Home (Small Flat/Appartment) Monitoring

N

noodlemonkey

New member
Hi everyone,

I used to have a great home studio set-up as I'd converted my parents garage into a home recording studio/rehearsal room. I could play loud, turn up my monitors to 11 and listen back to my musical concoctions without worrying about neighbours at any time of the day or night. And then I met a girl and left home to be an adult : )

This was five years ago and I took all of my gear with me into my new flat. Some of the unusable (larger) gear I sold and some of it still has its purposes. However, my dream of turning the spare bedroom into a recording studio is never going to happen so my mixing and mastering has been limited to headphones up to now.

I have a pair of Fostex PM-1's that I'm seriously thinking of selling. I haven't been able to use them and even if I did, the acoustics of the spare room aren't great and I doubt my neighbours would be pleased. Especially as I'm usually one of the first people to bang on the walls when their kids are being noisy! My flat also isn't huge so trying to fit monitors and stands alongside the laundry is impracticable.

I surely can't be the only person out there who wants to record, mix and master at home, but doesn't have the space or forgiving neighbours? How do you adjust? I know that solely mixing and mastering on headphones isn't ideal. Using crappy desktop-type speakers is also unreliable.

Any suggestions would be great. Are there any monitors out there specific to this purpose i.e. non active/passive - laptop type speaker/monitors. Previously I would use as many different sound sources as possible to test my mixes (the car, crappy laptop speakers, hi-fi, ipod - and lastly my PM-1's) as it enables me to highlight the imbalances that have been previously hidden.

I'm just looking for some insight and stories of how you guys and gals adapt. I look forward to hearing from you

Cheers
 
i just skimmed it but my understanding is you're in a home setting and cant be loud?

Id just invest in a GOOD pair of cans..Probably the AKG 702s or Sennheiser 650s. Then just listen to a TON of commercial music on them and closely analyze that music. Get used to how the bass is supposed to feel in your headphones, get used to the highs, everything. Rather than worrying about having a flat natural setting to mix in (which obviously you cant get right now based on OP), just get used to how things are supposed to sound in the headphones you decide on. Then mix your music to sound like that.

Any gear is good enough for monitoring, you just need to get used to that gear and mix accordingly.

My headphones right now, (at first) had horrible translation. But ive listened to so much music on them now that I know how the bass is supposed to feel in a commercially acceptable song. So instead of worrying about the meters and stuff now, I just mix my song until I hear it how its supposed to be compared to other songs.

I also have monitors but still, thats what I do when I'm using my cans which is 99% of the time.
 
KODID said:
Id just invest in a GOOD pair of cans..Probably the AKG 702s or Sennheiser 650s. Then just listen to a TON of commercial music on them and closely analyze that music. Get used to how the bass is supposed to feel in your headphones, get used to the highs, everything. Rather than worrying about having a flat natural setting to mix in (which obviously you cant get right now based on OP), just get used to how things are supposed to sound in the headphones you decide on. Then mix your music to sound like that.
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Thanks for your comment. Up to now and due to home limitations (you're correct, I have to keep noise levels to a minimum therefore pumping mixes out of my PM1's is a no, no!) I've followed you're approach i.e. cans - judging other records and the production or instruments levels so I can attempt to replicate.

The only downside with cans is that the ears can become tired (increasingly quickly dependant on volume) after hours of repetition. What sometimes sounds like an amazing mix can sound complete shite after some rest and time away! lol It's the reason why I loved mixing on monitors, because you could spend a bit more time and role reverse between the two for different perspectives (I'd always assess my panning via cans, for example).

I know that mixing exclusively via a pair of headphones isn't ideal. Do you plug into a hi-fi or any other sound source for some alternative judgement? I guess if you know the equipment well, playing your own mixes through them you will immediately know whether it stands up to commercial records.
 
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noodlemonkey said:
Thanks for your comment. Up to now and due to home limitations (you're correct, I have to keep noise levels to a minimum therefore pumping mixes out of my PM1's is a no, no!) I've followed you're approach i.e. cans - judging other records and the production or instruments levels so I can attempt to replicate.

The only downside with cans is that the ears can become tired (increasingly quickly dependant on volume) after hours of repetition. What sometimes sounds like an amazing mix can sound complete shite after some rest and time away! lol It's the reason why I loved mixing on monitors, because you could spend a bit more time and role reverse between the two for different perspectives (I'd always assess my panning via cans, for example).

I know that mixing exclusively via a pair of headphones isn't ideal. Do you plug into a hi-fi or any other sound source for some alternative judgement? I guess if you know the equipment well, playing your own mixes through them you will immediately know whether it stands up to commercial records.
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I know the problem, the best way to fight that is to take a 10+ minute break and get the loop out of your head, concentrate on something else. Then come back and listen to the mix again and TRUST YOUR FIRST IMPRESSION. Your ears will get used to it again after listening to it the first time back.. So just trust your first impression and change anything that throws you off. Thats how I deal with ear fatigue and ears getting used to certain loops that actually sound like shit.
 
KODID's solution is good but I think a better one would be to move out of the flat into a house where you can make a little more noise.

That said... I moved out of our 'spare' room when my wife got pregnant (It's now a nursery) and moved up into the attic - had to put a floor down, board and insulate the roof and walls and had a new ladder accessed hatch in... Made the mistake of having the hatch put in our bedroom... Baby is now 10 weeks old and in those 10 weeks I've only managed to spend about 8 hours in the studio as he sleeps in our room (yep - the 'nursery' is going 'spare') so I can't make any noise up there anyway...
And as I hit the pads pretty hard headphones are also useless!

Im ranting... Sorry... You need to move.
 
Thanks KODID. My PM-1's have gone up on eBay : ( but they have been sitting on top of a cupboard in the spare room for almost five years. It's about time someone gave them some loving and put them back to good use.

Am tempted to delve into the near-field/desktop/bookshelf monitoring market and see what's out there. It's mainly so I have another reference for my mixes. Something like the M-Audio AV32 range... I'm just doing some research at the moment.
 
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Hi NoodleMonkey, first I'd like to say that it's actually good that you can't listen to your mixes at loud volumes for any length of time, because thats one of the worst things you can do. Your ears get damaged in the short term and lead to you not being able to hearing your mix correctly. Getting a decent pair of small monitors is the way to go but you can always use your cans for loud volume referencing (only in short bursts).

Recently I tried out the Munro Sonic Egg 100's to use at home (I have the Egg 150's in a commercial studio I work in) and as small reference monitors go they can't be touched at the price (there are other great small monitors out there but i've been sold on the eggs after using their 7 day try out), not to say they are cheap but it's amazing what you hear when you mix with decent monitors at a level thats not only better for your ears, but once you get used to it you'll wonder why you ever listened to mixes loud. Good luck in your search :)
 
If youre def going with monitors, I live in an apartment and use ADAM A7Xs..they are GREAT for having on very low volume and still having massive clarity. Greats an understatement.
 
KODID said:
If youre def going with monitors, I live in an apartment and use ADAM A7Xs..they are GREAT for having on very low volume and still having massive clarity. Greats an understatement.
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I have those too. My opinion for apartment studios is to dampen the sound. Get some foam under your monitors and on the walls. I've never had complaints about the sound and play music pretty loud sometimes. But then again, I work during the day while most people are away for work.
 
Thanks guys for all of the responses. Agree that listening to mixes for any length of time at loud volumes has a negative impact. Everything sounds great loud when you can feel it vibrating through you!

The A7X's and Egg 100's are way out of my budget and I'm looking for something slightly more portable. Hence why the M-Audio range captured my attention on both fronts. I want to avoid 12kg each monitors, external amplifiers, stand mounts etc. I'm also not in a position to start applying acoustic treatment to my spare room as I rent.

There's no point in me having 120w monitors if I can only turn them up 10%, for example. That's the dilemma with my PM1's (which I purchased back in 2004) and why I've decided to sell them.

I generally use all type of devices and sources to test my mixes (car test, crappy desktop speakers, hi-fi, iphone etc.) as I find it really helpful and certain frequencies jump out at you (or disappear) depending on what you're listening out of and the related volume. But now I'm wanting something in the <= £100 range to act as another reference.
 
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I'mNoGuru said:
KODID's solution is good but I think a better one would be to move out of the flat into a house where you can make a little more noise.
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I live in London. If I could afford to move into a house and pay for a mortgage then I probably wouldn't be writing this right now. I'd be on my yacht or paying professionals to master my stuff for me ; )
 
noodlemonkey said:
I live in London. If I could afford to move into a house and pay for a mortgage then I probably wouldn't be writing this right now. I'd be on my yacht or paying professionals to master my stuff for me ; )
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It's not that expensive to have pretty good producers mix/master your work. Superstar O has worked with many major label artists and he mixes beats for $40.
 
noodlemonkey said:
I live in London. If I could afford to move into a house and pay for a mortgage then I probably wouldn't be writing this right now. I'd be on my yacht or paying professionals to master my stuff for me ; )
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You should definitely move out of 'that London.

(Yorkshire Boy)
 
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