Lazy Sampling?

DrizzyWadeSt

New member
Okay so I made a thread basically bashing people who like sampling a while back until I really got into J Dilla and studied him and found out the way he flips samples are amazing. I would listen to the original song and then listen to the one he flipped and it would sound so different.

But what leads me to this and that is how come some samplers literally will take a part of a song and loop it and just leave it as it is? Like Kanye West on Touch the Sky he took the trumpets from Curtis Mayfield and it sounds like he didn't even really flip it just took it and put it in his song? Is that what you guys call lazy sampling or is that normal? If its normal then thats sad. I watched videos of sampling and I saw people take parts of songs and put it into a sampler and just re arrange it but Kanyes samples sounds like dude didn't even re arrange it. Maybe I'm wrong but I don't know can someone explain it to me
 
If i understand you...you wanna say that the Touch the Sky is bullshit instrumental from Kanye West? Nah...yep he didnt arranged these trumpets but that song isnt only looped trumpets...it is very very complex masterpice...early kanye is a musical genius
 
Its normal. I don't find it lazy...if it sounds good with different drums or any kind of change then whatever. Its more about feel when your listening not saying that its complex under the hood for bragging rights to other producers. Both of the Chronic albums were basically whats described and how many people wanted to do beats after they heard that?

By all means if you can take a sample and flip it in a creative way and it sounds good then kudos to you. Sometimes simplicity is exactly whats needed though. I'd imagine it'll be a lot easier to get into a lawsuit when making a simple obvious loop if your trying sneak by without clearing it. If the song ever does get big.
 
As said previously, sound design and sampling can be synonymous, but do not have to be.
You will never understand unless you try it for yourself, you will be confused forever if that's the case.
 
Listen to Kanye's instrumental carefully. On the verse part, you hear the trumpets loop for 2 bars with a little vocal chop over it, that vocal is not there on the original song. Then, on the next 2 bars you can hear Curtis' vocals "and don't you cry" over the loop, and that's not how it is on the original song either. I guess i'm nitpicking but it seems like you're asking for it lol. Also, just listen to the drums on "Touch The Sky", nothing like on "Move On Up" and they sound more powerful. The whole mix and master of Kanye's song is better. "Touch The Sky" is like a modern, updated version of "Move On Up", even with the song topic, so i don't really understand what's there to hate on lol.
 
Listen to Kanye's instrumental carefully. On the verse part, you hear the trumpets loop for 2 bars with a little vocal chop over it, that vocal is not there on the original song. Then, on the next 2 bars you can hear Curtis' vocals "and don't you cry" over the loop, and that's not how it is on the original song either. I guess i'm nitpicking but it seems like you're asking for it lol. Also, just listen to the drums on "Touch The Sky", nothing like on "Move On Up" and they sound more powerful. The whole mix and master of Kanye's song is better. "Touch The Sky" is like a modern, updated version of "Move On Up", even with the song topic, so i don't really understand what's there to hate on lol.

Yep this...@drizzy thats what im talking about...about 00:38 where the verse starts you can hear added vocals which is not that hard but originaly...if you hate that loop samples better talk about DrDre (for example The Next episode (where 90% of normal listeners think that he made that melody...))
 
Last edited:
As Snapy Dee said, Kanye changed the drums as well as the vocal chops and I think he pitched the sample down a semi tone or two as well. That is still nothing special and isn't very difficult to do, you're right, BUT it's not sad in my opinion. You're forgetting Kanye is rapping all over the song, that's what he has changed significantly. He took Mayfield's soul/funk/disco song and turned it into a rap/hiphop song. So the talent isn't in the production, it's in the vision he had for 'Touch the Sky' and his idea of transforming 'Move On Up' into a song for a different genre.
Put it this way thousands of producers would have heard that song and probably never thought of using it for a rap beat, that's what makes Kanye creative in that sense.
Hopefully that make sense as to why just looping a sample can be creative and not just stealing.
 
I'm not gonna call Kayne lazy (I might call the arrogant cretin something else... Oh would ya look at that!!) but I definitely prefer a 'flipped' beat to a 'looped' one myself...
 
Last edited:
I'm not gonna call Kayne lazy (I might call the arrogant cretin something else... Oh would ya look at that!!) but I definitely prefer a 'flipped' beat to a 'looped' one myself...

What's the difference between a flipped beat and a looped beat? I'm fairly new to production
 
A looped beat is as it sounds... You take a sample and you loop it...

a flip (as far as I'm concerned) - is to take a sample (which may or may not 'loop'), chop the sample and re-order its parts so as to make something 'of yet different' to the original... effectively a rearrangement...
Eg: I might sample a 4-bar loop from a Stylistics track (cos they're dope), chop that loop up into 8 sections (or maybe 16) on Maschine and replay it over 4 bars using only 3 or 4 of those 8 sections; in a way that the Stylistics never dreamed they could sound...
They'll likely still recognise that my flip came from their song... But at least I did something different to it...
 
Okay so I made a thread basically bashing people who like sampling a while back until I really got into J Dilla and studied him and found out the way he flips samples are amazing. I would listen to the original song and then listen to the one he flipped and it would sound so different.

But what leads me to this and that is how come some samplers literally will take a part of a song and loop it and just leave it as it is? Like Kanye West on Touch the Sky he took the trumpets from Curtis Mayfield and it sounds like he didn't even really flip it just took it and put it in his song? Is that what you guys call lazy sampling or is that normal? If its normal then thats sad. I watched videos of sampling and I saw people take parts of songs and put it into a sampler and just re arrange it but Kanyes samples sounds like dude didn't even re arrange it. Maybe I'm wrong but I don't know can someone explain it to me

bro... you really need to stop being judgemental.. music is about feeling.. so what he looped it... the single went prolly 10x platinum... how is that wrong? people obviously liked it.. but bro with music.. you can do anything you want.. it's about pleasing the listeners.. no matter how simple the music may be.
 
Dude who are u making music for? Other producers or the people who 8/10 believe sampled shit be real compositions from producers. Its not even about that the point is its hip hop bro not jazz. Hip hops foundation was built off sampling/looping if u can't respect it why are u here? Sometimes beats call for looping sometimes chopping. I hate when producers go out their way to chop shit because other bedroom producers look down on looping. Make music for the ppl
 
In order to fully understand you have to go back to hip hop's beginning. It started with loops using 2 turntables and records and emcee's would entertain the crowd on the mic while the deejay would backspin 2 copies of the same song. Reference the movie Wild Style to see how it was done in its proper context. That is the absolute answer to why we loop samples. Chopping samples is just another technique to use when sampling. There is no set rules, just individual preferences and opinions. I hope this helps. Peace be with you...........Rob Mixx.
 
you have to go back to hip hop's beginning. It started with loops using 2 turntables and records and emcee's would entertain the crowd on the mic while the deejay would backspin 2 copies of the same song.
One could (and I'm playing Devil's Advocate for the sake of conversation) argue that there's been evolution since then and that simply looping (as the original heads did) should be described as unevolved and lacking in the skills the culture has developed since then...
 
But what leads me to this and that is how come some samplers literally will take a part of a song and loop it and just leave it as it is? My reply was just an answer to the question that was asked in the original post. Peace be with you..............Rob Mixx
 
anyone correct me if i'm wrong but a looped beat is like taking like a 8 bar part of a song normally with no drums and looping it and putting your own drums on it a, flipped beat is like the crazy shit in Nas is like or T.R.O.Y ,like taking little segement from a record, or multiple records and putting them together in to something completly new. Now I wouldn't call looping lazy because some parts of a record are so dope that as a producer you just gotta step back and let the sample speak for his self, now I will say flipping is truily an artform all its own, but I will say the say that using samples that have already been flipped amazingly and try to flip them again, is lazy, unless it flipped even better than before
 
anyone correct me if i'm wrong but a looped beat is like taking like a 8 bar part of a song normally with no drums and looping it and putting your own drums on it a, flipped beat is like the crazy shit in Nas is like or T.R.O.Y ,like taking little segement from a record, or multiple records and putting them together in to something completly new. Now I wouldn't call looping lazy because some parts of a record are so dope that as a producer you just gotta step back and let the sample speak for his self, now I will say flipping is truily an artform all its own, but I will say the say that using samples that have already been flipped amazingly and try to flip them again, is lazy, unless it flipped even better than before

well im making old school style beats, and yea i am making and looped one also and choped/flipped...but yeah i agree with you about that for loop beats....they are not hard to make but if thats for you, if thats enough dope sound for you, why would you change the arrangement[FONT=arial, sans-serif] [/FONT]of that..? :)

also for flipped beats ill say : Its all real - Pitch Black (prod. DJ Premier),
For looped: for example songs which used sample from [h=1]Deep Purple - Soldier Of Fortune[/h]why should anyone change that melody..:D
 
Back
Top