Masterig and Limiters
- Thread starter BigDrost
- Start date
Yes, you need to somehow tighten up the mix and by using a software limiter hard at the end of the stereo bus it works well for that, but this is a very advanced typically genre dependent type of application, you really need to know what you are doing. Great mixes/masters are segmented and approached per segment and there are segments in a mix/master where software limiters can do an important job. In EDM with lots of virtual instruments and samples, don't do it. The same with for instance productions with lots of virtual/simulated sound (e.g. digital distortion). You simply need to know whether you can afford it or not, but it is ideal if you can afford it because it tightens up the mix in an important way and adds to the releases... Again why it is so important to create enough quality before mixing...
Software limiting the final stereo track is something only some pros can do because you simply need to understand it at such a deep level, but two stage compression using hardware is something most pros can gain from... All in all, the answer is to use hardware based compressors and limiters and focus most of that before mixing.
As a general guidance also, stay away from software effects until you craft the mix/master so well that reaching for software is mostly just because you are out of creative ideas. The important thing is to establish a good energy with your music, so that when you create music you are as passionate and energetic as possible about the creation process as well as the result, it should be pure magic from start to finish, everything else is less important and should be avoided.
In my view in order to create great mixes you need to master both the "uglify" and the "beautify" processes, simply because great mixes are great when they "rock" the listeners. There are no shortcuts, all the various engineering tools you have available have their own unique energy signature and must be used as such. It is a matter of whether you as an engineer have the audio hygiene it takes or not... Don't for instance mess around with fake digital tape saturation when it is the energy signature of real tape saturation you want.
There are things to be aware of when it comes to crafting the mix. One is that you will always be able to find a pair of better speakers or cans and hence will always improve your mixes simply by hearing it better. There are tons of similar things, like for instance that you will always find a better hardware effect than a software counterpart. The more real and true the better. No compromise, just precision, accuracy, audio hygiene and crafting it elegantly, creatively, passionately and intelligently. It's not about how it sounds, it's about how it feels.
Software limiting the final stereo track is something only some pros can do because you simply need to understand it at such a deep level, but two stage compression using hardware is something most pros can gain from... All in all, the answer is to use hardware based compressors and limiters and focus most of that before mixing.
As a general guidance also, stay away from software effects until you craft the mix/master so well that reaching for software is mostly just because you are out of creative ideas. The important thing is to establish a good energy with your music, so that when you create music you are as passionate and energetic as possible about the creation process as well as the result, it should be pure magic from start to finish, everything else is less important and should be avoided.
In my view in order to create great mixes you need to master both the "uglify" and the "beautify" processes, simply because great mixes are great when they "rock" the listeners. There are no shortcuts, all the various engineering tools you have available have their own unique energy signature and must be used as such. It is a matter of whether you as an engineer have the audio hygiene it takes or not... Don't for instance mess around with fake digital tape saturation when it is the energy signature of real tape saturation you want.
There are things to be aware of when it comes to crafting the mix. One is that you will always be able to find a pair of better speakers or cans and hence will always improve your mixes simply by hearing it better. There are tons of similar things, like for instance that you will always find a better hardware effect than a software counterpart. The more real and true the better. No compromise, just precision, accuracy, audio hygiene and crafting it elegantly, creatively, passionately and intelligently. It's not about how it sounds, it's about how it feels.
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EyeAmPeriod
EyeAm.
There are no rules. You can do whatever you like. Everyone seems to want to get the LOUDEST song possible these days. This is great except that it squashes the dynamic range of a song.
So it totally depends what you're going for!
Do you want it loud, or do you want there to be perspective?
Because limiters squash the mountains and peaks into prairies.
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EyeAm.
The Masked Man.
EyeAm. The Masked Man. [Producer / Engineer] – Self Growth
So it totally depends what you're going for!
Do you want it loud, or do you want there to be perspective?
Because limiters squash the mountains and peaks into prairies.
--------------
EyeAm.
The Masked Man.
EyeAm. The Masked Man. [Producer / Engineer] – Self Growth
chris carter
New member
Typically you would use a limiter (or clipper) as the very last insert on your mix buss (if you are trying to master at the same time as you are mixing), or as the last process in a mastering chain (if you are mixing and mastering separately, which is more typical). The purpose is to reduce transient peaks as relatively inaudibly as possible so that you can then "turn up" the overall level of the final mix. For example, if your mix has a bunch of peaks hitting -6dBFS and you apply a limiter with 10dB of gain and a ceiling of -0.1dBFS, then you'll lop off 4dB of transients while making your mix sound roughly 10dB louder. The better your mix, the less audible the limiter. And the louder you try to make it with the limiter, the more audible it will be. So it's all a balancing act.
Sometimes I use limiters, particularly when I'm doing references for clients. But when I'm legitimately mastering something, I will typically use a clipper (I'll use whichever sounds better, and typically the clipper wins out). Check out Limiter No.6 which sounds amazing and has options for either a limiter or clipper (or both, among other things), although it's flexibility requires you to do a little learning as it's far from idiot-proof. It is also free.
Sometimes I use limiters, particularly when I'm doing references for clients. But when I'm legitimately mastering something, I will typically use a clipper (I'll use whichever sounds better, and typically the clipper wins out). Check out Limiter No.6 which sounds amazing and has options for either a limiter or clipper (or both, among other things), although it's flexibility requires you to do a little learning as it's far from idiot-proof. It is also free.
Synapsis
The Mepsyah's Dipsyples
Waves L3 no good? or L16? Ozone no good either? I only ever have the limiter attenuating 1 to 2 db, and it attenuates very fast and always returns to 0 like each split second.. depending on the audio... I would rather keep the dynamics and transient integrity, than overload and introduce fucked up digital distortion artifacts...
you can always turn the volume up on your speakers... which sounds so much more pleasing.. than something loud and fucked that you just want to turn down...
you can always turn the volume up on your speakers... which sounds so much more pleasing.. than something loud and fucked that you just want to turn down...
A good test to see if your mix is ready for a master bus limiter is to see how loud you can turn up your speakers before something hurts your ears.
For example. If you put on a well mixed and mastered commercial track, youll notice you csn turn it up pretty loud without any peaks hurting your ears, like a snare or sharp instrument. Many amateur mixes you cant turn up loud before something hurts your ears, or is way louder than the rest of the mix. If thats the case, then you need to fix that item, and try again. once you can turn the speakers or headphones up fairly loud without something annoying or hurting your ears, then you can use a limiter on the master bus to achieve a higher RMS value. But make sure you use the link function on the limiter to bring the threshold and ceiling down at the same time so you can hear when youve gone too far. Once you find the threshold that doesnt degrade the mix, go ahead abd bring the ceiling back up between .3 and .1
For example. If you put on a well mixed and mastered commercial track, youll notice you csn turn it up pretty loud without any peaks hurting your ears, like a snare or sharp instrument. Many amateur mixes you cant turn up loud before something hurts your ears, or is way louder than the rest of the mix. If thats the case, then you need to fix that item, and try again. once you can turn the speakers or headphones up fairly loud without something annoying or hurting your ears, then you can use a limiter on the master bus to achieve a higher RMS value. But make sure you use the link function on the limiter to bring the threshold and ceiling down at the same time so you can hear when youve gone too far. Once you find the threshold that doesnt degrade the mix, go ahead abd bring the ceiling back up between .3 and .1
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AudioPhorm
New member
I always appreciate and value your input DarkRed, but if someone does not have access to all the badass equipment necessary to achieve the result you described, then what would be your alternative solution or approach?