Numark as a nu-force? (hyuk hyuk)

dJ sHoE

dJ sHoE

Most Critically Acclaimed
I think Numark is starting to make its place in the world of DJ equipment, much more than it had before. With the introduction of new technology in its new products, and the fact that they actually perform solidly shows that they have changed greatly from even as close as two years ago.

Look at the changes they have made, not only in design but in function.

Mixers- They have made quite a gain in this field. Their new PPD01 exemplifies their advancement. Following in the steps of the CDJ-1000 and the Finals Scratch, the PPD01 further enhances the level of technology shown in DJing today. Today's manufacturers acknowledge that the world of DJing is changing and the implentation of new technology in their products shows this. Examples- Vestax Samurai Series, Stanton's SA series, Rane's Empath and Numarks PPD. However, not only has Numark made advances in mixer technology, but turntables as well.

Turntables- So what are the new turntables that have come out? Let's see:

Vestax- Did anyone actually buy their "tilting" turntable, I heard no news about it :D. It seems to be as the last turntable widely used which they have made is the PDX-2002, that upgrade better come soon if they still want to keep some of their market.

Gemini- The Gemini turntable "revolution" seemed to me as weak at best. The PDT-6000? Has anyone actually tried that? From what I've seen it hasn't gotten that good of reviews. Gemini seems to be lacking in coming out with the new stuff. Does the new FX series have much innovation? Doesn't seem like it. The PDT hasn't been labeled as even competition to the Techs. Tsk tsk Gemini, better get your rear in gear. (no pun intended)

Technics- While you like it or not, I think the 1200's are in dire need for innovation. With all these new turntables out, sooner or later something's gonna replace it as the "industry standard." They need to create more equipment without affecting their reputation of sturdiness. For those of you interested, I read Dj Focus's post on asisphonics stating his plans to create his own "Technics upgrade package." which he hoped to include blue LEDs( seems like a must these days), straight arm, greater pitch control range, reverse button, and some other things. Not sure if he was actually serious about it though.



So this leaves us with Numark. In previous years the competition with the 1200's has been Vestax. Gemini and Numark? Psh.. they were in the minor leagues. Now things have changed, Gemini seems to be in the T-ball league(except the UMX those are kickin) and Numark has stepped things up. With the TTX, its being labeled as Technics closest competition by many surpassing even the venerable Vestax tables maybe even the 1200s themselves. With its switchable tonearms (patented, I might add) Its enormous pitch range and all these new gizmos and the SUPER COOL blue LCD screen and outrageous torque, I think Numark is really going somewhere with it. In fact, I'm looking to pick up a pair myself. As of its durability, I don't really give a damn. The Technic's 1200's may have lasted since 1970's, but look at it now. Comparing DJ equipment advances from pre-90's to now would be like comparing a miniture poodle to a great dane/st bernard hybrid. The introduction of computers as mainstream has allowed for a huge advance in DJ technology. So, as far as I'm concerned, with the rate at which everything is going, if the TTX's do give out in about 5-10 years or so the technology will probably have made it obsolete, so it'd be a perfect gauge for upgrading.

Damn this was supposed to be about how Numark has been improving but it sounds more like my view on DJ technology.



holy jizznibble this is long... i am a loser
 
blue led's are nice but not needed.

IMO the one thing technics needs is a wider range pitch control- yesterday. to at least +/- 16%
 
As long as Technics is the most accurate, that's what I'm going with. Period. No crazy swings in the wow-and-flutter, thank you.
 
idioteQnology said:
blue led's are nice but not needed.

IMO the one thing technics needs is a wider range pitch control- yesterday. to at least +/- 16%
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Both of those things are available on the Mk5, which will show itself eventually.

Alright, time for my rant... Every toy that you have described is just that. The best thing that either the Vestax or the Numark have to offer is the straight short tone arm, which makes it much harder to skip while scratching. However, this comes at the expense of a noticeable loss in sound quality, which quite frankly is not worth it (not to mention record burn). Getting too cozy with straight arms (especially learning on them), has the potential to make you a little sloppier when scratching, and it will show when you jump on different decks. When set up with correctly and taken care of, a 1200 and a Shure 44 series will almost never skip on you unless you have a bad record or you just use too much force. I promise you that if you spin long enough, you will become a sound freak and you will get overly protective of your records, making straight-arm turntables much less attractive. Wow and flutter will also come to annoy you when you train your ear long enough.

Now for the toys: Digital outputs, variable WIDE range pitches, key correction, start and break controls, reverse switches, torque, and the like. I will address them one by one.

Digital outputs: Currently they are just not up to par. Try them out and give them a good long listen and you will see what I mean. For what most of us do, the analog signal is simply livelier. Try it out and hear for yourself…

Wide pitch ranges: Fun to mess with, but not necessary for mixing. If you have to go out of the +/-8 to 10% range, you need to rethink your mixing or your record selections. In my opinion, 98% of the time, staying in liberal genres, you should not need a wider pitch. Connected to this is key control. You can try it, and you may like it, but I do not think that key control is where it needs to be yet, and for what many of us do, there is really not much of a point.

Start and break controls: You can adjust break on the 1200, just open it up and have field day with an online tutorial. Once you get comfortable with records, you should be able to speed up or slow down start and break by using your hands on the record. It is not hard, and you can use the target lights (a useful exclusive of the 1200 in this comparison) to guide you. The reverse switch is the same story. You can do it with your hands using the target lights. There is also a 1200 mod that will allow you to have a reverse switch.

Last but not least, torque: Unless you are way too heavily handed to mix or scratch, torque should not be an issue. Most of the time, regardless of genre, the platters are always spinning. If this is the case, there is really no noticeable difference between tables as long as you are not using rubber slipmats… Start time is slower for the 1200, but the difference between the three will change your life.

Okay, after getting that out of my system, I must admit that I absolutely do not care which turntables all of you choose unless I will someday be a guest of your decks (in that case, I think you can tell which I prefer…). 1200 ownership is not a universalistic religion, but many those who own them praise them to try to help people starting out. It really does make a difference. Good luck with your decision, and find friends who own them (do not try out in stores if you can avoid it), and really rock out on the different tables and see what you think.
-Peasant Nikon
 
Like I posted in another thread in one of the other forums, all the 1200s need is a second pitchfader that goes left-right instead of top-bottom and is switchable between 2%, 4% and 8%. If not switchable then just 2%.

That's it. Gimmicks look neat but in the end you never use them and they are just gimmicks.
 
if you look at the biggest guys in the biz and see what type of gear they favour, considering they get to try out every new thing on the market, it's still surprising to see how basic they stay.

Francois K, Louie Vega, Digweed and those guys, they rely on simple Urei mixers that have no EQ, no VUs, no FX, no nothings, just good clean warm sound quality. Turntables? It's all Technics 1200s. They might add samplers and an EFX500 or something, but as accessories, not as their main thing.

I think all these nifty functions might seem like fun, but in reality - unless you're a wicked turntablist who wants to create the most noise of all - you're about as likely to use those thingies as you are to be hit on the forehead by a meteorite in a bunker 5 miles below the ground.

my $0.02
 
i dont care what digweed and big shots use.

the simple fact is to spin things like breaks and d n b that are bass heavy having eq is a must if you want to mix anywhere but in the breakdowns and intros.

and there have been quite a few mixes where the +/- 8% pitch wasnt enough to do it sounding right/ or do it at all- and I still think technics should at least give us the option to have more pitch control. if you dont need it dont use it-

for me on a mixer i need clean sound- EQs- and levels for each channel cause i like bringing each mix in at a nice volume- especially when making recordings that someone is going to listen to in a quiet environment and critique.

i am not asking for my mixer and tables to pop popcorn. but i think there are sometimes when a lil bit of features can let you create and explore new sounds and combinations of sounds that otherwise wouldnt be.

effects and other features are nice but not necessary to me- though i am planning on adding an offboard effects processor

. if i had effects on my mixer i'd use it though- it can be a useful tool for seguays *(sp) between two totally different styles of music as well as simple tweaking out .


again to just be a mixing dj you dont NEED these things- but in a kitchen you dont really NEED anything but one frying pan and one stovetop burner- but sometimes its nice to have some options
 
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tbh i think the 1200 is fine. i dont need anything more. consider the massive pitch shift you get outside 8% it's almost silly.

i'm one of those minimalist dj's. i rarely use eq, and have no problems with the 1200. simple = goodness.
 
for me a bit more pitch would enable me to make more mixes like a trip hop track into a slower breaks track or an oldskool breaks track into a nu skool breaks track or some jungle tracks into old skool breaks track or some of the slower funky breaks tracks into nu skool breaks track or slower electro into faster nu skool. keeping a set interesting to me sometimes means crossing genres and pitch flexibility is key.

sometimes to get two records to go together means having to slow one down too much where it doesnt sound good any more because the second track at +8 is still not fast enough to mix into it.
 
a bit more pitch would enable me to make more mixes like a trip hop track into a slower breaks track or an oldskool breaks track into a nu skool breaks track or some jungle tracks into old skool breaks track or some of the slower funky breaks tracks into nu skool breaks track or slower electro into faster nu skool. keeping a set interesting to me sometimes means crossing genres and pitch flexibility is key.
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but doesn't helium vocals annoy you? they certainly annoy me.

but sure, you have some valid points there and I guess we all have different preferences. for me, simplicity and sound quality are the most important things, FX and stuff doesn't really interest me (save for some light filtering if I have access to a good unit).
 
mattu said:


but doesn't helium vocals annoy you? they certainly annoy me.
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ahh don't forget about the numark's new "key lock" feature which allows someone to change the tempo without changing any pitch, from anywhere on the pitch fader.
 
Ok...on this issue.

I believe that the added features are not a NEEDED feature, they just allow you to expand your creativity, which is what turntablism is about, right? Doing what you love and doing it your own way, whether that be using helium vocals or not.
Hey, if it sounds good to you and thats how you express yourself, you probably wont land a gig, but your doing what you like to do.

My 2 pennies.
 
dJ sHoE said:



ahh don't forget about the numark's new "key lock" feature which allows someone to change the tempo without changing any pitch, from anywhere on the pitch fader.
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yeah, and like on CD decks, it sounds a§§ awful when you pitch over 6% either way with the pitch lock function. it's a brilliant idea, but unfortunately it's not functioning very well just yet.
 
When using my old CDN-88, I was surprised at how little I actually did use the effects. Though I do use EQ to gently blend tracks together, I mainly let the tracks do their own magic.

I would really like a badass sampler to layer tracks more and more, but the Cycloops just kinda' fell short of what I was looking for. Its flaws that I had thought about before using it really stuck out and made using it counter-intuitive (mainly needing to keep a beat going through it to keep it beatmatched). Maybe I'll look towards an Electrix Repeater...but even with loops and whatnot, I'd still let the music do its thing, instead of using FX and all that crazy ish.

Another thing...I kept both sides of the CD player locked in at +/- 6% pitch. Rarely needed anything over that. So, I'm guessing that the extra two percent both ways on the Tech's is going to serve me well and will be all I need.

But I digress...
:cheers:
 
currantly i own a pair of vestax pdx-d3 TTs(the first generation black ones). they have reverse a pitch fader adujustable to +/- 3%, 6%, and 12%, a pitch bend joystick which is can adjust the pitch +/- 1% 3% or 6% or +/- 50%(if i'm feeling tricky)...

that being said i am planning on selling these decks because out of all of these features the only thing i find myself using is the pitch bend joystick, instead of touching the platter.

i hardly ever mess with the pitch fader adjustment when i turn them on its set at 12% so i just leave it there. kinda cool yes but ultimently limiting, by that i mean that i've learned(the hard way) that if you put a set together that at one point pitches up or down 9% you're screwed when you play out. go anywhere and play and they have technics well suddenly that 9% isn't avaible...

reverse while cool i use so rarely that it might as well not be there. anyway i've played backwards on techs spinning the platter by the spindle so it not like i couldn't do it if i want to..

so after having all of these features at my fingertips for a year i find my self looking at wow and flutter.. how well does the TT hold its pitch is my main need in a TT. with that as my criteria only technics really fit the bill..

don't get me wrong i did enjoy playing with all of the toys on my PDX-D3 TTs. but now i'm over them and the wow and flutter is really annoying me..
 
well for me the fast pitch wouldnt really give me helium vocals since most tracks i play arent vocal at all- and if I were to spin a vocal track I wouldnt play it too fast- if it wouldnt fit at a right speed then a judgement call would be made to avoid that mix at that speed :)

i hear they guy above; about if you get used to the pitch at home then go out to a club and it was the old skool 8%- that is why I want technics to implement a higher pitch since they are the standard everywhere still :) and when a club upgraded their tables they'd probably stick to the tried and true super sturdy and resilient technics brand.
 
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idioteQnology said:
again to just be a mixing dj you dont NEED these things- but in a kitchen you dont really NEED anything but one frying pan and one stovetop burner- but sometimes its nice to have some options
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Options are good but so far you have to sacrifice reliability and quality to get them.

infradead said:
don't get me wrong i did enjoy playing with all of the toys on my PDX-D3 TTs. but now i'm over them and the wow and flutter is really annoying me..
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Exactly. That's why we always recommend Technics.
 
"The TTX1 measure (wow and flutter) may seem high because the motor is empowered with a much greater variance. It is capable of a 50% pitch range in 33,45, and even 78 rpm. The motor control servo continuously monitors over 800 points of optical resolution PER REVOLUTION (versus less than 300 on the industry stantard) so rest assured your long mixes will be accurate."

- TTX1.com


This is Numarks argument for the high wow and flutter on the TTX's. Unfortunately it goes over my head. Someone explain please?
 
dJ sHoE said:
"The TTX1 measure (wow and flutter) may seem high because the motor is empowered with a much greater variance. It is capable of a 50% pitch range in 33,45, and even 78 rpm. The motor control servo continuously monitors over 800 points of optical resolution PER REVOLUTION (versus less than 300 on the industry stantard) so rest assured your long mixes will be accurate."

- TTX1.com


This is Numarks argument for the high wow and flutter on the TTX's. Unfortunately it goes over my head. Someone explain please?
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OK, so even though it samples 800 times a second, it still can't stabilize the wow-and-flutter measurement. The marketing ish isn't sticking on that one, LOL!

And, oh yeah, forget about key-lock. Sounds like a good idea, but it actually sounds horrible on current implementations. The interpolation is so rough, you end up chopping off the bass peaks. Not sure about the touted high-end implementations that Denon uses, but unless they are using a large buffer and plenty of computational horsepower under the hood, don't expect much at all.
 
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