BEATMAKER / PRODUCER / Learn The difference.

[BeatbyAS]

I answered a thread and I felt my answer could be a good post for the ones getting started in this music ish. It's Future Producers, not Future Beatmakers ...


the truth is that with the internet, there are no more producers anymore. There are only beatmakers. A producer is like Dr Dre, Rick Rubin, Pharrel, Timbaland, not just to name big names. but what they do is take an artist, singer or rapper, under their wings and build a career with that artist.


They stay in the studio together and share ideas, how the album should sound sonically, they help with laying the vocals down because most of the time they have more knowledge on music than the artist, because they had to learn to produce, an artist just need talent and a PRODUCER ! That is the thing artist forget nowadays, they can not do every thing alone. That's not how you create a full product, song. No one is born a talented producer, talented beatmaker yes, but producing is to learn music from theory to how the sound affects the brain to notes , to how effects affect the sound, etc.


With the internet, you have random dudes all around the world sending beats to artist, hoping they accept to record and release it. Another thread on here, speaks about this problem with the new 50 cent album, where it's just a compilation of songs he recorded in a 5 year period. So no one helped him produce a real album. He just picked his best 20 beats he recorded on from 200 beats or shit like that.


But if you look at Kendrick, even Drake. They have about around 3 in house producers that they work with only, from when they first meet til now. Or if they receive a beat they like, they will listen to it with their producers to see how they can turn it into a finished product/ song. That is why they are still recognized as the top artists right now, because they know the real process of making music, unlike some.


Look at Dr Dre's path. NWA-Snoop dogg, Eminem, 50 cent, The Game, Kendrick lamar. He sells mad beats here and there obviously, but he is a producer for one artist first and foremost.


BIG DIFFERENCE BETWEEN A BEATMAKER AND A PRODUCER, which one do you want to be ...

 

[Yumid]

I just gave up on trying to dictate the difference to people.

"But most people just self produce these days!"

No they dont, you cant self produce. You can self create. A Producer produces you, you cant produce yourself. The Producers you mentioned that also make beats are(i believe) where the line started to become blurry and just got worse from there until we got to where we are today and "everyones a producer".

A REAL record producer is someone like George Martin for the Beatles. Mike Fraser, Mutt lange, etc...

 

[Desire Inspires]

A good beatmaker > a bad producer.

DJ Mustard > 90% of producers.

Stop worrying about a title and do something epic.

 

[Yumid]

A good beatmaker > a bad producer.

DJ Mustard > 90% of producers.

Stop worrying about a title and do something epic.

What are you even talking about.

A good anything is generally better than a bad anything. You missed the whole point of the thread it seems lol.

These "bad" producers you speak aren't a producer anymore than a beatmaker is. You dont just self proclaim yourself a producer and you dont just decide youre going to be a producer. You dont become a real producer until you've spent years at music either through an Artist path, engineer path, etc.. Producing is something you fall into once you know your way around the industry and the studio, not something you decide to do. You cant train yourself to be a producer. You train yourself to understand EVERY aspect of music, then you fall into producing.

Bad producers dont really exist imo. But people that think they can produce do exist.
Its not about the title.

Who are some of these "90% of producers" ?

 

[bandcoach]

sorry, old idea and covered by me in this thread https://www.futureproducers.com/for...urselves-music-producers-468223/#post49751571

some people call me the gangster of love, 'cause I speak of the pompatous of love

be proud of what you are:

• if you synthesise or create your own sounds you are a sound designer or synthesist
• if you make beats you are a beat maker
• if you make whole songs include lyrics you are a songwriter
• if you arrange and orchestrate you are an arranger/orchestrator
• if you do all the above (with or without lyrics) you are a composer
• if you engineer your work (i.e. recording real instruments) you are a sound engineer/recording engineer
• if you mix your recorded work you are a mix engineer
• if you master your recorded/mix work then you are a mastering engineer
• if you manage the creative and financial vision for a project whether it is a single song or an album (including selecting people to do specific jobs from the above) you are a producer
• If you combine any of the above skills then you have multiple labels

 

[Yumid]

• if you manage the creative and financial vision for a project whether it is a single song or an album (including selecting people to do specific jobs from the above) you are a producer

completely agree. But my point was the vast majority of the time in order to get to that Producer 'label' odds are you did it by conquering one but usually more of the other points you mentioned prior to producer.

"The Producer wears many hats"

You cant really manage the creative side of things without a deep background in some of the points you mentioned prior to producer. As I'm sure you know, producers usually do do the arranging, help with lyrics, etc.. a good producer is all around like that.

Takes a pretty good hustler to just start producing an artist successfully without a background in any of it. And I know, they do exist. I just wouldnt say they fall under the category of a conventional producer. And there would certainly be better people for the job. These are the self proclaimed producers I was talking about in a prior post. Sure they may get there by trail and error, but that just means they had what it takes anyway. At the start I still wouldnt consider them a producer if they couldn't wear all the hats a full producer should be able to wear.

"You dont take producer! Producer takes you!" The original quote replaces producer with command, but I felt it works here haha. Had to quote Scandal.

Im aware you know I'm generally fresh to the industry, I'm not trying to act like I know all this from experience because I know you know I dont. But I am around and taught by people everyday in the studio interning and at school who do have the experience and have made a living off this their whole life. Everything I say about the business side of the industry is just what I've learnt from them. All matches what you said, so I dont mean anything bad by that. Just pointing out that I'm not trying to act like i blindly know everything.

On a side note- if anyone has a chance to ever work or intern in a real studio, do it! It opens your eyes to a whole different side of things.

 

[BeatbyAS]

You are right hip hop made the line very blurry. but I stand behind the producers I named.

Meaning if you listen to rappers interview, they will say.. Dr Dre told me to say that line like this. Or this doesn't work, do something like this. Kendrick recently was like - Dr Dre told me that snare not hitting hard enough, frequencies have different effects on people, you like the sound but you don't know why you do. Dr Dre does.

Most of the time when pharell produces a song, he will help write lyrics or even create the hook himself, because he has a vision with the beat he created. For pusha t last album, he explain how pharel came up with the acronym S.N.I.T.C.H. - Meaning Sorry Nigga I'm Trynna Come Home; that inspired pusha t to write about that subject in particular on the pharell beat.

And timbaland, well just listen to when justin timberlake started working with him and when he wasn't. Before he was just a good singer from a boy band. Timbaland made him unique with that balance of hip hop n Rnb, even pharel helped build justin's career. or missy elliot golden days was a lot because of those unique timbaland sounds; or even aliyah. if you look up his instagram, he currently has a new singer under his wings.

they are producers who know their craft and help artist raise their talent to their limits.

Sometimes a producer doesn't even play music, executive producers. They just give their advice. That's why when Kanye made the yeesuz album; he called Rick Rubin, just for advices. Or if you look at the magna carta commercial, you will see rick rubin on the sofa even tho he did not make a beat for the album. his opinion as a producer is enough to make the music better.

Kanye also, he calls up musicians to recreate the symphonies he likes with variations. That's producing.

So I stand behind what I said when I said they are REAL producers also.

 

[BeatbyAS]

lol, that's why music is dying lol

Your right on your first sentence, but the second one makes no sense at all. Maybe Dj Mustard > 90% of beatmakers. Because you think making a beat makes you a producer smh -_- And don't forget Dj Mustard is what's hot in the moment, but will he build a career like timbaland, dr dre, pharell. When his style goes out of style, will he be able to stay current. I don't know since I don't follow him personally.

how can you build a pyramid, if you don't know who are the people placing the bricks, who are the ones making sure they place the brick and who are the ones telling those people to make sure they watch the builders. You would never be able to finish your pyramid without organization.
like i said, you can't do it all.

A producer and a beat maker don't study the same things. So if you don't know what you want to be, how will you know what you have to study.

Like I replied to the guy before you, rick rubin in the magna carta commercial is on the sofa just to give his opinion even though he did not make a beat on the album, or kanye west who called him up to give him advices on Yeezus, because he is a PRODUCER.

 

[Pumpthrust]

In 2014, who gives a fucc?

 

[BeatbyAS]

The only thing I would add is, if you don't even know what a producer does, how would you want to become one. People want to be the new Dr Dre because they think he is a beatmaker. You say you can't not decide to be a producer, wtf lol.. Yes you can, study every aspect of music a producer should know and start producing people with talent, the more you do it, the more others will ask of your producers skills or advice. that is how you will get recognized. But you saying you can't decide, for me that doesn't make sense.

Everyone starts at the bottom.

 

[Pumpthrust]

Why are people still STILL bringing up this silly straw man topic like it ever mattered in the first place?

 

[BeatbyAS]

"In 2014, who gives a fucc?"


people who don't want music to die. Why you think not one platinum album in "2014" ... I'm sorry, people who don't want GOOD music to die.

 

[BeatbyAS]

why are you still replying if you clearly don't care about it ?

 

[Pumpthrust]

"In 2014, who gives a fucc?"


people who don't want music to die. Why you think not one platinum album in "2014" ... I'm sorry, people who don't want GOOD music to die.

That doesn't even make sense. What does one platinum album* have to do with people not wanting good music to die, or your useless straw man topic about producers vs. beatmakers? Music is subjective as hell, meaning that you or no one else cannot definitively quantify what exactly counts as good music or bad.


*because, if you truly knew what you were talking about, you would've known that Taylor Swift's album went platinum, it was all over the damn news.

 

[Pumpthrust]

why are you still replying if you clearly don't care about it ?

Because, straw man topics are dumb, and as a person with a brain, I felt it needed pointing out..

 

[BeatbyAS]

lol what do useless straw man means... that's true music is subjective as hell, but that's mostly for people who don't make music. Meaning I can not like a beat, the sounds, but I will know if the beat is well made by the way of the mixing, panning, levels. That is how you separate the pro's from the amateurs. Obviously I will not love all Dr Dre beats because I am not a dick rider, but you will clearly hear the difference in technical term when you listen to a real dr dre beat and when you listen to a youtube Dr Dre Type Beat. Even if they have the same melody and the same sounds. Dr Dre knowledge will make it totally different from the youtube producer in the way he will mix all of them.

Do you know the song hate it or love it by the game. People at the label said the beat sounded still like the sample and Dr Dre turned it into a hit with his mixing knowledge. That is what I read, I can only tell you what I know from what I've read. The truth, only Cool N Dre [the beatmakers] The Game [ Rapper ] & Dr Dre [Producer] knows it.

For another song on the game album. A beat maker lost his session, Dr Dre reproduced the beat exactly as it was just by listening to the wav version. And that shit had a sample ...

Why do you think we still listen to mozart; you think no one else played music at his time. obviously there were mad other talented people in his time, but in the technical sense, he still has an influence on us after all those years.

Sorry if I don't keep up with the news on a country artist when I am a Hip Hop fan. But I'm glad she did, good for her. Do you want me to clap for her ? I don't watch the news much, but thanks for this information.

Sorry If my knowledge was outdate. Not really sorry, but you get the jist

 

[BeatbyAS]

A person with a brain would not waste time talking to one with no brain. Since I know I have one and since you pointed out that you have one, that is the only reason why I am still replying.

 

[Yumid]

Why are people still STILL bringing up this silly straw man topic like it ever mattered in the first place?

Because too many people think they can be successful in music without knowing the business side of it. "ill just make music, put it out there, and get noticed man! it 2014, I've got youtube."

No, music is a business. Regardless of what all the indie hipsters wanna say about it. And people should at least understand the business/politics side of it whether they care or not.

Pretty ironic how on a website called future producers you cant start a discussion about the politics and history of a record producer.

"In 2014, who gives a fucc?"


people who don't want music to die. Why you think not one platinum album in "2014" ... I'm sorry, people who don't want GOOD music to die.

Taylor swift just hit platinum haha. only one.

 

[Wallengard]

When did music become a business.. Then only time it's a business is when mindless junk is being spread like napalm on a field of zombies listening to anything that has the slightest hint of a "catchy" sound.

Music is a way of living, another way for the human mind to get in tune with the universe. No serious musicians would give a flying **** whether he's going to make millions or not. Only the effect on the individual is what matters, and that's what I think music is and should be all about. A way for someone to express their thoughts in a different way and escape commercial living and for another to accept these and go on a self exploratory journey

I strongly disagree with the statement of music being a business. It's only a business when you make it so, but my reasons for feeling this way is way beyond the aim of this thread and frankly there is too much ignorance going on on this planet to even have a snowballs chance in hell to get anywhere with it.

 

[Yumid]

When did music become a business.. Then only time it's a business is when mindless junk is being spread like napalm on a field of zombies listening to anything that has the slightest hint of a "catchy" sound.

Music is a way of living, another way for the human mind to get in tune with the universe. No serious musicians would give a flying **** whether he's going to make millions or not. Only the effect on the individual is what matters, and that's what I think music is and should be all about. A way for someone to express their thoughts in a different way and escape commercial living and for another to accept these and go on a self exploratory journey

I strongly disagree with the statement of music being a business. It's only a business when you make it so, but my reasons for feeling this way is way beyond the aim of this thread and frankly there is too much ignorance going on on this planet to even have a snowballs chance in hell to get anywhere with it.

You and me have different goals then. I dont wanna sit in my bedroom and make music my whole life that no ones gonna hear. If you wanna spread this feeling of music that youre talking about you need to climb the ladder in order to reach those people. You aren't just gonna get there by not treating your music like a business.

You can look at it however you want, but the simple fact is if you want your music to reach the masses and not just be hidden forever you HAVE to treat it like a business to get to that point. Once you do you will have more freedom to do what you want. But in order to get to that point to have the freedom to do what you want you have to sacrifice artistic integrity and treat music like a business. Thats a cold hard fact.

No one just 'gets discovered' thats all for show. These 'overnight' successes have been groomed by labels for years then they're released as an 'overnight' success.

Don't sit here and try and tell me you wouldnt want to make money with music because I'm not buying it. And thats not to say I'm in it for money because thats stupid. Im in it because I love music. But I also understand that if I want to get to where I want to go for my music to actually be appreciated and help people, it doesnt just happen because you stuck to your guns and fought the reality that the music industry actually is.

Im not thinking small here. All the power to you if you are, but I'm not because I dont want to reach no one my whole life.

Serious musicians want their music to be heard and a serious musician will do what they need to do to get it there. It has nothing to do with the money. The money comes as a result of finally reaching the audience that everyone wants to reach but doesnt want to make the sacrifices to do it.


My single and only goal is to have my music reach as many people as possible and you dont get that by simply making the music you love and boycotting the proven method to reaching your audience. Thats just the reality of it. Its a long term plan that has to be thought out, and thats where the business side comes into it. I dont necessarily mean you have to join a major label blah blah blah.. I mean you need to sit down and plan out your music plan just like you would plan out a business plan. You'll waste your whole life waiting for people to find your music themselves. You need to take the reigns and do it yourself. Understanding the business side of music is crucial to do that, but that doesnt mean that you need to embrace it.