Mixing: STEMS vs. MIDI in DAW session

epic1beatz

epic1beatz
Quick question for all you producers out there:

Do you guys usually mix directly in the DAW with the MIDI/Audio data (like when you make the beat initially) or do you bounce to STEMS and then do a new mix from there?

I'm referring to when you mix your own beats, not when you ship them out to another engineer.

My mixing is not all that great at the moment but I'm thinking that stemming out might help. Especially for issues with CPU usage in LogicX on my old 2009 iMac :cool:.

Thanks all,
epic1
epic1beatz on Twitter
 
The more you can consolidate, convert midi to audio, "freeze" tracks and effects, etc., the less taxation on your cpu and the (technically) "easier" it becomes to manage the mix (track count wise).

The problem is that you have to be very sure of your pre-mixes/sub-mixes, because you are committing to balances and EQ's and such. At some point you run out of (or lose track of) "undo's," so just be cautious and "measure twice, cut once," if you know what I mean.

GJ
 
The problem is that you have to be very sure of your pre-mixes/sub-mixes, because you are committing to balances and EQ's and such.

No need to bounce everything to audio - you can just convert the pre-fx audio and keep all the fx "live" still. And of course you can still add new fx even if you commit the old ones...sometimes it's nice to sort of "clear the table" when a mix is starting to get busy. And further still...it's not like you have to destroy your original project files, so nothing does not need to be lost even if you bounce everything into audio.
 
>>>>And further still...it's not like you have to destroy your original project files, so nothing does not need to be lost even if you bounce everything into audio.<<<<

True. It is a work-flow thing, and a data-management thing. For a long time, we saved files of each and every version and each and every step in the process. After awhile, you just start commiting and saving the latest version as "the" version, to keep your sanity and to save on the umpteenth terabyte drive or DVD data disc for the over-flowing project drawer...

GJ


 
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For a long time, we saved files of each and every version and each and every step in the process. After awhile, you just start commiting and saving the latest version as "the" version, to keep your sanity and to save on the umpteenth terabyte drive or DVD data disc for the over-flowing project drawer...

Yeah, I don't really keep too many versions of projects stashed up either, but at turning points like, well, committing everything to audio, I probably do save a backup version with everything intact. I think it's a common sense thing more than anything else.
 
Agreed. Depends on what it is and how pivotal a change, so "back-ups are in the ear of the beholder."

GJ
 
Thanks for all the replies. I've been working mostly with Freezing Tracks (in Logic X) and that helps with the CPU issue. The other thing I do is save "Alternate Versions". This way I can keep the original mix, composition. Then do an alternate that is the "Cleaned Up" version i.e. drums tightened and cleaned up from playing errors, velocities more consistent, etc. Then I can do another alternate for mixing etc.

I was just curious since I read an article about bouncing to stems. Mainly, because you don't go back and change things 100x since you wouldn't have the MIDI. I kind of agree with that b/c I'll sit on the same beat forever trying to perfect it, rather than moving on to the next thing.

-epic1
epic1beatz on Twitter
 
I bopunce every MIDI track to it's own audio channel, and then just mute the MIDI tracks/close the VST instruments when I mix. By the time it comes to mixing I'm usually happy with the composition but it's still easy to go back and make changes if necessary.

Personally I find I have more control over things in audio - can apply different effects and chop/reverse my audio stems in a way that I wouldn't if they were just MIDI.
 
Good question. I used to be paranoid about bouncing because I didn't want to commit to a track until mix down, but the more experienced I got the more I realized that I got 90% of the sound within the first minute of laying the sound down anyway, so I was keeping all these CPU hungry VSTs open for no reason.

Now, I bounce stems as soon as possible so I get in the habit of committing, then I deactivate the original track an always have it if I need to go back to it for something. Gotta be careful with rhythmic stuff though, because my auto delay compensation messes up rhythmic stuff when I try to bounce sometimes so always A/B the bounce right after with the rest of the track playing to make sure it sounds the same.
 
That's good advice. I noticed another guy on YouTube that said he did the same thing. I think from a CPU standpoint is good but you hit it on the head with the whole "commitment" thing.
I am a perfectionist and so I'll spend wayyyy to long on a single beat, then I get burned out. I change it so many times I never make other ones because I've been stuck on that one. Trying to get in that habit. Stemming can be a little tedious when it comes to having to clean it up before the mix but other than that it works pretty well as I'm learning.
 
I try to keep MIDIs just in case I need to change something. I used to bounce to audio due to CPU usage but recently switched to Mac and haven't had an issue
 
I would strongly suggest bouncing to audio before mixing for more than one reason:

1) you have a high res future-proof backup...

2) ... that you can remix easily without any of the vsts you had

3) everything is 100% reproducible so no random interactions between vsts

4) You can stick the stems on an SSD and get all your CPU back for mix plugins. If you can't afford a massive SSD you can get a relatively small high spec one and use it as a mix cache. Copy the stems to there for just the mix session. I don't know about other DAWs but mine is quite good for just saying "the sounds you want are here...link it all back up".


Imagine one day in the future someone comes to you and says

"we loved that track you made could you give us a version without the drums to go in a movie trailer and we'll give you royalties"...

...and you say "erm... no the project file doesn't open anymore and it uses a synth that doesn't exist..."
 
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