there are no rules in sampling but should there be guidelines?

a boxer needs to learn all the punches and the defensive positions before he can be considered a professional. he may not use some punches, may not fight pretty or maybe boxes too cautiously, but he has the array of skills available to him which he can come up with.

to learn basic things and then apply it is what makes us, us.

to say "oh be creative" is actually removing the bar. we will always improve.
 
I got nothing against looping but I can see how some people can perceive it as lazy. I just find chopping samples up to be way funner. Plus it can lead to some really interesting melodys.
 
agor said:
This is the mistake people make, saying theyl only ever chop. I rarely loop a record, but if theres a loop dope enough (and for me usually obscure or rare) il loop it rather than trying to chop it, as long as the fianl result is dope then theres no worries, mcs want tracks they can flow and if that means a dope simple loop then so be it.
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Agree 100%. Music is all about feeling If it works, keep it and move on.
 
agor said:
This is the mistake people make, saying theyl only ever chop. I rarely loop a record, but if theres a loop dope enough (and for me usually obscure or rare) il loop it rather than trying to chop it, as long as the fianl result is dope then theres no worries, mcs want tracks they can flow and if that means a dope simple loop then so be it.
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Preach brotha preach, i swear as a rapper too much choppin just makes it too hard to right too. But if the chops are the right parts and chop at the right places is good, but usually too much choppin with no melody just sounds like some shyt thrown together. If i cant tell when somethin is gonna come in then im with my pen like ?
 
this is a great vid to watch. always look to the past. :-)
Video explains the world's most important 6-sec drum loop - YouTube

i agree with you dmajor100. i for one do not like when people loop something and attach a kick, hat, and clap to it and claiming it as their own. that's not producing. technically it is but we all know that's some half assed bs. in the 80s and before that it was different because their resources were limited so they HAD TO LOOP. that goes for electronic dance and hip hop DJs. nowadays we don't have that problem. we've got DAWs, MPCs, and whatnot out the ass. if anything, you should look to the past, present, or future to get ideas on what to do.

i'm not against looping. but damn show some effort for god sakes.
 
Well idk if people wanna do any john doe can do then go ahead but sont even think of calling yourself as a producer and flash ir shit on youtube or any place saying u make hits.

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Well idk if people wanna do any john doe can do then go ahead but sont even think of calling yourself as a producer and flash ir shit on youtube or any place saying u make hits. But for real if any body wanna put this to rest I dare someone pick a sample and lets throw down in the battle fourms cause im tiered of you watered down so called producers or put better less than beatmakers.
 
Since when did producing become just about who makes better beats? People over analyze beats and forget that what matters is the final song that said how does battling prove you are any less of a beat maker than the people you bumped this old ass thread to chastise?beat makers worry about making dope beats producers produce songs remember that.

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acetheface954 said:
this is a great vid to watch. always look to the past. :-)
Video explains the world's most important 6-sec drum loop - YouTube

i agree with you dmajor100. i for one do not like when people loop something and attach a kick, hat, and clap to it and claiming it as their own. that's not producing. technically it is but we all know that's some half assed bs. in the 80s and before that it was different because their resources were limited so they HAD TO LOOP. that goes for electronic dance and hip hop DJs. nowadays we don't have that problem. we've got DAWs, MPCs, and whatnot out the ass. if anything, you should look to the past, present, or future to get ideas on what to do.

i'm not against looping. but damn show some effort for god sakes.
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Chopping came from limitations in the 80s not looping. In the 70s and 80s it was about digging up a great loop in 2011 people chop for the sake of doing it. But back when 10 seconds of sample time was a lot to work with u had to chop.
 
Meh.

I don't think producing with samples should be all about making something people don't recognize.

TBH I hate all them gay ass "rules".

I say this: It's all about results. You do whatever gets you results.

Some samples I try and flip, some I loop, some I sample songs that have already been sampled.

If you wanna limit yourself you won't hear any complaints from me.

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For instance one beat I've been working on, and I'm racking my head thinking about how to chop it, and make variations and all that bullshit.

Bottom line is the melody is the rhythm on the song- it's a song that has no drums, and just an active rhythm guitar.

I loved the way it sounded looped with the "Impeach The President" loop over it, the beat just has a very traditional "hip-hop" feel to it in my head.

I kept chopping the sample trying different permutations and none of them sound as good as two loops playing over each other.

So why should I try and make things unnecessarily hard or even butcher a song?

For what reason?

When somebody hears the song are they gonna think "I like how that sounds" or are they gonna think "OMG this guy totally layered two loops over each other"?

Be real here, I'm not concerned with upholding some dumb standard, rather I care more about results than anything.

So what I did was chop the song into two 4 bar loops, the only thing I actually chopped up was the break beat, and that was only because the second loop of the guitar is accented on different beats so I wanted the kick and snare to match that.

I'll end on this: All the lame ass elitist traditional bullshit is just nonsense.

When they made "Rapper's Delight", were they worried about chopping the loop?

What song is more traditional then that song?

Stop nitpicking for shit to complain about and get it done however you have to.
 
agor said:
This is the mistake people make, saying theyl only ever chop. I rarely loop a record, but if theres a loop dope enough (and for me usually obscure or rare) il loop it rather than trying to chop it, as long as the fianl result is dope then theres no worries, mcs want tracks they can flow and if that means a dope simple loop then so be it.
Click to expand...

Word! you say it!
 
Loops aren't easy or uncreative - they are just easIER and LESS creative besides...

The final product is ALL that really matters.
 
A producer is not a musician, let's get it straight. We fall somewhere in between musician and PRODUCER. A producer, at least originally, was someone who organizes, listens, and judges an artist they're working with's work, and adds creative or just logical changes to an artist to maximize the artist's song(s) potential.

While a hip hop producer is certainly different from the original producer, I still feel that a lot of those aspects of the original producer are still important for our role. Relating that to making beats, I think one of the most important parts of being a producer is just having good ears. What I mean by that is, you should have good taste in music; you should know what kind've sounds and arrangements are going to make people really get it. You also have to know what kind of rhythm, and overall groove can really get an MC writing and spitting to his/her utmost potential.

Yes loops might not be as technically "creative", but I don't think our role is to be the next Coltrane. We're not so much performers as we are producers/engineers. It's the SOUND that you're getting. Looping an obscure Russian funk tune, EQing and compressing (and whatever else you may do) it to change the SOUND, and adding catchy and present drums with pop on em, thus "improving" the sonic qualities of that loop (according to what your listeners consider "good sounding", obviously some people may prefer the way the original sounded) is essentially playing the role of the original producer: you're improving the songs sonic characteristics, often times giving it a new feel.

As far as some of the 90s loops of super popular songs, well yeah I can't really defend anything they did, but all I know is a lot of those songs are classics and to completely dispel them as uncreative and too easy is to completely lose respect for the art form you're pursuing.

I could go on for days but I will stop now ha.
 
I will relate this to graffiti.
If your a writer and you just do tags/handstyles and think you are the shit, your a toy.
You are only doing the easy part and its only a small part of the whole thing.
I respect seeing a clean dope handstyle from a great writer that does great pieces/murals and bombs.
Does this make sense?
 
2 rules to remember

1 you are not making a beat for another beat maker/producer. it doesn't matter if they feel the beat was easy or hard to make.

2 you are out to make a dope beat.

now having said that Hip Hop is a loop based music.

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dmajor100 said:
Loops are not wack its just there easy and uncreative
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chopping is hard? and always creative? I guess you might be right about creative you are creating weather your creating shit or not doesn't matter your still creating lol but then again aren't you creating with a loop?

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dmajor100 said:
Cause like I said if u looped 8 bars with everythin composed piano,bass,strings,percussion then thats audio jacking not sanpling.

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The principle
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Who samples 8 bars of a song??

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dmajor100 said:
So it would not bother u if u were working hard to get a dope track and try to be original and when other dudes atr just looping and making a beat in less than ten minutes.
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Not in the least bit. I don't concern myself with how fast a beat maker/producer can make a beat. Why should that matter to me? and why cant you make a beat in 10 minutes that is creative?

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dmajor100 said:
Well idk if people wanna do any john doe can do then go ahead but sont even think of calling yourself as a producer and flash ir shit on youtube or any place saying u make hits.

---------- Post added at 03:07 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:04 PM ----------

Well idk if people wanna do any john doe can do then go ahead but sont even think of calling yourself as a producer and flash ir shit on youtube or any place saying u make hits. But for real if any body wanna put this to rest I dare someone pick a sample and lets throw down in the battle fourms cause im tiered of you watered down so called producers or put better less than beatmakers.
Click to expand...

thats a part of your problem right there. you look down on the term beatmaker. Production and beatmaking are Two Separate Concepts. you feel somehow, a producer is above (more valuable) than a beatmaker.

A quote from Sa'id

"I've said this before, many of those who prefer the producer moniker over the beatmaker moniker have a serious inferiority complex (that they don't even know about). Many of these self-described "producers" think that established producers people (on the outside) look down on beatmaking. Hence, they desperately aspire to be known as producers. They feel that the "producer" moniker separates and distinguishes them from being a producer. Bullshit! You wanna separate yourself from other beatmakers, make doper beats!

Finally, consider this. Every dope beatmaker has the ability to produce, if he so chooses. However, every music producer can NOT be a dope beatmaker..."
 
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Forreal though.. Some cats just don't understand that the business (and ethic) of this culture shouldn't be mentioned first. Just have fun with your music! Do what YOU like. Most of the MC's out there are looking for originality. Most producers (not good ones) think that it's about "sounding right". It should sound good to YOU. That's what people are REALLY looking for. If you're working with an MC, ask him/her what they feel about the vibe and go at it as such. Don't choose to set parameters - break them. Leave the "cookie cutters" alone and get messy, get sloppy, fine tune and enjoy your creation. Whether looped or chopped.

Make a mistake and do something right. ~Sun Ra
 
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