What is the secret/formula to today's trap hip hop beats/melodies?:

M

M_Hill216

New member
Sup - I've been practicing producing for nearly a year now coming in March, but only a month, maybe two ago I've felt my beats have been sell able, decent whatever. How? Well, first before I get to my question/main point of the thread, I didn't know how to make good drums or where drums where suppose to hit. Anyways, yeah I got through all that - I learned, then it was sound selection, and I'm still looking for more sounds and always will be, I finally got good sounds. Finally, and probably the hardest part for me was wrapping my head around melodies, and still is. I'm trying to still comprehend what notes go good to make melodies. Now you ask, how do you feel you've been able to make
my beats be sell able, decent whatever.
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? Easy. I just learned chords and how to make a chord progression in a key, then obviously you need a melody to go with the chord most of the time. So I just based the melody (which mine where really simple) around my chord progressions and I was able to do this for some time until I ran out of scales that eventually ended up always making new beats that sounded something too similar to the last beat I'd finish which concludes with me making this thread and asking this question, but before I'm asked why can't you just make melodies based around chords and erase the chords, well. Like I said I feel doing that is probably not the way everyone else does their melodies, anyways...

The question is - I hear these minor melodies over beats and the melody is pretty simple, most of the time. Then the beat is still great and all. How do they do this? What notes go together? What do I need to learn? I've tried music theory, I bought a MIDI controller piano, I've been told intervals; okay, cool but I still don't understand enough, so I don't get it, lets take this song here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=af15ARAP3H4 I don't mean this in a negative way, because the song is great, but all it is, is a balance of ascending a descending notes but I still don't get how they know what notes go good, how do they know?

I'm at the point where I'm sick of it, everyone makes it seem so easy because I'm sure it is, but almost a year into it now and I'm wanting to step up and make this work, but what can I do to understand this secret to melodies? What do I need to know? Playing by ear is great and you can only get so far - actually, speaking of that. I saw a video of Southside making a beat muted and I'm pretty sure it had a good melody, because these guys know exactly what to punch in, so what's that?

Sorry for the book, I'm sick of struggling and just want to step up to the next level.

Thanks again. :berzerk:



Examples of melodies:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpSGljBDaIE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXnu1uCJlac

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ck9bROhxrDI
 
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I don't think there's a secret. I'm pretty sure 99% of these trap melodies (and other melodies for that matter) are simply results of jamming/playing by ear/experimenting with the piano roll and so on, instead of having to go through a stack of theory to "construct" a melody. Of course it can be broken down into theory, tension & release, counterpoint and whatnot - but I doubt many beatmakers or popular musicians in general go that far. Learning those scales and chords so they're your second nature is a good start, because it enables you to play around with them and "find" melodies.
 
krushing said:
I don't think there's a secret. I'm pretty sure 99% of these trap melodies (and other melodies for that matter) are simply results of jamming/playing by ear/experimenting with the piano roll and so on, instead of having to go through a stack of theory to "construct" a melody. Of course it can be broken down into theory, tension & release, counterpoint and whatnot - but I doubt many beatmakers or popular musicians in general go that far. Learning those scales and chords so they're your second nature is a good start, because it enables you to play around with them and "find" melodies.
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So what you're trying to say is pick a favorite scale I like and be able to play it from octave to octave, and after I remember it, just jam out with it randomizing it until I get something good? Can't this be done by someone without any piano though, for instance - a guy in FL studio can just map out a scale and just move the notes around until something good comes out? What about intervals and perfect fifths? A lot of people say C to G is used a lot in trap melodies. I'm unsure though, I just go by ear, but. I'm just sick of feeling like I don't know something because I feel my melodies are too basic and it's becoming a headache.
 
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The piano roll makes a sound the entire time you are moving notes.
Learning some more theory [If you produce any type of music you know some slight theory by default]
Like learning all scales by heart would make it easier to make melodies even if you are a mouse based guy.

an 88 key piano is 200$.
a 49key would be round 30-80$ I think.
 
I have one, but I tend not to use it because I think I have more success not using it for some reason. I've tried marking a scale down on the keyboard and playing until I get something good but it just sounds random. Any advice? I'm really getting sick of not being able to do this...There is only so much failure you can take before finding success even in the simpler of things.
 
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Only advice I can give [learned all scales & how to read sheet in spare time]
Is practice.

I think for it not to be random, you'd have to keep track of what notes are being pressed and when.
Or write melodies.
Or just use the mouse.
Or use both the piano & mouse.
 
M_Hill216 said:
So what you're trying to say is pick a favorite scale I like and be able to play it from octave to octave, and after I remember it, just jam out with it randomizing it until I get something good? Can't this be done by someone without any piano though, for instance - a guy in FL studio can just map out a scale and just move the notes around until something good comes out? What about intervals and perfect fifths? A lot of people say C to G is used a lot in trap melodies. I'm unsure though, I just go by ear, but. I'm just sick of feeling like I don't know something because I feel my melodies are too basic and it's becoming a headache.
Click to expand...

I don't really think it's about "randomizing" but more like refining what you're hearing based on your sense of style and ear for, well, good melodies. The scales and intervals are just tools to help getting there, sort of narrowing it down the choices a bit. I doubt many people think "ok now I'm gonna go for a perfect fifth" when doing melodies. And well, good melodies often are basic. Complexity ≠ better music.
 
Pretty much just a minor chord and some drums?

IDK man it's kinda like asking what's the secret formula to a peanut butter and jelly sandwich.
 
M_Hill216 said:
So what you're trying to say is pick a favorite scale I like and be able to play it from octave to octave, and after I remember it, just jam out with it randomizing it until I get something good? Can't this be done by someone without any piano though, for instance - a guy in FL studio can just map out a scale and just move the notes around until something good comes out? What about intervals and perfect fifths? A lot of people say C to G is used a lot in trap melodies. I'm unsure though, I just go by ear, but. I'm just sick of feeling like I don't know something because I feel my melodies are too basic and it's becoming a headache.
Click to expand...

LOL trying to make music with a mouse is the most counter-intuitive thing.

Anybody who's ever gotten even decently proficient with any type of controller will tell you that.

Think of the difference between I person that types with all 10 fingers, and a person who only types with their index fingers.

As for melodies, inversions, chord voicings etc. are a big deal.
 
play around until you get what you want. i barely know any chords and scales but im content with my melodies. it could also be the sound you pick.
 
The funny thing about music is, it's the simple things that are the most catchy. But to have the skill to make the simple things takes a lot of time

In my first year of producing I made a track which was ridiculous. Filling every single frequency with just noise, no coherence to it. But I thought that was what I should be doing, because complexity was supposed to make the track 'better'.

I know it feels like big artists just make catchy melodies all the time easily, but honestly they spent a lot of time honing their craft, there is no quick melody writing skill. Music theory will help tremendously. But what you can also do, is find some midi files of some catchy melodies and just study them. You'll find that a lot of the best melodies, the notes don't jump around too much and just flow together, chord-melodies are great because they are in key, but there's not as much creativity with them
 
i've noticed alot of this in trap/hip-hop, and find myself doing it alot right now as well.
get your drum loop going... and find three notes that vibe with each other .... and go back and forth... 1-2-3-2-1-2-3-2-1.......... repeating.
here's 3 notes that sound dope for this.... D#, F, F#

and i mean that should give you a somewhat decent backbone to start your beat on...
just use those same sounds for the repeating part on a diff track//pitch and add another 3 notes as you see fit...
dont shoot for one awesome melody track... but maybe 3 tracks that each add a few notes to the melody

let your ears do as much work as possible... bring the beat back to the start and play it through fully...
there might be ONE note that you naturally expect to hear and don't hear.... add that note. repeat.

hope this helped somewhat...
 
In my opinion I dont believe theres any secrets to making trap beats. but its your education of sound choice, manipulation and design that is important. Ive been producing for over 10 years and everytime I look up I learn something new from other songs I hear. I like to remain a student of the game because I believe thats the only way you'll keep progressing! I would advise that you stick to your original sound while making trap but add some modern day techniques and sounds to it. And also your drums have got to hit hard and crispy! I never knew how important drum quality was because I was so prideful and thinking I knew it all until I realized I was falling behind. Also you gotta have the right drum kits and plugins! invest in quality sounds otherwise your gon be stuck with the crappy stock sounds that are difficult to mix. let me know if you have any questions
M_Hill216 said:
Sup - I've been practicing producing for nearly a year now coming in March, but only a month, maybe two ago I've felt my beats have been sell able, decent whatever. How? Well, first before I get to my question/main point of the thread, I didn't know how to make good drums or where drums where suppose to hit. Anyways, yeah I got through all that - I learned, then it was sound selection, and I'm still looking for more sounds and always will be, I finally got good sounds. Finally, and probably the hardest part for me was wrapping my head around melodies, and still is. I'm trying to still comprehend what notes go good to make melodies. Now you ask, how do you feel you've been able to make ? Easy. I just learned chords and how to make a chord progression in a key, then obviously you need a melody to go with the chord most of the time. So I just based the melody (which mine where really simple) around my chord progressions and I was able to do this for some time until I ran out of scales that eventually ended up always making new beats that sounded something too similar to the last beat I'd finish which concludes with me making this thread and asking this question, but before I'm asked why can't you just make melodies based around chords and erase the chords, well. Like I said I feel doing that is probably not the way everyone else does their melodies, anyways...

The question is - I hear these minor melodies over beats and the melody is pretty simple, most of the time. Then the beat is still great and all. How do they do this? What notes go together? What do I need to learn? I've tried music theory, I bought a MIDI controller piano, I've been told intervals; okay, cool but I still don't understand enough, so I don't get it, lets take this song here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=af15ARAP3H4 I don't mean this in a negative way, because the song is great, but all it is, is a balance of ascending a descending notes but I still don't get how they know what notes go good, how do they know?

I'm at the point where I'm sick of it, everyone makes it seem so easy because I'm sure it is, but almost a year into it now and I'm wanting to step up and make this work, but what can I do to understand this secret to melodies? What do I need to know? Playing by ear is great and you can only get so far - actually, speaking of that. I saw a video of Southside making a beat muted and I'm pretty sure it had a good melody, because these guys know exactly what to punch in, so what's that?

Sorry for the book, I'm sick of struggling and just want to step up to the next level.

Thanks again. :berzerk:



Examples of melodies:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XpSGljBDaIE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXnu1uCJlac

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ck9bROhxrDI
Click to expand...
 
while i progress through my productions
i loop parts to fix a synth sound for example,
or i listen my track through to see what i did,
or the track plays back in my head while im busy doing something else.
and while i listen it just comes to me like i want to sing and dance to it it,
some additional melody in the voice of some instrument that jsut grooves/dopes the part out.
then its to capture this exact inspiration without simplifying the melody or chosing/tuning the instument/synthsound wrong.

another way is to translate very basic melody/inspiration into the DAW and then
playing around with it in the piano roll, adding notes/melodies, leaving notes out.
the more experienced you get (and you shouldnt worry after one year at all that you cant sell shit) the easier it will become to capture these inspirations in your head, and translate them into the DAW before they grey out,
since you wont be so distracted by stuff youre still learning when chosing/tweaking the sound you want and putting complex melodic rhythm notes in the right place.

One more tip: sing the notes you hear in your head when you put them in place in the piano roll. especially the first few are easier to find in the daw then. and find the quickest way to apply pitchbend to notes in your daw.
when youre amazed by what youre doing and dont just create some product, humans dont seem to tend to fall back into some repeated boring shit melody i think. the rest might just be experience.
so much for writing melodies

i dont do trap but i think this isnt exclusively a matter of any genre.

hope this helps!
 
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honestly i find my self using the minor scale alot when i come up with melodies that seem like they can be trap. so check out the minor scales
 
It comes down to knowing what scale you are on and sticking to it to start then feeling those notes as you go, its your art let it flow out with what you feel works. Sometimes if i get stuck i would reference a track that seems similar to mine and study how they did a particular thing and make my own rendition.
 
Some quick tips for improving melody is as follows:

1) Use the "Golden Mean". That is the idea that a crusis (The highest or lowest note in a melody) should come 2/3(~66%) of the way through the piece. In this case a melody may only be 8 measures long, estimated. With that being said, the crusis should come somewhere in measure five. This will help give direction to your melody.

2) Use Non-Chord Tones in your Soprano(highest) voice of the chords you are using. One type of NCT's are referred to as Passing Tones. Passing tones are dissonant notes(notes that do not fit the chord) that are rhythmically faster the the chord progression. They are also approached by step-wise motion and resolved by step-wise motion. And this just means they travel up or down the scale without skipping any notes in-between.

For example, if you are traveling to a C Major Chord to an E Major note with the root note of the chords in the melody, then the Passing tone in this case would be the note D, which is one step between C and E.

There are many different types of these Non-chord tones and I suggest researching some of them in an attempt to improve your melodies and overall composition skills.

3) Use a Period Structure. To utilize this, you must understand the idea of a cadence. The most common is a parallel period structure. In this case, each musical phrase (2-4 measures) would be organized in a specific pattern. The first phrase, labeled A would be the beginning of the melody and end with a half cadence. This would be followed by repeating the first half of the phrase(1-2 measures), but changing the end to half to reach an Authentic Cadence(a cadence that ends on the tonic, or root, of a key).

Again this is only one type of Period Structure and I suggest reading further into it if you need help designing your melodies. Though, this is Classical Techniques, which contrast highly to that of Trap music.. I feel this knowledge can be applied "tastefully"
to any genre, with regard to the common practices of the genre themselves.

Maybe I'll release a full tutorial on this eventually, but I hope this helped in the meantime

Regards,
-AMinc.
 
Making melodies is easy but due to the nature of them it takes a bit longer than making the groove.
Which is why knowing all your scales & how to read sheet [if you like that language also not necessary]
speeds up the music making process tremendously compared to not knowing some theory.
 
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