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Thread: Having songs instead of beats (rant & thoughts)

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    kyng's Avatar
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    Having songs instead of beats (rant & thoughts)

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    It has been preached 13.5 million times on this forum but has anyone taken heed to it?

    I can bet that everyone hear (including myself) are just trying to work on beats or an instrument to make your beats come out better, but what about the songs?

    Does anybody in here constantly work with songwriters to come up with hooks for your beats?

    Do you do it yourself?

    What is your process? How do you come up concepts and ideas?

    I notice that a lot of producers or someone from a producers team are getting songwriting credits more and more nowadays. . .even more so with Trap music.

    Just some thoughts. . .
    Smokey

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    901_Rice_Street is offline Rice AKA Clyde Drexler
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    Just finished music for a songwriter yesterday. It's hectic because it becomes more of being a perfectionist and hoping you don't mess with their expectation......and hope it's good enough to atleast compete with everything else when the songwriter is only thinking "wow...this sounds great". You still worry as you listen to it over and over.....like damn I could've did this and that and whatever.

    OOPS.....LONG RANT. lmao!

    I create hooks form dudes freestyles when they check the mic and vocalist practicing and shit like that. I name them "hook material". I would tell them later I'm using them than to start a session. They them want to say shit "they feel" would be a hit.......and want more than what they deserve.........start making your personal work with their stuff important to them. DAMN ALL THAT!!!! Tell that dude......"hey man....remember those freestyles......I want to know if I can make some hooks out of them." He ain't going to give a damn because hell..."it meant nothing to him like the song he recorded". Or he might be a selfish type dude like "what...hooks for me?" But most of them don't care...they just happy you work with them anyway (from my experience). Got all kinds of adlibs and shit. Female vocals going ooh for each note. Got freaks moaning on the mic and shit. lmao! All kinds of convos caught with the mic on.

    But I still use royalty free shit though. lol!
    Last edited by 901_Rice_Street; 01-20-2013 at 06:29 PM.

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    Fyu-chur's Avatar
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    Id say its half and half for me because I run a very popular recording studio in my city so im always working with artist everyday.

    When im not doing that im writing/producing songs/hooks for artist that i believe in or collabing with songwriters (to shop songs) or just working on an instrumental, sound design etc.. just constantly try to learn something new.

    As far as the songwriting goes it depends... personally im starting to see some of my best ideas comes from working in reverse... basicly creating the topline/hook first and THEN create something to fit that. So im starting to focus on that workflow and maybe thats something you can tryout? It maybe a source of inspiration for us producers since we always tend to create the music first before the lyrics are laid.
    likes this.

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    MrWonderful is offline Insane FP Patriot
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    kyng's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 901_Rice_Street View Post
    Just finished music for a songwriter yesterday. It's hectic because it becomes more of being a perfectionist and hoping you don't mess with their expectation......and hope it's good enough to atleast compete with everything else when the songwriter is only thinking "wow...this sounds great". You still worry as you listen to it over and over.....like damn I could've did this and that and whatever.

    OOPS.....LONG RANT. lmao!

    I create hooks form dudes freestyles when they check the mic and vocalist practicing and shit like that. I name them "hook material". I would tell them later I'm using them than to start a session. They them want to say shit "they feel" would be a hit.......and want more than what they deserve.........start making your personal work with their stuff important to them. DAMN ALL THAT!!!! Tell that dude......"hey man....remember those freestyles......I want to know if I can make some hooks out of them." He ain't going to give a damn because hell..."it meant nothing to him like the song he recorded". Or he might be a selfish type dude like "what...hooks for me?" But most of them don't care...they just happy you work with them anyway (from my experience). Got all kinds of adlibs and shit. Female vocals going ooh for each note. Got freaks moaning on the mic and shit. lmao! All kinds of convos caught with the mic on.

    But I still use royalty free shit though. lol!
    You create hooks like the runners type, ("Everyday I'm Hustlin/Money On My Mind") kinda tracks? Or are do they usually turn out like normal hooks?

    I had an idea to start downloading T-Pain/Lil Wayne/Drake a capella(s) verses and using melodyne to make it fit my song. I never did it though.

    ---------- Post added at 03:01 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:56 AM ----------

    Quote Originally Posted by Fyu-chur View Post
    Id say its half and half for me because I run a very popular recording studio in my city so im always working with artist everyday.

    When im not doing that im writing/producing songs/hooks for artist that i believe in or collabing with songwriters (to shop songs) or just working on an instrumental, sound design etc.. just constantly try to learn something new.

    As far as the songwriting goes it depends... personally im starting to see some of my best ideas comes from working in reverse... basicly creating the topline/hook first and THEN create something to fit that. So im starting to focus on that workflow and maybe thats something you can tryout? It maybe a source of inspiration for us producers since we always tend to create the music first before the lyrics are laid.
    I'm a really quiet person so it's hard for me to convey my feelings in written form sometimes lol. I don't know why. The crazy thing is, i can come up with a melody and the flow but when it comes to putting words to it I get lost.

    I've given beats to dudes and their flow will be f*cked up and I hop on the mic and show them how to flow over the beat (hook and verse), and they always ask do I rap.

    I'm going to to try that reverse osmosis lol. Maybe that will work better.
    Smokey

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    The Light's Avatar
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    This is a good idea Kyng. Not just their vocals, but anyone's acapellas, news stories, movies, etc.

    ---------- Post added at 02:05 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:02 AM ----------

    Basically, anyone's vocals, no matter the genre can be manipulated into a hook that fits your song. Also, try using famous speeches and quotes.

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    61Key's Avatar
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    I love when an artists "hears" what I lay down, i make beats with a somewhat of a formula, hooks and maybee some shorter verses, i love when they can pick up on that and shoot me the pella of what they recorded.
    So yea, having songs is great, but dont forget that we are just making beats. some people will never "get it" but a good artist will pick on on the formula. one time my homies told me "Here is the song, it was perfect, you dont even Know what you did with that off beat second verse"

    Knowing how to mix it and all that is producing but sometimes they just "get it"

    I hope im making sense, just my 2 pennies.

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    901_Rice_Street's Avatar
    901_Rice_Street is offline Rice AKA Clyde Drexler
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyng View Post
    You create hooks like the runners type, ("Everyday I'm Hustlin/Money On My Mind") kinda tracks? Or are do they usually turn out like normal hooks?
    Both. I'll even scratch different verses. Hell....I'll rather make a hook for some of these rapper I delt with. They always want to sing to my chorus strings and get all butt hurt when I say I ain't feeling it. "Man...I saying some real shit though"......but you sound laughable...shit. If I aready have hooks...I ain't got to argue about the shit.....they lazy ass like "damn...well we gone knock this out quick."

    This didn't have a hook in the acapella....so I made a hook and a bridge. Just having fun with the FP fam. Took me no time.
    https://soundcloud.com/riceoroni/nipsey-hussle-10-toes-remix

    Oh...I used some royalty free white girl vocals.....sounds like a violin...it ain't.

    I try to stay away from transposing and chopping vocals though. It's just quick and easy. It can be a habit. So I do a lot of other shit.
    Last edited by 901_Rice_Street; 01-21-2013 at 12:26 AM.

  9. #9
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    Most of the time when I'm making a beat it's already for a specific artist I work with, but when I do make a beat without someone to use it, I always tend to just jam it for a while and write a hook and possibly a whole song according to the type of beat. If it's something that seems like it needs singing the whole time, then I write a full song, but if it's something I imagine rapping on, then I write a hook for it and maybe a bridge.

    I also have a good friend that I record/produce and sometimes he'll come over and help me with the songwriting, but besides that it's pretty much just me writing. It'd be cool to find some people to collab with on songwriting, though.

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