is Ass and Cashing Out.
 
The people saying that urban music is no longer danceable must not have been in any clubs/parties etc recently. Unless you're looking for some older form of dancing, or you're just old...

This!



I was getting into that pop shit and lost focus on what I really loved just for the popularity. Never really liked that type of music. I'm done with all of that shit for good. Dubstep, teen pop, electro........not my thing at all. Shit.....I say fuuck the music of today period because it ain't funky. I live for the funk.
 
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