Mainstream tracks so easy?

the point is that 1) if you wanna become rich and famous you're most likely are not gonna do it the "good" way and will have to bribe, steal, mooch and break laws to get to "the top", no one got there being a hardworker. 2) Making a hot mainstream style song is easy but getting into the biz is hard
 
Yeah that's where my conflict comes from. I have no doubt in my mind that if I wanted to sacrifice my values I could be at the top of the game. Not gonna do it. Noway I'm slagin' drugs or suckin' anyones d*ck to get somewhere. My morals and values don't have a price tag. Plus respect is worth more than any ammount of money to me.
 
im not sure if this is necessarily a matter of a particular genre being easier to do- any genre, if the writer is really trying to make it expressive and challenging should be a pretty engaging task. If you're only basing your perception on cliche, "underground" tracks can be slagged out pretty mechanically...

I think the thing to keep in mind, if you are making more mainstream stuff, is to push the content and make it good. If you look at many of the great bands etc from throughout history, they did what they did in the context of mainstream music, but tweaked it and made it their own. Conversely, i suppose in making underground music is still maintaining pop or mainstream sensibility.

there is no easy, there is no difficult, there is only is...and what you make it

-Lodger
 
Lodger said:
im not sure if this is necessarily a matter of a particular genre being easier to do- any genre, if the writer is really trying to make it expressive and challenging should be a pretty engaging task. If you're only basing your perception on cliche, "underground" tracks can be slagged out pretty mechanically...

I think the thing to keep in mind, if you are making more mainstream stuff, is to push the content and make it good. If you look at many of the great bands etc from throughout history, they did what they did in the context of mainstream music, but tweaked it and made it their own. Conversely, i suppose in making underground music is still maintaining pop or mainstream sensibility.

there is no easy, there is no difficult, there is only is...and what you make it

-Lodger
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I can see where you are coming from on that. Only part I want to comment on is the great bands throughout history. I think people had higher standards for music in the 60's and 70's. I don't hear too many classic songs anymore. Songs that will be timeless. Some of Alicia Keys songs could end up classics but as far as hip hop goes I'm not sure.
 
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demologik said:
this is what sucks..

most thes cats on the radio got their equipment the "nigger" way:

(and i mean nigger in a bad way..)

They either Stole the equipment form someone else,

Slew Crack, Weed, Speed, Meth, Coke, Ecstasy, or all of the above to get the money to buy studio time, or studio equipment,

They knew someone that most likely acquired a studio in the above manner,

OR had a rich ass mommy or daddy.

Point being; Im sick and tired of working my ass off to buy the same **** i should be able to get the same way those cats did:

BY NOT WORKING.

who gotta studio i can steal their equipment from?

wheres the dope dealers at?

why cant my folks be rich?

how come i didn't inherit a large sum of money from a dead relative?

Answer;

Because I am an honest good hearted person who is forced to work every damn day JUST TO PAY THE DAMN RENT..

if only i had the chance to get in front of the right equipment.. id be number one in the scene and putting out high quality REAL music.

oh yeah BTW, imma junglist.

there's 2 types of black men:

1) the "nigga" who is either you friend, homie, acquaintance, co-worker etc. someone who you're cool with..

2) the "nigger" who is the type of low-life person that is always looking for the next "come-up" off of someone else's sh!t.. they are dishonest, disloyal, cold-hearted, ruthless, and just downright a bad person.

so when i say nigger, im not a racist person, im just emphasizing the facts..

*white poeple can be a "nigger" too..
same goes for every other non-African person on the planet.. it just depends on if you;

work hard in life and strive to be your best..

OR

always screw off and CHEAT your way thru life..

which bring me to my point..

YOUNG JEEZY CHEATED HIS WAY TO WHERE HES AT NOW.. by slangin he got the money for necessary studio time and equipment, which leads me to this fact;
most the cats in the biz are former criminals and cheated their way to the top.. which is why so many people try to show off what they have on TV from their bling to their rings, houses and cars, because they came from **** and never had nothing, becasue they chose not to work, or run with a gang and break man-made laws set forth to control them, they strive to show off to the white man or any other man, HAHA I GOT MONEY ******* and you're all WORKING!!! .. mayn WHEN i get to where i wanna be, imma invest that shyt.

sorry for that long post.. this is useful information to live by.
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man your post is just beyond ignorant

you mean that hustlin, be it slangin dope or pimpin hoes, you mean that it aint hard work?? your crazy and obviously have no clue what your talkin bout

i respect the fact that you, DECIDED to work and honest 9 to 5 job, and i aint knockin you, hell even im working full time too, but thats your choice and aint nobody forcing you to work legit, even if you have kids or have to pay rent. maybe you were put in a situation where you HAVE to make money one way or another, but aint nobody forcing you to be legit.

you telling me that waking up at 6in the mornin to deliver an 8ball, then going back home, going back out at 10 on the other side of town to supply some other folks, you tellin that this is a lazy cheap route to take???

sure there are dumb ass criminals just like there are dumb ass hardworking man.

who are you going to respect, some guy workin 9 to 5 for the rest of his life living in an apartment because he did not have the guts, or did not have the will to take any oportunities,
or
someone putting shyt together from scratch, startin with 100 bucks in his pocket, to building his own studio, rockin shows, networking, by doing it by any means necessary?

Young jeezy cheated his way to the top??? **** outta here!! he went from a regular local dealer to a platnum artist! thats cheating? cuz he decided not to dedicate his life to a 9to5???

You respect the values that you developped throughout years of living legit, same thing with people not workin legit. aint cuz you slangin dope that you aint taking good care of your family

you making it sound as if breaking a law makes you an idiot. as if all criminals are dumb crooks who deserve nothin.
someone taking the oportunity and risk by breaking a law, becoming rich and turn illegal earnings into a legit enterprise is an idiot???
while some other cat who is working a 9 to 5 sittin at home bytchin about how life is unfair is a genius???

i aint knockin you, but you got ur shyt twisted

life's obviously gon be a bytch when you let yourself be treated like one

PEACEEEE
 
PrinceOfDarkness said:



man your post is just beyond ignorant

you mean that hustlin, be it slangin dope or pimpin hoes, you mean that it aint hard work?? your crazy and obviously have no clue what your talkin bout

i respect the fact that you, DECIDED to work and honest 9 to 5 job, and i aint knockin you, hell even im working full time too, but thats your choice and aint nobody forcing you to work legit, even if you have kids or have to pay rent. maybe you were put in a situation where you HAVE to make money one way or another, but aint nobody forcing you to be legit.

you telling me that waking up at 6in the mornin to deliver an 8ball, then going back home, going back out at 10 on the other side of town to supply some other folks, you tellin that this is a lazy cheap route to take???

sure there are dumb ass criminals just like there are dumb ass hardworking man.

who are you going to respect, some guy workin 9 to 5 for the rest of his life living in an apartment because he did not have the guts, or did not have the will to take any oportunities,
or
someone putting shyt together from scratch, startin with 100 bucks in his pocket, to building his own studio, rockin shows, networking, by doing it by any means necessary?

Young jeezy cheated his way to the top??? **** outta here!! he went from a regular local dealer to a platnum artist! thats cheating? cuz he decided not to dedicate his life to a 9to5???

You respect the values that you developped throughout years of living legit, same thing with people not workin legit. aint cuz you slangin dope that you aint taking good care of your family

you making it sound as if breaking a law makes you an idiot. as if all criminals are dumb crooks who deserve nothin.
someone taking the oportunity and risk by breaking a law, becoming rich and turn illegal earnings into a legit enterprise is an idiot???
while some other cat who is working a 9 to 5 sittin at home bytchin about how life is unfair is a genius???

i aint knockin you, but you got ur shyt twisted

life's obviously gon be a bytch when you let yourself be treated like one

PEACEEEE
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Lol... Holy sh*t... Getting up at 6am making a drug run and then once again that day is hard work???? You're killing me dude. Just like I said in my post. This type of job is easy for people like yourself who look at it for face value. Uhhhh all I'm doing is selling some drugs. You have no clue how many lives the drugs you supply destroy and you could give a sh*t less. Selling weed is one thing but you're talking about coke here. Let me guess your next excuse. I don't force people to buy them from me. Lol f*cking lame and I seriously don't want to hear your argument on how drug money can take care of a family. A man doesn't bring that kind of lifestyle to his children. A man will do anything necessary to support his kids without jepoardizing them or himself. What use will you be as a father behind bars or dead? Come on man grow the f*ck up. Now I've done my fair share of shady deals but that was before I grew up and way before I had a child. At one time I was making $500 a day for 5 hours of work if you want to call it that. Now what I was doing was nearly foolproof. No where near the risk of selling drugs and guess what? I was never caught and the opportunity is still there. On top of that I'm one of 3 people who know how to do this. One guy is in jail for 10 years for an unrelated crime and I'm not sure where the other guy is. Basically no competition. So what stops me?

1. I grew up.
2. I have a child
3. I'm not gonna go to jail
4. It's too easy
5. I have legitmate hustles now.. I don't need that money.

If you aren't creative enough to come up with a legit hustle that doesn't hurt people than you are weak minded.
 
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Cameron Thomas said:


Lol... Holy sh*t... Getting up at 6am making a drug run and then once again that day is hard work???? You're killing me dude. Just like I said in my post. This type of job is easy for people like yourself who look at it for face value. Uhhhh all I'm doing is selling some drugs. You have no clue how many lives the drugs you supply destroy and you could give a sh*t less. Selling weed is one thing but you're talking about coke here. Let me guess your next excuse. I don't force people to buy them from me. Lol f*cking lame and I seriously don't want to hear your argument on how drug money can take care of a family. A man doesn't bring that kind of lifestyle to his children. A man will do anything necessary to support his kids without jepoardizing them or himself. What use will you be as a father behind bars or dead? Come on man grow the f*ck up. Now I've done my fair share of shady deals but that was before I grew up and way before I had a child. At one time I was making $500 a day for 5 hours of work if you want to call it that. Now what I was doing was nearly foolproof. No where near the risk of selling drugs and guess what? I was never caught and the opportunity is still there. On top of that I'm one of 3 people who know how to do this. One guy is in jail for 10 years for an unrelated crime and I'm not sure where the other guy is. Basically no competition. So what stops me?

1. I grew up.
2. I have a child
3. I'm not gonna go to jail
4. It's too easy
5. I have legitmate hustles now.. I don't need that money.

If you aren't creative enough to come up with a legit hustle that doesn't hurt people than you are weak minded.
Click to expand...

first of all, you and i have real differences at the moment:
you have a child, i can understand that you dont want ur son to be in a negative environment, and i respect that, and if i had a son i prolly wont be hustlin no dope.

2nd of all, i read from another of your posts that your moms and pops opened a homebased business and is making half a mill in revenue per year. why tha flyin **** would someone be retarded enuff to be still slangin if they were in your shoes???????

3rd of all, you have an established legal business, and you said it your own self that you used to make street money, read my post over, of course your not gonna be no petty corner hustler if your parents are making haf a mil and you own a legit entreprise making solid revenues, you dont have to be that smart to realize that you no longer need to slang.

im not going to tell you how to raise your son and im sure as **** that aint nobody gon tell me how to raise mine.
you can still live legit and not givin no **** bout your kid or beatin his ass
while i can still teach mine to take something negative and turn it into something positive. you follow your own principles, and i follow mines, and i sure aint got no problem with that. some negative action with good intensions can sure generate more positive consequences than some supposedly legit guy (take per example a crooked cop)
if i destroy 1 life but save 10 more, does it make me a bad person?
you talk as if you went through it, then you sure as hell know how i feel, don't be knockin no one down cuz they aint made it yet.

and i dont like to argue, and i am by far glamorizing street life, im working 40/50hrs legit now, so dont mis-interpret my words.

i just found it funny that this dude is whining bout working da 9-5 and wondering why dope dealers made it out.

i make music just like you and everyone is a brother to me, so dont try to come at me like that.

ps:ref waking up at 6in the morning for a delivery, lol thats all i could come up with, and giving too much details would get me warnings for this delicate subject.

anyways im out.
PEAAACEEE
 
First of all yes my parents make decent money now but it was not like that when I was growing up and I never see any of that money. They started making good cash after I was long gone. Second of all I never slanged drugs. What I was involved in was not even closely related and the only negative affect it had was on the filthy rich who never even noticed. That doesn't make it right but it's still far from slangin' dope. No matter what anyone wants to think you do get what you put into life. The easier you make money the easier it goes away. For instance I have an opportunity right now to be making an extra $4000 or more a month and I only have to spend around 5 minutes a day working on it. It's completely legal but I'm still aprehensive about going forward with it. Why? I honestly feel that it's too much money for the ammount of effort I'd be putting in. It just doesn't balance right. Life is about balance.
 
In an attempt to bring this thread back around full circle to where it started.

First off Cameron, let me say I listened to your beats and they are tight. i like them. Nice use of samples, and nice composition. God forbid making hip hop tracks should involve composition, lol.
Not that you need my opinion, it seems you have a healthy sense of your own talent (which is fine).
I think it would be a great idea if you started a production alias to make more "mainstream" style tracks. not limiting yourself to one particular sound or style could help you a lot. Though it is probably best to attach your production to talented people, rather than "talentless" people.
If you find it easy to make these tracks , then you probably have a talent for them and you should use it. I am all for people not pigeon holing themselves and branching out their styles.
It's also not wrong to tailor your style to fit what someone wants or is easier to sell.
I have started making bootleg edits and remixes cause those are so easy to sell. they are fun to make (and not easy to do well) and will help me get my foot in the door and get me some scratch while I'm at it.
Now I'm talking about a vinyl dance market, not a mainstream market. But I have a job so I'm not trying to "make it". I just want to be able to put my music out.

I would also like to just point out a couple things about people's comments on "mainstream" and "underground". first off I think there is good music and bad music in both the underground and the mainstream.
But also realize that the current "mainstream" (esp hiphop) used to be underground). gangsta rap? started as a movement against the mainstream rap of mc hammer etc. Neptunes, kanye, Lil jon,...all these producers MADE their sound mainstream. They became the mainstream from the underground.
kanye is a perfect example..is he underground or mainstream? He is huge so mainstream right? But listen to the tracks he does for Common. They sound "underground".
Or look at Jay Z..he is mainstream as anyone, but he makes his rep through his realness...a quality of the underground.
These things aren't so simple, and many times it would be hard to make a distinction solely on the music.

Lastly whoever said that "Drop it like its Hot" is wack becasue it is simple is way wrong. and if it would get laughed out of the beats forum, maybe people sould re-evaluate what they laugh out of the forum. Neptunes are, and have always been, kings of simple beats. "Grindin", almost all the tracks for Busta.
yes, someone else could get the same sounds and make that beat...but did they? did anyone else say...i'm done, that is all this beat needs.
Making something simple and fresh is a talent.

it's like seeing Andy Warhol and saying "Dude, that is wack, I have Campbell's soup cans at home".
 
Yeah I've actually considered using an alias for mainstream type tracks I do. I'm actually not against working with mainstream artists. I was recently sent a remix project for Ginuwine and I turned a mix in to Sony. I had to do a more "mainstream" sounding track because it was the only thing that would sound right with his vocals. I didn't care for the track when it was finished but others liked it and in that case that was what mattered. I considered this just to be work and not a representation of myself as an artist. I specifically tailored the track for a market. Namely teenage and twenties females. I turned it in under Cameron Thomas but I think I'm actually going to start using an alias for projects I consider just to be work. As far as the mainstream vs. underground terms I totally agree with you there. Underground really isn't a sound. I should say that I prefer concious hip hop and the beats that usually go along with it. Kanye's tracks are definitely this kind of sound but Kanye's tracks lack in alot of areas compared to other producers with a similar sound. I totally agree and understand what you are saying though. Like alot of southern rap is underground like three 6 mafia used to be underground sh*t. Esham is an underground artist from Detroit his style is considered acid rap. As for Neptunes and why they are so successful. I think it has alot to do with the quirkiness of their sound. All in all though I'm not against producing a certain sound or for mainstream artists as long as I feel what they are about. That mainstream sound just comes easy to me and then after I've made something I don't feel it's good just because it was easy...lol I know I'm strange but I guess I need challenge.
 
I used to be like you...I'm too good for this extra money or I'm too good for the mainstream. I can make ANY electronic-based beat and I'm sure others can too. There is nothing wrong with it.
I gotta go back to Cali and it's time to blow up.
 
if it is too easy for you to make the music, then maybe you should focus your effort on finding a sellable artist to work with and pushing them.
You know...move the work of the more "commercial" sounding tracks to the business side.
Then you'll feel more justified taking young girls money, lol.
 
lol... I hear ya. I'm actually looking for some artists to work with in my area. It's not easy finding the talent in this area though. Well the kind of talent I'm looking for. I'm basically looking for the next Talib Kweli, Common, Black Thought, etc. Most cats around here are stuck in the 90's honestly. People in Michigan are still wanting to sound like old Flint artists like Dayton Family and M.C. Breed. I am working with one artist right now but he recently moved to Vancouver to go to film school. We're still working on his project sending material back and forth but I'm looking for other artists to work with face to face as well. We have some artists out here that I dig like Now On, Athletic Mic League, One.Be.Lo. etc. but they pretty much have their production teams that they work with exclusively. I'd really like to find a female lyricist who can actually flow on a concious level. My goal is basically to have the mainstream and underground market with one sound. The mass appeal and cash flow of mainstream with the respect of the underground. That's hard to find but those are my favorite kind of artists. I'd say the only artists out there doing this is Talib Kweli, Common, The Roots, Kanye(sort of) and Outkast.
 
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I hear you...
as was listening to a few more of your beats, and especially "Cold" (the one you compare to the gorillaz) I think it was.. these are tracks that could sell as instrumental productions. You actually have some song elements to your beats, and they actually develop over time.
You should think about shopping some of the tracks as complete instrumental tracks. Plenty of underground producers, from Shadow, to RJD2 and Prefuse got their start with solo work, then moved to producing for MCs.
Just a thought.
 
Right on. Yeah if I just added a few more elements to them like vocal drops...etc They could work out for something like that. I'm just not sure how well you can sell in that genre. I've also been thinking about putting out an album similar to Basement Jaxx but more urban. A good mixture of house, hip hop and acid jazz type stuff. Btw for anyone who hasn't listened to a Basement Jaxx album all the way through, YOU SHOULD! Those guys are amazing producers and no matter what genre you produce you can find some influence in their music.
 
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