From Reason 4 to Live 8

[L. A. Stone]

come on comparing softsynth to a real life hardware synth is not the same as comparing a multisampled guitar patch to a real guitar. it's not the same thing.

Definitely. You're missing the point. The point is, there's no point in making any of the above comparisons. Some people are arguing for the right to use crap quality virtual guitars by saying, well a real guitar sounds better! OK, that's just completely pointless. How is that an argument against having the highest quality virtual guitar and and sampling engine. There's just no sense to this argument.

btw i think reason crushes all hardware workstations.

Yeah well. LOL It's neither here or there.

 

[Focused]

this depends on what the guitar part is...

This is a critical point, and I agree with this. For me personally when I think of guitar, Im thinking Soulful Trills and all of the sick articulations that only a skilled guitarist can pull off. I'm not looking to simply record a rhythm guitar part with strumming.

 

[neverenoughfunk]

This is a critical point, and I agree with this. For me personally when I think of guitar, Im thinking Soulful Trills and all of the sick articulations that only a skilled guitarist can pull off. I'm not looking to simply record a rhythm guitar part with strumming.

you cant program the "funky" on a guitar app...

agreed...

cant get that human feel with a rhythm guitar part...

two words...

Nile Rogers...

 

[L. A. Stone]

Yeah LA Stone's Contention doesnt quite hold up when we start talking about guitars. Technology is able to well model the characteristics of analog and digital synths...we dont have to sit and discuss that at all. The problem with sampled guitars is not just due to the sampler....it has to do with the midi input method as well.

No, it's just that you're missing the point. What I'm hearing from some of you is this. We should not want a high quality guitar patch and sampler, because a real guitar is better. There's absolutely no logic there and that's the point I'm making. The virtual guitars today (the serious ones) are better than those from 5 years ago, and there are some that absolutely are able to fool the listener into thinking that it's a real guitar and player. I've mentioned this 8 times now, but here goes again. Electri6ty. Have a listen. 5 years from now, there will be even better. But your argument is just saying, don't bother because the original is better. Will that always be the case? Well, if it were up to you, it certainly would be. Thankfully, there are people who don't feel the same as you. We now have virtual guitar solutions that can fool a listener and be quality enough to not detract from the overall music. But here some of you are, arguing against this. Which is why this debate is still going on.

My feeling is that using a keyboard will never properly yield a fully convincing guitar line.

It already is. But if it wasn't, why couldn't this be a goal so that one day, it would? See the error of your logic.

Guitar Trills for example will continue to be an issue when using the keyboard as an input device.

Again, you're simply wrong. Already existing guitar solutions are pulling this off brilliantly. But of course, you don't know this because you're using an ASR-10, or Reason and just haven't been paying attention to the technology that is available today.

 

[neverenoughfunk]

i would just like to add that there is a differents between a guitar part in a rock/metal song -vs- RnB...

yes, i do believe you can program let say electrici6ty to play jimmy page's guitar solo in "stairway to heaven" but i do not think you can program it to play the intro to "long train running" doobie brothers/skunk baxter on the guitar...

i cant speak for Focused but i think that is what he is saying...

 

[L. A. Stone]

you cant program the "funky" on a guitar app...

agreed...

cant get that human feel with a rhythm guitar part...

two words...

Nile Rogers...

The thing is, everybody knows that a real person and a real guitar is still superior to existing guitar solutions. The point, is that this is no point at all. I still want the best possible virtual guitar instrument and sampler that I can have, if I'm going to be making virtual music. LOL I mean, where exactly is the argument against this coming from? Why are people saying, "No, if you want a guitar then learn to play, or hire a guitarist"??? 15 years ago, the first virtual synths did not hold a candle to a real hardware synth. Would these same guys have said, "If you want a synth part, then get a real hardware synth"? In 15 years from now, we may have virtual guitar solutions that absolutely 100% mimic a real person playing a real guitar. What will they say then? But as of now, the highest quality existing solutions are very impressive and can certainly fool the listener in certain playing styles, so what is the argument against this?

 

[neverenoughfunk]

The thing is, everybody knows that a real person and a real guitar is still superior to existing guitar solutions. The point, is that this is no point at all. I still want the best possible virtual guitar instrument and sampler that I can have, if I'm going to be making virtual music. LOL I mean, where exactly is the argument against this coming from? Why are people saying, "No, if you want a guitar then learn to play, or hire a guitarist"??? 15 years ago, the first virtual synths did not hold a candle to a real hardware synth. Would these same guys have said, "If you want a synth part, then get a real hardware synth"? In 15 years from now, we may have virtual guitar solutions that absolutely 100% mimic a real person playing a real guitar. What will they say then? But as of now, the highest quality existing solutions are very impressive and can certainly fool the listener in certain playing styles, so what is the argument against this?

i agree 110%...

electric6ty is very impressive. i have own it for a 2 to 3 months and have not scratched the surface of it. orange tree has a virtual guitar too that is very impressive called (i think) strawberry...

if you understand guitars and how they function you can get some "very" impressive results with it. personally, i use the direct samples with guitar rig pro and there are times i cant believe what is coming from the speakers...

i think someone brought this up in this threads. there are individuals that are at different stages of their musical journey. some want the drums to hit hard, some want killer synth lead and others that are looking for realism...

 

[Focused]

Again, you're simply wrong. Already existing guitar solutions are pulling this off brilliantly. But of course, you don't know this because you're using an ASR-10, or Reason and just haven't been paying attention to the technology that is available today.

Let me clear something up for you bro.....I work as sound designer for the company that builds the engine of Electri6ity...yes the people that created Kontakt. I dont use an ASR-10, nor have I implied that anyone else should. I have never once said that we should not push technology forward, my daily grind here is about pushing technology forward.


I simply stated in regards to sampling and the NNXT that the intention and use case for its sampler is different than that of Kontakt. Propellerheads sent a clear message about how they intended you to use the new sampling features in Reason. My thoughts on the guitar emulation are clear as well, we have already discussed that at this moment certain guitar lines are just not convincing using the current crop of guitar emulation software. Those of us that say we would rather use a real guitar may just be aiming for articulations that are not convincing enough using Electri6ity. You are out of pocket going anywhere beyond that with my words. Every sampler should not work the same way because there are different use cases and needs. You would be surprised at how many professionals are still using INTAKT as their sampler of choice still, even with all of the features that are in Kontakt. Some people just prefer the simplicity in other samplers. It is simply a matter of individual needs and overall musical goals. If you dont like the capabilities of NNXT, use Kontakt...this is very simple. I don't speak on behalf of the company I work for when I'm here, I speak from my own opinion.

 

[Xabiton]

If you're using Reason to play synths, why not reach for the real thing?

sometimes I do Reason is not my only tool and Reason does pull of synths very very well. I mainly use Reason like virtual mpc. I own a mpc also but I prefer Reason.

 

[[F_or_DEAF]]

there are individuals that are at different stages of their musical journey. some want the drums to hit hard, some want killer synth lead and others that are looking for realism...

very true...

---------- Post added at 08:15 PM ---------- Previous post was at 07:56 PM ----------

Every sampler should not work the same way because there are different use cases and needs

very true...
:smokinFP:

 

[L. A. Stone]

Well...moving along. I think I've said everything I needed to say. LOL

 

[v0x]

Okay, by now everybody knows my BEEF with propellerdickheadz.
I finally feel I'm making the music I hear in my head (sounds funny).
It's so ironic, I've said in the past (not anymore) Reason's stock sounds cater more to other genres than Hip Hop. With Live I'm now catering to other genres (alternative, movie score, and pop) and I'm loving it.

All I've ever wanted was ONE app to cook in. I don't rewire, never have and I don't like Recycle (never bought it either)

Don't get me started on Live's bulit in FX. It's like having an engineer by your side making your music even better.
Anybody with Live knows what I'm talking about. Everything is outlined for you. You want a certain sound on your snare...bam it's there. Need a 70's effect on your strings...bam it's there too. It goes on and on.

I feel more creative and less technical these days.

Cash Daily

Good to know man.

 

[Cash_Daily]

Thanks v0x. I should've titled this thread Guitar sounds. haha