Producer\Production Points!!!

emsiwun

emsiwun

New member
What are producer\production points???

I know that if you produce a song on an album, i.e. Scott Storch, you get producer points...typically 3% or something like that, right???

So, if I am S. Storch, and I produce 10 songs on a 20 song album, does that mean that I get 30% of the royalties for the album???

I am kind of confused about how producers are paid on albums...

Some albums have like at least 5 different producers on them...

Do they each get like 3% (15% total) or the royalies???

Please Help!!!:confused:
 
emsiwun said:
What are producer\production points???

I know that if you produce a song on an album, i.e. Scott Storch, you get producer points...typically 3% or something like that, right???

So, if I am S. Storch, and I produce 10 songs on a 20 song album, does that mean that I get 30% of the royalties for the album???

I am kind of confused about how producers are paid on albums...

Some albums have like at least 5 different producers on them...

Do they each get like 3% (15% total) or the royalies???

Please Help!!!:confused:
Click to expand...


you'd get 3% of each song.


There is a 3% (or whatever number) total royalty allocated for the producer royalty... that is the total.

the producers all divide that up between themselves proportionally to the number of songs they produced.

This is called a "pro-rated" royalty (or "pro rata")


The 3% is pro rated by the number of songs on the album.

you divide the 3% by the number of songs on the album and you get as many "shares" as there are songs you produced.

if there are 15 songs on the album and you did 4 of them... you would get 4/15 (four fifteenths) of the 3%

If you did 10 songs on a 20 song album with a 3% royalty-- you would get 10/20 (10 twentieths) of the 3% prorated royalty... and 10/20 is the same as 1/2 (one half) so you would get half of that 3%, or 1.5% total...

Basically, what you are getting is 3% of each individual song.

you are not getting 3% of the albums royalties for producing your song... you are getting 3% of that songs royalties.
 
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SUPER SOLID!!!

I THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THE INFO!!!

I needed that because the whole "producer points" thing was confusing the hell out of me!!!

I'ma bust out my calculator and start trying to figure that stuff out with actual dollar amounts!!!

Thanks again!!!
 
so you will be lookin at somthing like this

the SRLP $18.99(Suggested Retail List Price) multiplied by 3%(Producer's Points)= 57 cents

$18.99 x .03 = 0.569(.57)

unless you produced the whole album..you won't see .57 cent

now we need to take the .57 cent and divided by the number of tracks on the CD(15)

$18.99 x .03 = 0.569 / 15 = $0.0379 per song

so you will get ~$0.04 per song you produced on the album if you did more then 1 song..its that easy..

so now you know have to figure out what you would get after the label recoup their money...

stay on your grind...peace
Click to expand...
 
Question????

bknot1 said:
so you will be lookin at somthing like this
Click to expand...

I thought it was based on WHOLESALE price per CD not Suggested Retail.....

I have seen a LOT of BOGUS/SHYTTY contracts so...I don't know...
 
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it depends on whats written in the contract..it can be either or..
 
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yo...

solid info ya'll...super solid...

looks like the contract is key...

I'm starting to see how everything amounts to album sales...

If the album flops...NOBODY gets paid...

As a producah, I think that I would try to negotiate either a higher ADVANCE\INITIAL (which we don't have to pay back because we ain't signed to the label) PAYMENT, with less producer points (percentage) on the back-end if the album probably won't go gold...

Or...

Take NO MONEY UP FRONT and opt for a higher ROYALTY\PRODUCER POINT (percentage) on the back-end, like 7%, especially if I produced over 4 songs on the album...and if the album will probably be successful...Gold and up...

But that's just me thinking out loud again...
 
also remeber your Advance is subtracted from your royalties due..
 
emsiwun said:
As a producah, I think that I would try to negotiate either a higher ADVANCE\INITIAL (which we don't have to pay back because we ain't signed to the label) PAYMENT
Click to expand...


you never have to pay any money back regardless of whether you are signed to the label or not.


You may be thinking of advances... "advances" have to be "recouped" before you gete paid any more money... but advances must be recouped whether you are signed to the label or not.

They are called "advances" because they are being paid to you in "advance" of any sales made and in "advance" of any royalties earned... as the record sells and you earn royalties, you don't get paid until those earned royalties equals the amount of money you were paid as an advance. At that point, your advances are recouped and you can start earning payable royalties.


But you never have to "pay anything back" in the sense of actually giving someone cash or writing a check out to someone.
 
Is this serious? I'm saw some really wrong advice here.

In hiphop, the term 'producer' is usually missed used. If you made the beat, you are a writer. A songwriter. In books the term producer refers to the person who is responisble for the project, the maintain the budget and oversee the entire project. They get no writers share, unless they actually wrote anything.

In urban music usually the song is broken down into 2 parts; music 50% and lyrics 50%. this all depends on the individual arrangement, what it says in paper. If you sample that is concidered to be part of the music. The sampled artists get thier money from the producer(beatmaker)'s money first. If they want more than 50% it starts coming from the artist money. But all this depends on the particular arrangement all parties concent to.

Also advances can be negotated from 'advance' to 'fee'. an advance is recouped and a fee is non-recoupable.
 
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dwells said:
Is this serious? I'm saw some really wrong advice here.

In hiphop, the term 'producer' is usually missed used. If you made the beat, you are a writer. A songwriter. In books the term producer refers to the person who is responisble for the project, the maintain the budget and oversee the entire project. They get no writers share, unless they actually wrote anything.

In urban music usually the song is broken down into 2 parts; music 50% and lyrics 50%. this all depends on the individual arrangement, what it says in paper. If you sample that is concidered to be part of the music. The sampled artists get thier money from the producer(beatmaker)'s money first. If they want more than 50% it starts coming from the artist money. But all this depends on the particular arrangement all parties concent to.

Also advances can be negotated from 'advance' to 'fee'. an advance is recouped and a fee is non-recoupable.
Click to expand...


Well, the question was not about what a proper royalty amount would be... the question was about how the royalty distribution works.


A producer is a producer... if that producer gets writing credit, then that is something that should be dealt with in the contract.
 
yo...

I'm feeling what Dwells is saying...based on what a HIP-HOP PRODUCER IS NOWADAYS: the producer is often the only person involved in the creation of a musical recording, and is responsible for both writing, performing, recording and arranging the material. The term "producer" is nearly synonymous with "musician" in this field. This change has been partly due to the increase of inexpensive yet powerful music production software, which allows for entire tracks to be composed, arranged and recorded at home on a PC or laptop, allowing the traditional roles of a team of people to be performed by one individual.

Executive Producer: In the music industry the executive producer of a music album is usually in control of the overall decision making in how the album turns out: how many songs are placed in the final cut, which songs are used out of the tracks produced in the process of making the album, and the order in which the songs are placed. In this instance, the executive producer is usually someone who has had input in producing some of the tracks on the album. A particular executive producer's name attached to an album is sometimes used as a selling point to distributors.

In some instances an executive producer may just be someone who "discovered" a particular act, or someone who represents an act, either as an agent or a lawyer. Other times it may just be someone who financed the production of the album.

All of us "Future Producers", are SONGWRITERS too!!! I'm feeling that son...

I'm feeling the "FEE" too...I'ma charge a FEE upfront, and have PRODUCER POINTS (percentage) on the backend...

correct me if I'm wrong FP...
 
dwells said:
Is this serious? I'm saw some really wrong advice here.

In hiphop, the term 'producer' is usually missed used. If you made the beat, you are a writer. A songwriter. In books the term producer refers to the person who is responisble for the project, the maintain the budget and oversee the entire project. They get no writers share, unless they actually wrote anything.

In urban music usually the song is broken down into 2 parts; music 50% and lyrics 50%. this all depends on the individual arrangement, what it says in paper. If you sample that is concidered to be part of the music. The sampled artists get thier money from the producer(beatmaker)'s money first. If they want more than 50% it starts coming from the artist money. But all this depends on the particular arrangement all parties concent to.

Also advances can be negotated from 'advance' to 'fee'. an advance is recouped and a fee is non-recoupable.
Click to expand...

You are RIGHT for the MOST part....

The 50/50 WRITERS thing is correct for the PUBLISHING aspect as far as ASCAP, BMI, SEASAC & Etc. BUT there have also been deals negotiated where there are POINTS given off of ALBUM SALES...This is something TOTALLY different than PUBLISHING wherebey these (WRITERS actually calling themselves PRODUCERS) are given a small piece of the ALBUM sales too.

I think this is what he was talking about....

That 50/50 thing=======PUBLISHING
and it ACTUALLY boils down to 25% because ASCAP for instance will pay out 50% to the writer(s) of a song and 50% to the PUBLISHING Company that publishes the song. So the writers (Of the Lyrics & the Music) actually SPLIT the remaining 50% which makes it 25% apiece...
WHICH is why it CAN be benificial to have your OWN publishing company...

But once again this is only with regard to PUBLISHING not ROYALTIES paid off record sales...they are 2 different things...

LOTS of lables have their contracts set up where they can "CROSS- COLATERALIZE" Meaning they can take "re-coupable" funds from any OTHER source of an artists income....

SO if "Joe Blow" is signed to "Rip Off" Records and they give him an advance of $100,000 but he ONLY makes $10,000 off his record sales, he STILL OWES the lable $90,000. but let's say he wrote a song for USHER and received $90,000 in WRITERS royalties from ASCAP. The lable, due to CROSS-COLATERALIZATION would be able to take that $90,000 TOO...

Artists SIGN contracts ALL THE TIME like this...Often it is WRITTEN into contracts that the artist's publishing royalties will be paid to the "LABLE". That way they can deduct what they want first and THEN give "Joe Blow" the rest.....

I have SEEN this in contracts before....That's why we as "ARTISTS" have got to READ our OWN contracts!

You SHOULD get a lawyer TOO....But i STILL want to UNDERSTAND what I am signing...Don't be naive enough to think that Lawyers haven't been PAID under the table to give bogus advice...LOL

I THINK this is how it works...My Brain hurts now....I'm going to sleep...LOL




PEACE
 
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I want to try to keep it simple. most people here would have their heads explode trying to figure out publishing contracts. and how 100% of 5 songs is actually more like 40. but that is way to complicated to get into and I'll be typing till dawn. dealing with publishing companies is a real pain in the ass and it is worth it to have a top notch lawyer who you could trust. lol

"CROSS- COLATERALIZE": I'm impressed, I think you're the first person to talk about this on this forum. and this is another item I really don't want to get into. most people here are still seseame street, and are not ready to get into all that.

A producer is not always a producer. This term is often misused. it is true that a producer is usually a songwriter. But often people here read books about the industry, and don't really realize what they are really doing. A producer is the person who runs recording process, similar to a director of a movie. A producer can also engineer and write. But just because you made the beat, doesn't mean you produced the song.
 
"But just because you made the beat, doesn't mean you produced the song."


FACT...not fiction...

This thread kicks a$$
 
Chi-Town is "MY" Hometown too!

You dwells...I see u r from the Chi....

I'm gonna PM. you my info...maybe we can get together on some business....

PEACE OUT!
 
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