What's this chord called?

T

Tehnostorm

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Hello, I'm learning music theory and I got stuck with this one. I'm in E Minor scale and notes played are E5 (root note I guess?), G4, E4 (one that I press on keyboard), C3. So: E5,G4,E4,C3

I guess it is something called chord inversion, but is it documented anywhere and has it any abbreviation like "E Dim7"? I'm using Ableton and set C Minor scale with base in E in Scale MIDI Effect, and I have Chord MIDI Effect set up 1st knob -15, 2nd +4, 3rd +13. It sounds fantastic, but what confuses me is that I press E4 note and there are two notes "above" E4 and one below E4. So what is that chord? I know that chord can't have notes both above and below root note. It's either above, or below (inverted chords I guess?). So please help me understand this. Thank you very much!
 
Well, "E Dim7" is an e fully diminished 7th chord, which consists of a diminished triad plus a diminished 7th. That's a total of 4 notes. If E is the root note, the chord cannot be diminished because there is no minor scale that has a fully diminished 7th as the tonic (1 chord) in western music. If e minor is the key, I see a VI chord (triad) in first inversion. What this means is it is the chord built off of the 6th note in the e minor scale, which is C. See example: (e-1, f#-2, g-3, a-4, b-5, --->C-6<---, d-7) The chord built off the 6th note (C) is C maj7, the triad is Cmaj. Since there are 2 E notes (doubled), which is the 3rd of the chord, it cannot be a 7th chord because a 7th chord must have a root, third, 5th and 7th... In this case you have a root, 2 thirds, and a 5th, no 7th. This is acceptable because the 3rd can be doubled, as well as the root, but not the 5th. (stupid rules >.<). Inversions simply tell you what note is the lowest note in the chord. (the note in the bass) Since having the root as the lowest note is called root position, you move to the next note up in the triad, which is the 3rd. When the 3rd of the chord (again, E in this case) is the lowest note, it's called first inversion. It's the same chord as before, just rearranged so the root note is moved to the top of the structure, making the 3rd the bottom note. You can think of it as a Cmaj triad on top of an E in the bass. I hope that wasn't too confusing, feel free if you need me to re-word or clarify.

EDIT: forgot to say whenever you see a "6-3" or "6" next to a chord, that means it's in first inversion. Note, however, you will not see 6-3, that's just the only way I know how to put it on a keyboard. Rather, it will be a small 6 on top of a 3, or more often, just a small 6. It just means there's a 6th and a 3rd on top of the bass note, which are your inverted root (6th above bass) and your 5th (3rd above bass). To figure out intervals, just count up the lines and spaces, including the note you're starting with. For example, from a to b would be a 2nd because the starting note (a) counts as 1.
 
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Thank you balls of metal for such exhaustive explanation. I'm really just total beginner in music theory, so this is quite complex to me at the moment. I would like to ask you, because you have very good knowledge of theory, where it would be best to start learning music theory for serious. I am 25 years old, so I'm old for almost all of the music schools. Maybe if you can recommend me some course on the internet I would be grateful to you. Thank you again for your help, and all the best to you:)
 
Thank you balls of metal for such exhaustive explanation. I'm really just total beginner in music theory, so this is quite complex to me at the moment. I would like to ask you, because you have very good knowledge of theory, where it would be best to start learning music theory for serious. I am 25 years old, so I'm old for almost all of the music schools. Maybe if you can recommend me some course on the internet I would be grateful to you. Thank you again for your help, and all the best to you:)

25 isn't that old at all, LOL
Why not start taking instrument lessons? That way, you not only get the theory, but you get the practical application and understanding of it as well. Theory knowledge without application really doesn't mean much. I started taking theory classes in community college at 30 while taking classical piano and guitar lessons on the side, so fucc outta here with the "too old" business.
 
Thank you balls of metal for such exhaustive explanation. I'm really just total beginner in music theory, so this is quite complex to me at the moment. I would like to ask you, because you have very good knowledge of theory, where it would be best to start learning music theory for serious. I am 25 years old, so I'm old for almost all of the music schools. Maybe if you can recommend me some course on the internet I would be grateful to you. Thank you again for your help, and all the best to you:)

Haha, sorry... Like I said, if you need clarification feel free to ask. All you really need to know, to answer the question, is it's a Cmaj triad in 1st inversion. As far as theory goes, I've been learning since 3rd grade, so I'm not sure what a good resource to just pick up with might be. One of my professors had constantly recommended MusicTheory.net as a resource. Also, before I graduated and had her again in my new school, I have a book I was given by the same professor in the elementary theory course when I went to community college (took it as an elective), and it looked pretty simple and easy to understand, as far as the layout goes. It's called Practical Theory Complete, by Sandy Feldstein. Finally, my brother gave me a book he used in college called The Complete Idiots Guide to Music Theory. You can try any of these, or maybe find some online resources. Although, I haven't seen many full courses that don't charge online. Good luck in your journey, and you're NEVER too old to learn, just keep pushing. (also, learning an instrument will help a LOT. My professor liked to use a keyboard, it's an easy layout to learn on)
 
Thank you for all your advices! You've been a lot of help, and thanks for motivation. I'll contact you if I get stuck :p You can PM me your mail if you want, because I'll sure need some guide and will have questions on a journey I'm about to start. Thanks very much :)
 
more simply

your notes are e-g-e-c

remove duplicates

so we now have e-g-c

rearrange so that we get the nearest alphabetical sequence (minimum number of notes between each note of the chord) - don't forget that teh naming ntoes wrap around again at G#/Ab i.e. A-A#/Bb-B-C-C#/Db-D-D#/Eb-E-F-F#/Gb-G-G#/Ab-A-etc.....

in this case the notes get rearranged to be c-e-g which is a C major chord

now go back to the note that was the bass: is it the root, the 3rd or the 5th of the chord?

in this case it is the 3rd

so we might name it as C/E which means C major with an E in the bass

if the bass note is the 3rd then we have a first inversion chord

if the bass note is the 5th then we have a second inversion chord

special case of this chord might be when we spell it as E-G-B#, in which case it is Em(#5)

- we would only use this naming if it were in the context of the Russian cadence Em-Em(#5)-Em6-Em(#5), best known as the chords under the Bond Theme

note that B#=C

sus4 chords are not easily dealt with by this method, but can be reduced effectively if you use the home key as a resolving point

e.g.

in C major the notes F-G-C should be rearranged to be C-F-G (larger interval followed by the smaller interval)

if we leave it as F-G-C we might be tempted to call it sus2 chord but there being no 3rd there is little point to doing so

if we rearrange it as G-C-F (large interval followed by large interval) then the chord becomes G7sus4 - our context will tell us if this is correct
- if the chord is preceded or followed by G-B-(D-)F (we do not need to include the 5th in a 7th chord) then it is likely to be G7sus4, if it is preceded by the C chord or an F chord iit could be either Csus4 or G7sus4
 
Thank you man for explanation :) I appreciate it very much! I have one other question though. I have literally copied notes to FL Studio, as I'm using best of Ableton and FL. So I got stuck on another problem when painting notes in piano roll. These grayish notes are ghost notes that show the E Natural Minor scale for reference. So in Ableton I would set knobs on Chord MIDI effect to -15,+4,+13. So when I'd press G5 I'd get: E4, G5, B5, G6 Like first chord in the picture:

Capture.PNG

But what bothers me are two things: Second chord was produced by same Chord effect (-15,+4,+13) but pressing note E5 on MIDI keyboard. And 3rd chord interests me. Since I played F5 on MIDI keyboard (and F5 is not in E Natural Minor scale) why did it transpose note one down to E5 instead to F5#? So how to determine when to transpose note one semitone up, or one semitone down? Similarly in 3rd chord, the highest note is 14 halfsteps up from root note E5 (note I pressed), so it's +13 (+1). Why is it F6#, and not E6? Because in 4th chord in pic, highest note is 12 semitones up from root note D5 (note I pressed), so it's +13 (-1). Why it isn't E6 instead of D6? So what I would like to know, is how to determine if some note in the chord goes semitone up, or down? Is there any rule to it?

Thanks!
 
Am I missing something? It's just a C major chord, first inversion. (Meaning the E is in the bass rather than C)

As long as the only notes are C, E, G no matter how many of each of them there are or which order they're in, the chord can always be described as C major.
 
Thank you man for explanation :) I appreciate it very much! I have one other question though. I have literally copied notes to FL Studio, as I'm using best of Ableton and FL. So I got stuck on another problem when painting notes in piano roll. These grayish notes are ghost notes that show the E Natural Minor scale for reference. So in Ableton I would set knobs on Chord MIDI effect to -15,+4,+13. So when I'd press G5 I'd get: E4, G5, B5, G6 Like first chord in the picture:

View attachment 43715

But what bothers me are two things: Second chord was produced by same Chord effect (-15,+4,+13) but pressing note E5 on MIDI keyboard. And 3rd chord interests me. Since I played F5 on MIDI keyboard (and F5 is not in E Natural Minor scale) why did it transpose note one down to E5 instead to F5#? So how to determine when to transpose note one semitone up, or one semitone down? Similarly in 3rd chord, the highest note is 14 halfsteps up from root note E5 (note I pressed), so it's +13 (+1). Why is it F6#, and not E6? Because in 4th chord in pic, highest note is 12 semitones up from root note D5 (note I pressed), so it's +13 (-1). Why it isn't E6 instead of D6? So what I would like to know, is how to determine if some note in the chord goes semitone up, or down? Is there any rule to it?

Thanks!

adaptive chording like that used in ableton probably has a rule that states move to the nearest scale tone (E is closer to F than F# is in pure frequency terms)

the chords generate by your choices in sequence are

Em
C
Dadd9 - got this one wrong because I was trying to squint it out in the small pic (notes are D-E-A-F#)
Bm - mistyped D for B notes are B-D-F#-D
C
Am

@ scrapheaper - I did not suggest otherwise, only that there are other possible ways of naming the chord depending on context
 
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