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Thread: 8 VOCAL Fattening techniques (Explain how to do)

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    EMCEE EXORCIST SR is offline Registered User
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    8 VOCAL Fattening techniques (Explain how to do)

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    Please explain how you would perform one or all eight of these vocal fattening techniques if all you had was (one mono vocal track and Cubase 4) also please identify technique by number within your response.
    Thank you!
    EE

    Mike Thorton wrote “Fattening Your Vocal Sound”
    Once you have comped your master vocal track, there are other tricks you can apply to improve the vocal sound further. Most of these techniques depend on creating multiple layers and making each of them different from the original. The trick is to make sure the difference is very subtle, or it becomes too obvious that you are listening to multiple versions of the same thing. Here are some ideas to set you going:

    1)Try small amounts of 'good' distortion by using a valve sound plug-in or a tape-simulation plug-in. You could even use a real tape machine to run the vocal sound through and then slip the resulting track back to compensate for the tape delay.
    2) Send to a subtle chorus from the main vocal track and pan the return to the left. Then repeat it and pan that to the right, but invert the phase of the second one. This gives the vocal a nice wide effect in stereo, but the effect completely disappears in mono. Watch you don't use too much of this effect, though, as the vocal might be too low when the mix is collapsed to mono.
    3) Use small amounts of doubling via a very tight delay. Try using a stereo delay with left and right settings somewhere around 35ms, but slightly different from each other, and bring it up just enough until you hear the vocal spread. Alternatively, try using a stereo delay plug-in and starting with 15ms delay on the left side and 30ms on the right. You get a nice wide vocal that doesn't cancel out in mono. Mix in the original and the delayed track to taste but not too wide, or too close to the centre either.
    4) Doubling the vocal by recording it a second time usually sounds like... doubling the vocal by recording it a second time. However, if you keep the double low enough in the mix, it can sound a little bigger without the double becoming too obvious. If you plan to use this technique then whilst you are comping, make a 'double' track using the 'second best' elements. Note that for this double track, timing accuracy with the master vocal track is more important than tuning.
    5) An alternative doubling technique is to get the vocalist to sing the 'double' differently. If the main voice is sung with some smile and energy, try to do the double with almost no projection, adding a lot of whisper and breath. Alternatively you can also try to do a 'double' track with more energy, but be aware that this does not always fit every style of music. If that doesn't work, try getting the vocalist to record an extra 'accent' track by hitting the on-the-beat phrases very hard and singing the rest very quietly. Then combine this track with the main vocal track to give it more energy. You can also try using this 'accent' track instead of the main vocal track to drive your vocal reverb.
    6) You could try the so-called 'Ricky Martin' technique. You leave the main vocal track panned centre, and you take two copies. Pan one hard left and pitch-shift by minus four cents, pan the other hard right and pitch-shift by plus four cents. Try different amounts of pitch adjustment — you can usually use larger amounts of pitch adjustment on backing vocals.


    The next two tricks are a bit too severe for an exposed lead vocal, but great for fattening out backing vocals...
    7) Route to a Waves PS22 stereo width expander plug-in via an Aux, spread the stereo image to taste and mix it back into the backing vocal subgroup. It can make them sound nice, big and wide.
    8)Try using a real-time pitch-shifter such as Digidesign's DPP1 set to slightly flatten and sharpen — say by around minus four and plus three cents — and have it return on a stereo Aux input. The important part of this trick is to have the dry, un-pitch-shifted version panned slightly to one side and the pitched version panned fully over to the opposite side (ie. pan the Aux send to the opposite direction compared to its source, and wider). Do this with every vocal in the backing vocal group individually, taking whatever panning you have on each element and making it opposite and more for the pitched version. It's like adding more performances on the other side of the stereo sound field.
    With all these vocal fattening tricks, make sure you check how it sounds in mono, especially when using an effect which involves time delay, as the mono could sound muddy or phasy.

    Other Vocal Tips
    9) If you find sibilance from the vocal track is hitting the reverb and making it splash, rather than 'pre-EQing' the feed to the reverb to roll off the high frequencies, try using a de-esser in the send path to the reverb. This will give you a 'splash-free' reverb sound while maintaining the clarity of the vocal line.
    10) Another reverb-related trick is to insert a compressor on your send track before the reverb. Set the compressor to compress the loud vocals but to leave the quieter, more intimate sections uncompressed. The loud sections will then be dryer and the soft sections wetter — tweak the compressor setting to taste.
    11) Finally, here's a trick that can brighten a vocal without resorting to conventional EQ. Make a duplicate of the main vocal track, route both vocal tracks through an Aux track, and move any plug-ins that were on the main vocal track to the Aux track. Then remove the plug-ins on the duplicate track and replace them by a compressor with a built-in side-chain such as Waves' C1. Set it to run as a side-chain compressor, and to listen to only the side-chain. Set the side-chain frequency around 8 to 12 kHz, and compress it very hard. Gently mix the duplicate track in with the original vocal, and tune the frequency to suit the vocalist's sound

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    Storm is offline Registered User
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    5) An alternative doubling technique is to get the vocalist to sing the 'double' differently. If the main voice is sung with some smile and energy, try to do the double with almost no projection, adding a lot of whisper and breath.
    I love this idea.

    Good thread.

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    Mixteco's Avatar
    Mixteco is offline Registered User
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    good deal of info

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    DaVille is offline Registered User
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    yeah this is some good stuff bro...

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    Astar is offline Registered User
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    Welcome to FP man. Really good thread.

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    Stoff is offline Producer
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    some good points in there

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    EMCEE EXORCIST SR is offline Registered User
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    I started this thread to learn how to perform the eight plus techniques for vocal fattening
    I have placed an example of a excellent response just above the thirteen techniques
    IF Cubase 4 can perform one of the Techniques and you know how to set the Technique up in Cubase 4
    Please share Your set up procedures in this thread
    Included the Technique number from my first entry

    Thank you for your help
    and God bless you and your family
    EE
    Last edited by EMCEE EXORCIST SR; 11-15-2008 at 11:48 AM.

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    73*'s Avatar
    73*
    73* is offline Listening is Paramount
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    Sorry, most of these "tricks" involve you needing more than one take of the vocal. Unless the tricks state otherwise.

    It sounds like you might not understand how to set up aux sends and buses in cubase. Check the manual it'll explain it really clearly. Also keep in mind Cubase normaly calls a "bus" a "group tack" and an "Aux" a "FX track" (mind you I'm a SX2 user, so they may have changed that in version 4).
    "The triumphs of ignorance and marketing over electro-acoustics and psyco-acoustics are multitude. With the popularisation of the recording industry, and the hype of commercial manufacturers, it is hardly surprising that many facts get buried in the hype, or even get flat out denied. However, the truth still exists, and the people who want to hear it are perhaps the ones who will be better prepared to make high quality recordings in high quality studios." - Philip Newell

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    EMCEE EXORCIST SR is offline Registered User
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    Quote Originally Posted by 73*
    Sorry, most of these "tricks" involve you needing more than one take of the vocal. Unless the tricks state otherwise.

    It sounds like you might not understand how to set up aux sends and buses in cubase. Check the manual it'll explain it really clearly. Also keep in mind Cubase normaly calls a "bus" a "group tack" and an "Aux" a "FX track" (mind you I'm a SX2 user, so they may have changed that in version 4).
    73* i know how to set up groups and Fx aux

    >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Here is an Example of a Excellent response on how to do ONE OF THESE TECHNIQUES:

    To do Technique # 2
    JanHendrikPeters wrote:
    "Create two FX tracks both with the same Chorus and the same settings. Make sure that the choruses are set to Wet 100%
    Pan one to the left and one to the right. On one of them you have to invert the Input phase. The respective Symbol looks like an O with a / on top of it.
    Use the sends of your vocal track to send the vocal signal to the FX tracks. (Send1 to route the signal to FX 1- Chorus and Send 2 to route the signal to FX 2- Chorus. You need to have the same send levels on both send for this to work correctly)
    I would route both FX tracks to a Group in order to have better control of the level of this effect." <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< <<<

    Emcee Exorcist performed JanHendrikPeter's procedure and confirmed it works.
    Thank You JanHendrikPeters
    Last edited by EMCEE EXORCIST SR; 11-15-2008 at 04:48 PM. Reason: Automerged Doublepost

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    Morning_Star's Avatar
    Morning_Star is offline ProTools + Reason user
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    Most of these are cheap tricks that won't take over great takes, great dubs, professional artist, professional gear, and professional mixing engineers.

    My favorite way to thicken vocals: Record several perfect takes and mix/pan them well.

    Delays are nice but they don't have to be short. Aux sends give the some of the best results with compression, reverb and other fx's on a send instead of an insert. That's the only "tricks" I would suggest.

    I feel like there is too much stress in getting the thickest sounding vocals. Not all lead vocals need to be super thick. They just need to fit the mood or vibe of the track. More important is how dark or warm, how crisp or bold, how clean or grimy, how mellow or aggressive, how sharp or lazy, or how clear or muttered.
    Macbook Pro i7, Digi 002R, JBL LSR4328, CL7602 mic pre, SM7b, GT66, ProTools 10, Reason 5.

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