How to improve???

W

World Phamous

New member
I am at a point right now where I feel I have accomplished much but still have many areas that I need to improve on with most of that being music theory. I have bought the music theory books and watched countless tutorials and I just can't retain the information or grasp I think due to my lack of music background. I really enjoy making music and to try and get around these problems I am leaning towards taking private lessons and or going to a local college/online for some classes as well.


I can get the lessons for somewhere in the ball park of 25-30 per hour. I know that I need to cover chord progressions as well as scales and eartraining. What else do I need to really focus on. With the college I have been looking around and I might be forced to do it online. I work 10-7 and haven't been able to find any night classes in the Chicago area. I found the Berklee online courses and while they are expensive, do you think they would be beneficial? The money isn't exactly coming out of my pocket. (free tuition from the army) I am well aware that you get what you pay for and basically I just want to put myself in a position where I can steadily improve. I know success doesn't come over night but most of my time spent in my DAW is mostly me improvising doing things that I really don't know why I am doing it but only doing it because it works for me.

Basically I need advice on what lessons to pursue as well as schools or classes. I prefer the school be online unless someone knows where I can find some night classes around Chicago.
 
Do you know how to play an instrument? Theory is difficult to grasp without having an instrument to apply it to.
 
njm255 said:
Do you know how to play an instrument? Theory is difficult to grasp without having an instrument to apply it to.
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Can't cosign this comment enough! Learning theory without an instrument is wasted time. You'd be better off not learning theory and playing your instrument by ear in that case.

I would suggest getting private piano lessons. Before you can learn music theory, you need to be able to understand how to play music first. Too many people make the mistake of learning theory first, then have no idea how to apply it because they never learned how to hear it or play it. TUNES! LEARN SONGS! Learn to read music-its not hard and it can make you a valuable asset in certain situations. I'm working on my sight-reading chops daily.

I took one semester of basic theory and two semesters of college-level theory at a community college along with two semesters of classical piano and jazz improv and private guitar lessons once a week. Best investment you can make in your musical journey. I also ask that you consider playing with other musicians-once you get comfortable with the basics of piano, find some local jams or musicians of similar or higher skill level to play with. There is SOOOOOOOO much you can learn about yourself playing with others that you will never learn on your own.
 
It's been years since I actually played an instrument. I am not against taking basic piano lessons to get things going. I am basically open to anything that will help me continue to improve
 
Another question, is learning the piano really needed for what I am trying to achieve? I have read many posts from people here who don't play a instrument who have learned music theory. I only need things that will help with melodies such as chord progressions and scales. Does this still require that I have knowledge of an instrument?
 
World Phamous said:
Another question, is learning the piano really needed for what I am trying to achieve? I have read many posts from people here who don't play a instrument who have learned music theory. I only need things that will help with melodies such as chord progressions and scales. Does this still require that I have knowledge of an instrument?
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No, learning a piano is not essential, but learning an instrument IS essential, even if your instrument is your voice. Anyone can "learn theory", but theory doesn't teach you how to make music-it teaches you how to understand music. Like I said before, you can know a ton of theory, but if you can't play music-you don't know squat, really. This is why all university music programs require an audition. You think someone can just walk in there like, "Yoooo, I can't play a lick, but a nigga know hella theory tho, lemme in!"
Knowing how to play an instrument, even at a basic level, is extremely helpful for learning chords and melodies, ask yourself this---how is it not?

If I didn't know how to play an instrument, I could not do this@05:17:

...no matter how much "theory" I knew.
 
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Sorry Pumpthrust if I was not clear, I understand the importance of knowing an instrument, I just didn't understand how that would correlate to me making hip hop beats. I have never played an instrument unless you count HS band lol but I can still sit down and bang out a good beat. The reason why I was looking into music theory is because I don't know any scales, I don't know any chord progressions and I want to be able to play out melodies in my head by already knowing what keys they are. How exactly does this correlate. The reason why I am questioning this is because I have had people recommend I not take piano lessions and study up on those areas by myself or see if someone can teach me that. I am not by any means opposed to taking piano lessons, I just want to make sure that I am learning what I exactly need to learn and am not messing around with non essential things. Again by no means am I disagreeing with your advice, I just need to be sure on everything that I am doing.
 
edit well I guess I know the major scales, and that is also hurting me. None of my melodies contain any sharps or flats, which causes them to be quite plain. The overall goal is to improve my melodies.
 
Listen to jazz, specifically sax and horn players. Freddie Hubbard's Red Clay and Backlash and Miles Davis Kind of Blue are like a masterclass on melody. I practice singing the melodies from those records almost daily and it's improved my melodic sense greatly.
 
I'd like to add onto what everyone has been saying with my own 2 cents:

Learning an instrument will surely dramatically help in many ways, no matter what style of music you are creating. (All music really is based on extremely similar set of rules... at least any form of popular music, and I use the term popular very broadly.)

The reason goes so much deeper than theory - as it will PHYSICALLY allow you to understand music in a greater way. FEEL it coming out of your fingers or mouth almost. It will give you a more intrinsic understanding of what the music really does and how it interacts with the world. This goes even deeper when you have a little experience playing with a small group.

That being said though, you do not HAVE to learn an instrument to be an excellent composer/producer. I actually have a few students whom do not know any instrument, and I break down simple theory for them to have them creating their own chord progressions, leads, bass parts, rhythms, etc all without understanding how to actually "play." It's all about having a system that can actually help YOU for what you're doing.

You CAN do it without learning if that's truly your cup of tea. Focus on simple chord progressions first, chord changes, how they interact with each other, etc. After you can make a chord progression, try to understand how leads can interact with the progression, and what scale(s) you can use to make it sound great to the human ear. After that, learn how to put bass together with it, then so super important - RHYTHM. Learn how rhythm interacts with every one of these elements.

It's a lot to muster at first, but trust me, it's super fun and at a certain point it's all second nature.

That being said, as mentioned, there are endless positives to learning an instrument - and I would highly recommend even just screwing around on a piano or guitar or even just SINGING. It can only help.

One last tip - taking lessons is well worth the cost. (As long as the teacher actually knows what he/she is talking about.) Whenever I don't understand something, I learn the basics, then when I'm ready to really excel typically I pay for lessons. Every single time my growth is astronomically faster with a greater understanding. It is because of how well I know lessons work that I also give lessons. It works, and it's rewarding for everyone.

No matter what you decide, just keep at it. This is fun stuff we're talking about. You can do it! :)
 
youtube is free, inspiration is priceless
World Phamous said:
I am at a point right now where I feel I have accomplished much but still have many areas that I need to improve on with most of that being music theory. I have bought the music theory books and watched countless tutorials and I just can't retain the information or grasp I think due to my lack of music background. I really enjoy making music and to try and get around these problems I am leaning towards taking private lessons and or going to a local college/online for some classes as well.


I can get the lessons for somewhere in the ball park of 25-30 per hour. I know that I need to cover chord progressions as well as scales and eartraining. What else do I need to really focus on. With the college I have been looking around and I might be forced to do it online. I work 10-7 and haven't been able to find any night classes in the Chicago area. I found the Berklee online courses and while they are expensive, do you think they would be beneficial? The money isn't exactly coming out of my pocket. (free tuition from the army) I am well aware that you get what you pay for and basically I just want to put myself in a position where I can steadily improve. I know success doesn't come over night but most of my time spent in my DAW is mostly me improvising doing things that I really don't know why I am doing it but only doing it because it works for me.

Basically I need advice on what lessons to pursue as well as schools or classes. I prefer the school be online unless someone knows where I can find some night classes around Chicago.
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ThickD said:
youtube is free, inspiration is priceless
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Yes youtube is free, and there's tons of excellent information on there... BUT there is also TONS of terrible misinformation on there from people who have no idea what they're talking about.

It can really be disastrous for people who already don't know basic principles.

When I began, I learned from youtube for years until I actually got myself a coach. After that, I learned more in 3 months than what had taken me years to learn before from Youtube... not to mention I had to UNLEARN things I learned from YouTube because people just, again, don't know what they're talking about.

That being said, youtube is still a WONDERFUL place to learn, and by no means am I saying it should be avoided. You SHOULD be learning all you can from it... BUT just always keep in mind the amount of misinformation as well, not to mention the time sink it takes to spend hours just trying to figure out the answer to one simple question you have.

All I'm saying is that it's not a substitute for personalized lessons. They are different beasts. The only thing that tops lessons is personal experience... which a good teacher will guide you through.

As a last thought, I'd say this... when people use "I have no money" as an excuse to not get lessons, I think that speaks a lot to how badly they really want to learn. Obviously there are exceptions, but if someone is truly motivated and want this to be their life, then there are no excuses, and $30 is nothing compared to the amount of time you will save and knowledge you will gain... again though, provided the teacher is actually good.
 
SwagProductionz said:
you don't need to go to school to be a music producer honestly.. it's either you have the skill or you don't..
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I agree that you don't need to go to school at all. We are in a truly wonderful time where you can not only not go to school and be an incredible producer, but you also can bust out industry quality productions and mixes in a home setup.

However, I completely disagree that you either have the skill or you don't. Anyone can learn to be a producer. All that matters is drive, determination, passion, practice and a need to never give up.

That's the thing about skill - some may have more natural ability, but no one begins amazing at anything. You have to learn it and improve, no matter who you are. And anyone can do it.
 
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