MPC 2000xl vs MV 8800

Kojak said:
Like what exactly? It's got multieffects, chorus, and reverb, just like the MPC.
The effect engines are different. As said you can do better effects on the MVs. I did not say it has 'different' effects, in fact, there are some (multi effects) the MPC definitely does not have.. but more so you've got more advanced editing options for the effects as well.

And then I haven't even started talking about how you can use all your favorite plug-ins with the MV.. and also use a bunch of external devices with great easy, like for example the Sonic Cell.

Well it is, it allows it to connect to a larger and higher definition screen.
Yeah, so you'll get 640x480 resolution output which sucks on any monitor bigger than 17". Sure you'll get the information on a bigger screen... but it's not like you can't use the device without it.

I really do not think that it's such a big thing worth having the machine for... There are many many different features that do make it the MV a must-have for me.

So then what can it do that the MPC can't.

Are you sure we're still talking about the same machines here? Damn.
Basically you can simply do a lot more with it on the MV, I already said this. It's a waste of time arguing about this.

If you're curious and have far more time than I have, just search on mvnation, in the manual of the MV8800 and on youtube. The information is all out there.

You clearly have no idea the difference between either machine as you just named features on both and stated that only one machine had them.
You seriously need to check your eyes. Apart from that, I only commented directly on what was said about the MV.
 
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The effect engines are different. As said you can do better effects on the MVs. I did not say it has 'different' effects, in fact, there are some (multi effects) the MPC definitely does not have.. but more so you've got more advanced editing options for the effects as well.

Name what is better about them. I know you can't, you've just made things up, I suppose somehow to justify a purchase you've made to yourself. I'm not going to say the MV is anything less than a powerhouse, it is, but I'm not going to let you just throw around a bunch of made up stuff in order to spread misconceptions. It in no way "blows the MPC out of the water", every single feature you named is on the MPC just the same as it is on the MV.

Basically you can simply do a lot more with it on the MV, I already said this. It's a waste of time arguing about this.

You said things that were completely untrue, like that the MPC cannot burn a song right out to CD, or that the sequencer is "more advanced", or that the MPC can't directly record audio tracks or do timestretching.
 
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renegadebliss said:
I beg to differ.

THe MPC 4000 specs (if specs are what we are talking about) BLOW the MV 8000 or MV 8800 out of the water. ...


And Don't forget the Q-Link sequence, it's like haveing a built in Step Sequencer for Sound Sculpting.

The MV has the ability to record all knob and slider operations and to record all mixing actions for automated playback.

What about more then 40G harddrive with the MV

The MV supports any IDE drive with 127GB being the usable capacity.

Where's the MV's 3 Envelopes, 2 LFO's, 3 Filters (with a HUGE variation within those 3 Filters), 64 point modulation matrix PER VOICE....24bit/96khz

Useful only if you are trying to emulate a synth or into serious sound design. For sample based music it's really useless

along with the PPQ of 960

The MV records at max res of 480 PPQN however it edit resolution is indeed 960PPQN. Very few if any trip up a 300 PPQN sequencer let alone 480 or 960. Most beatmakers rarely venture beyond 96.


Also, how do you hook up a DVD to the MV... nope not an option.

Not true. The MV can use a standard laptop DVD(read only) and still record on CD media.

2 Midi In's 4 Midi Out's and a 4 FX

I had the 4000 and found this to be useless for the most part. If you're trying build around the 400 as a hub-maybe. Nobody has yet to post a beat or track yet that uses up 16 channels, let alone 64.
The MV has two MIDI outs and 32 channels is more than enough.

As far as the FX- the 4000 has 4 FX blocks but the engine itself is ho-hum. The MV has much better FX as FX has never been Akai's strong suite.

24bit/96khz...
The cost of this operation mode is that the 4000's power is cut in half while using it in 24/96 mode. The MV 16/20/16 path works out pretty good.

You can't even hook up an external harddrive to the MV..

...but you can transfer via USB

The MV surpasses the 4000 in the following areas:

CD Burning and backup
Direct to HD Recording
Mixing
COSM FX engine
Mastering
Linear Audio Track recording
Realtime Pattern Playback from Pads
Audio Phrases - 16 banks
Patch Library
Vocoder-10 band and sounds damn good.
3 Band Parametric EQ on every instrument and Audio Track.
Clipboard function
Nondestrective editing and chopping
Nonredundant sample usage.
Realtime Timestretching
Bass synth in the FX engine
Sample Import and Format options
Chopping of samples
VGA and Mouse use if you want
MV-8800 has a non-fatiguing color screen
Pencil Tool
Independant Chorus and Delay engines
Slider assign and automation
Swing/Shuffle flexibility and depth- w/templates
Choose between Pattern and Song depending on what your style is.

main negatives
No 16 level on front panel--but you still do it but not in an instant.
No Digital In as standard.

The MV holds it own in the specs depart as well.
 
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moyphee said:
And Don't forget the Q-Link sequence, it's like haveing a built in Step Sequencer for Sound Sculpting.

The MV has the ability to record all knob and slider operations and to record all mixing actions for automated playback.

What about more then 40G harddrive with the MV
The MV supports any IDE drive with 127GB being the usable capacity.

Where's the MV's 3 Envelopes, 2 LFO's, 3 Filters (with a HUGE variation within those 3 Filters), 64 point modulation matrix PER VOICE....24bit/96khz

Useful only if you are trying to emulate a synth or into serious sound design. For sample based music it's really useless

along with the PPQ of 960
The MV records at max res of 480 PPQN however it edit resolution is indeed 960PPQN. Very few if any trip up a 300 PPQN sequencer let alone 480 or 960. Most beatmakers rarely venture beyond 96.


Also, how do you hook up a DVD to the MV... nope not an option.

Not true. The MV can use a standard laptop DVD(read only) and still record on CD media.

2 Midi In's 4 Midi Out's and a 4 FX

I had the 4000 and found this to be useless for the most part. If you're trying build around the 400 as a hub-maybe. Nobody has yet to post a beat or track yet that uses up 16 channels, let alone 64.
The MV has two MIDI outs and 32 channels is more than enough.

As far as the FX- the 4000 has 4 FX blocks but the engine itself is ho-hum. The MV has much better FX as FX has never been Akai's strong suite.

24bit/96khz...
The cost of this operation mode is that the 4000's power is cut in half while using it in 24/96 mode. The MV 16/20/16 path works out pretty good.

You can't even hook up an external harddrive to the MV..
...but you can transfer via USB

The MV surpasses the 4000 in the following areas:

CD Burning and backup
Direct to HD Recording
Mixing
COSM FX engine
Mastering
Linear Audio Track recording
Realtime Pattern Playback from Pads
Audio Phrases - 16 banks
Patch Library
Vocoder-10 band and sounds damn good.
3 Band Parametric EQ on every instrument and Audio Track.
Clipboard function
Nondestrective editing and chopping
Nonredundant sample usage.
Realtime Timestretching
Bass synth in the FX engine
Sample Import and Format options
Chopping of samples
VGA and Mouse use if you want
MV-8800 has a non-fatiguing color screen
Pencil Tool
Independant Chorus and Delay engines
Slider assign and automation
Swing/Shuffle flexibility and depth- w/templates
Choose between Pattern and Song depending on what your style is.

main negatives
No 16 level on front panel--but you still do it but not in an instant.
No Digital In as standard.

The MV holds it own in the specs depart as well.


Yeah, homeboi is right. The MPC series is great but MV series has bells and whistles that actually work. MPC 5000 is a piece of marketing shyt....
 
moyphee said:
main negatives
No 16 level on front panel--but you still do it but not in an instant.
No Digital In as standard.

The MV holds it own in the specs depart as well.
There's a button called 'multilevel' which DOES 16 level, it's right there next to 'fixed velocity'.

Yeah, no Digital In as standard kind of sucks bad, but you'd want the V-fire and expansion anyways... kind of strange how it doesn't come standard with Digital In..

As for the DVD thing, only a couple of brands will actually work, as you will need a combo drive that can burn CDs, but also read DVDs (but not burn them, I think). Otherwise the MV OS can't handle it..

along with the PPQ of 960
The MV records at max res of 480 PPQN however it edit resolution is indeed 960PPQN. Very few if any trip up a 300 PPQN sequencer let alone 480 or 960. Most beatmakers rarely venture beyond 96.
You won't ever need more precision / accuracy anyways. Don't forget we're talking about 1/16th of a second precision here, which is more than you'll ever need.
 
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There's a button called 'multilevel' which DOES 16 level, it's right there next to 'fixed velocity'.

I keep thinking Make Keyboard and chromatic mapping,my bad. You're right. I don't how I could screw that up. :o

I've had success with the Plextor and Panasonic drives.The Plex isn't the quietest drive (loud click after you shut the door) so I went with a used Panasonic from ebay. What did you install?I just put 120GB Samsung in last month. Works pretty sweet.

 
I can tell you that having 2 ins and 4 outs is important to me. I have the mpc 2500 and all ins and out are full and I just got another piece of equipment. I have 3 outs going to a motif xs, fantom xr, and a command station...the last out goes to the pc to sync with the DAW. Both ins are also taken....one to the pc and one to the motif. Therefore I am going to either get a midi hub or use a midi thru on one of the racks. This is just to let you know that you can easily use 1 in and 2 outs and need more.
 
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moyphee said:
I've had success with the Plextor and Panasonic drives.The Plex isn't the quietest drive (loud click after you shut the door) so I went with a used Panasonic from ebay. What did you install?I just put 120GB Samsung in last month. Works pretty sweet.

Yeah, well I do have a 120Gb Samsung installed, just one of those bulk things bought cheap, but as for the laptop drive, I don't know. A buddy of mine has it installed, not me.
 
youngjboy said:
I can tell you that having 2 ins and 4 outs is important to me. I have the mpc 2500 and all ins and out are full and I just got another piece of equipment. I have 3 outs going to a motif xs, fantom xr, and a command station...the last out goes to the pc to sync with the DAW. Both ins are also taken....one to the pc and one to the motif. Therefore I am going to either get a midi hub or use a midi thru on one of the racks. This is just to let you know that you can easily use 1 in and 2 outs and need more.

With the example above , not only do you not need more but you have not exhausted what you have.
 
moyphee said:
With the example above , not only do you not need more but you have not exhausted what you have.

Ok, so what is your solution to be able to sequence 3-4 different pieces of hardware, and don't say chain them all together with midi thrus:rolleyes:
 
youngjboy said:
Ok, so what is your solution to be able to sequence 3-4 different pieces of hardware, and don't say chain them all together with midi thrus:rolleyes:

While I do not disagree with you here, as having enough midi inputs/outputs definitely can be useful (mostly in live situations), but you could also at least do most of the recording in several steps, instead of trying to do all at once having everything connected.

In fact, I don't know of any artist that is chaotic enough to just connect everything at once and record in one go. Especially when it comes to sequencing into multi-track devices, like MPCs and MVs.

Ultimately you do not really need to have 3-4 devices connected at the same time through midi to get the tempo of the beat right.
 
Bananasass said:
While I do not disagree with you here, as having enough midi inputs/outputs definitely can be useful (mostly in live situations), but you could also at least do most of the recording in several steps, instead of trying to do all at once having everything connected.

In fact, I don't know of any artist that is chaotic enough to just connect everything at once and record in one go. Especially when it comes to sequencing into multi-track devices, like MPCs and MVs.

Ultimately you do not really need to have 3-4 devices connected at the same time through midi to get the tempo of the beat right.
Jeez, I give up. Akai put 4 midi outs on the machine for a reason. I can easily sequence 3 pieces of gear at a time and it doesn't become chaotic. Certainly one piece makes things easier, but I use multiple pieces all the time. Example, I start off with kicks, snare, high hats, toms, from the 1st piece, let's say command station. Then I want to add some rhodes, grand pianos, and strings from piece 2, the Motif XS. Lastly, I want to throw a crazy synths, and some other arps and effects from the third piece, the fantom. This is all in one sequence. It would be time consuming and retarded to only have one device connected. Then I would have to track the beat out to audio and come back and connect the next piece. The obvious alternative is a sequencer with more midi outs or utilize your midi thrus which is going to be a little restrictive because now you are utilizing the same 1-16 midi channels for multiple pieces of gear.


There are reasons why machines have certain features available, like 8 outs, so you don't have to sit there and make 50 passes to track out a beat. Different strokes for different folks, but you sound like the people who say there is nothing wrong with using a SP 303 to make a beat and throwing all instruments on one track. Sure, you can keep overdubbing, but what happens when you want to add effects to certain instruments or pan them individually. That type of setup make work it you are just gonna sample a drum break and throw it over a soul sample, but not when you have to sequence a beat using a motif, fantom, etc.
 
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Unless you're bogging down every channel, Chaining works fine for a light setup. However there are other options depending on your knowledge of MIDI . Choose a Master Clock , and with every with your synths set to Slave all of the LFO,BPM's and other timed factors will be as one. With MMC from your Master everything will start/ stop etc.and in perfect sync.

The only way that you'll experience any latency is if your bogging down all of the MIDI channels at once and the Priority Message protocol kicks in. With just 2 MIDI outs , this means you're clogging all 32 channels at once. Iask you, are really creating anything that complex ? How many sounds are you really using from each unit ? My guess is that isn't 16 parts/unit. Your primary controller and PC clock data can be sent on different channels eliminating the need for 2 MIDI INs.

The 4000 was meant to be main hub of a MIDI studio and was designed well before software took over so it's built around the premise of controlling and managing a lot more than just 3-4 peices of gear. That said if all your using is a 3-4 racks your not even close to using the multple MIDI to there full potential.

Speaking only for myself I've used the MV's 2 MIDI outs to handle the fllowing - which is the same setup i had when I used the 4000:
1 - E III
1 - E-Syth
1 - K25000 - Sometimes i sync onboard sequences (no problems when Slaved to external clock)
1 - XV-5080
1 - Supernover 2
1- Waldorf Microwave
2 - DP4+
1 - DSP 4000B
 
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moyphee said:
Unless you're bogging down every channel, Chaining works fine for a light setup. However there are other options depending on your knowledge of MIDI . Choose a Master Clock , and with every with your synths set to Slave all of the LFO,BPM's and other timed factors will be as one. With MMC from your Master everything will start/ stop etc.and in perfect sync.

The only way that you'll experience any latency is if your bogging down all of the MIDI channels at once and the Priority Message protocol kicks in. With just 2 MIDI outs , this means you're clogging all 32 channels at once. Iask you, are really creating anything that complex ? How many sounds are you really using from each unit ? My guess is that isn't 16 parts/unit. Your primary controller and PC clock data can be sent on different channels eliminating the need for 2 MIDI INs.

The 4000 was meant to be main hub of a MIDI studio and was designed well before software took over so it's built around the premise of controlling and managing a lot more than just 3-4 peices of gear. That said if all your using is a 3-4 racks your not even close to using the multple MIDI to there full potential.

Speaking only for myself I've used the MV's 2 MIDI outs to handle the fllowing - which is the same setup i had when I used the 4000:
1 - E III
1 - E-Syth
1 - K25000 - Sometimes i sync onboard sequences (no problems when Slaved to external clock)
1 - XV-5080
1 - Supernover 2
1- Waldorf Microwave
2 - DP4+
1 - DSP 4000B

I know that chaining is possible. I just would rather not have to go with the midi thrus if I don't have to. Now that I have an additional rack mount, I am going to have to use a thru, no other options other than a hub. I am reasonable versed in Midi, not an expert, but I can get around in it. I wish Roland did put more than 2 outs on the MV, but it is still a dope machine, but I like the MPC's flow. I would however love having the VGA out of the MV, that would be nice to have some of the flow of a DAW, but the timing and feel of hardware still:cheers:
 
youngjboy said:
but not when you have to sequence a beat using a motif, fantom, etc.

Midi messages do not transmit actual sound.. only note and time messages. That said, you'll have to sample your motif /phantom sounds anyways if you're going to use them in your machine.
 
Trusty said:
^^^Can't argue that one, believe me, I tried all those years ago. For a patch programmer, of which I have become better at, and now see value in those specs that I didn't see long ago, they are absolutely great (even better in software synthesizers).

However, even with those specs listed, the question is if you need them. If you want an upgrade from the 2000/2500/1000, and you don't need more lfos, filter types, envelopes and a modulation matrix, chances are, the MV would be a better option considering the steep 4k price tag.

Also, the MV still has more commonly used features the 4k or any other mpc doesn't have.

1. Flexible real time audio timestretch..."elastic audio"...think Live in a box with pads.

2. Direct recording onto audio tracks (not long sample tracks and there is a difference because of how audio tracks can work in the MV that the mpc doesn't have at all...like #1).

3. CD burning of audio without a computer dump (great while traveling).

4. Less bugs. Sorry, but this has to be considered a "feature" when were talking mpcs, especially the 4k.

5. More fully featured sequencer/arranger/pattern sequencer/drum grid. It doesn't have "mpc's swing", but the sequencer is actually more robust and deep...making editing a breeze...but also the trade off is the learning curve to make use of its depth more steep.

6. Dead simple automation recording for both audio and midi.

7. On board DSP synthesizer (though it is really crappy). :D

8. The COSM effects and models. Blows anything away on the mpc line.

So, it depends on the needs and various differences than it does the spec sheets alone.

Hello Trusty,

The MPC 4000s price tag is not steep. Its very difficult to find one new but I have found those in excellent condition for as low as $1500. And while this thread was talking about a specific MPC, I would like to discuss MPCs/MVs in general.

But regarding your other points:

1. This feature is great. The MV has it...the Fantom has it...Live, Cubase, Emulator X. With this technology so readily available, you don't need it in a drum machine/sequencer.

2. MPCs now have audio tracks but please explain the difference how the MV treats these tracks. The MPC 5K has 8 tracks of real hard disk recording and not simply RAM based audio tracks. The MV doesn't.

3. MV as well as the MPC 2500, 4000, and 5000 has CD burning. I love the fact that the MPC 5K can burn audio or DATA CDs. I can also load DVD Rom sample libraries.

4. Less bugs? We can debate this but the fact remains is that MPCs remain the standard in spite of anything bad written about them. The user base is huge.

5. The MVs sequencer is not superior to any of the latest MPCs. It simply accomplishes things in a different manner. But when you add in the 5Ks Q-links which send MIDI CC messages to external gear, you fully see the power of its sequencer....64 separate channels of external MIDI can't be done using an MV.

6. MV as well as the MPC 1000, 2500, 4000, and 5000 all have simple automation.

7. You got to love the 5Ks on-board synth.

8. I can't comment that much about effects because in a studio, I wouldn't use effects in a drum machine. But please let me know what I am missing. Akai has improved the 5Ks effects by adding 4 busses of effects with two effects per buss. With the addition of a master compressor and 4 band equalizer with the ability to mix down and export your music as a 24 bit file. These 5K features are hard to beat...which is debatable of course.
 
Average price of used MV8000 in very good condition is : $650

Average price of used mpc4000 in very good condition is: $1350

Yesterday though, I did see a blue mpc4000 in GREAT condition go for $1090 plus shipping and handling. I believe the prices on secondhand 4000s on ebay, might be coming down soon.
 
jahrome said:
1. This feature is great. The MV has it...the Fantom has it...Live, Cubase, Emulator X. With this technology so readily available, you don't need it in a drum machine/sequencer.

Same goes for reading samples of a DVD, you could use a PC for that inbetween as well. That's not the freaking point of having these features in the first place. So.. it's something of a non-argument to me.

2. MPCs now have audio tracks but please explain the difference how the MV treats these tracks. The MPC 5K has 8 tracks of real hard disk recording and not simply RAM based audio tracks. The MV doesn't.

Eventhough I definitely agree this is a serious weakness, you can bounce the audio tracks to free up the ram, so it's not actually an issue. It just takes a step more.

Apart from that, having 512mb of ram usually gets you far enough for 8 audio tracks anyways.

3. MV as well as the MPC 2500, 4000, and 5000 has CD burning. I love the fact that the MPC 5K can burn audio or DATA CDs. I can also load DVD Rom sample libraries.

Still... you could use a PC to burn anything you like as well.

The thing I do not like of either machines is the fact that they do not read mp3 format. Sure, I could use a PC for that and that's what I'm doing... but it would save some time (no huge wav files to process and quality isn't an issue either when you're fine tuning and mastering in a real studio anyways).

4. Less bugs? We can debate this but the fact remains is that MPCs remain the standard in spite of anything bad written about them. The user base is huge.

I think less bugs is pretty accurate, even though the MV wasn't bug free at launch either. At least it did not have any sever showstopping issues.

The MPC user base is indeed huge, however the user base of the MV is growing while I have serious doubts about whether the MPC user base is still growing as fast as it used to do. Akai is also simply better known for their MPCs than Roland for their MVs and don't forget this is a nich market we're talking about. Quite a bunch of people probably own one of the MVs also by now.

Also... when I look at some other machines of totally different kinds, like I don't know.. cars or something, I don't think popularity says much about actual quality. After all, we both know Akai made a nose dive right about after having released the 2000XL.

5. The MVs sequencer is not superior to any of the latest MPCs. It simply accomplishes things in a different manner. But when you add in the 5Ks Q-links which send MIDI CC messages to external gear, you fully see the power of its sequencer....64 separate channels of external MIDI can't be done using an MV.

True the MV doesn't have 64 channels, but some will argue that 32 midi channels is enough anyways.. Also, those Q-links are overrated. Yeah, they are somewhat neat and I do use them on my MPC5K, but it's not like you get unlimited possibilities with them.

I could easily write about why I think the sequencer on the MV is superior for hours, but I'm going to pass on that as I've got things to do. Yes they do accomplish things in different ways, but there are still reasons why at least I think that the sequencer on the MV is superior.

6. MV as well as the MPC 1000, 2500, 4000, and 5000 all have simple automation.

I do not know what your definition of 'simple' automation is, but with the MV you can do just about everything. From stutter effects, to recording effect automation, pattern muting, track muting and so on... I know the MPC series have basic automation features too, but not the same.

7. You got to love the 5Ks on-board synth.

Which is quite easily the most overrated thing when it comes to how Akai markets their product. If you're used to other synths, it's really not that good. If you compare it to the MV synth, then you'll see differences are there... but they are way too small to cover the price difference. Especially when looking at the big picture here. I find it difficult to say which build-in synth I like better actually and we both know it's only in the MPC5k now because the MV had it.

8. I can't comment that much about effects because in a studio, I wouldn't use effects in a drum machine. But please let me know what I am missing. Akai has improved the 5Ks effects by adding 4 busses of effects with two effects per buss. With the addition of a master compressor and 4 band equalizer with the ability to mix down and export your music as a 24 bit file.

I do miss 24bit export on the MV when I want to go for extremely clean stuff... but apart from that the MV has the MPC line dominated as far as the FX goes.

I can't believe you say you do not use any effects on your drums. Are you saying you do not EQ your stuff? Do you not add reverb? Do you not play around with vinyl simulator-like FXs, chorus FX, or mold samples into totally new sounds by using the power of FX?

Damn...
 
@Bananasass
1. Many sample libraries now come on DVD (4 GB) vs CD (750 MB). Since the MPC is a sampler that load sounds directly, it would be a waste of time to use a PC to read the DVD and save files on another form of media just to load into an MPC.

2. Quite frankly, I simply prefer real hard disk tracks. Tracks that I can import or export and don't have to worry about memory limitations. That way I have plenty of GBs available to record audio tracks and the 192 MB reserved for samples and synth programs.

3. All these machines have CD burners because that is what users want. Using the 5K to burn audio or data CDs is a great function.

4. In the genre of music I am into, the MV is gaining no ground on any MPC. Simply do a quick internet search to see how many more producers are using MPCs. The MPC 2500 has even made its ways to several music videos. No so much for the MV. The MV is hardly kept in stock anywhere. Used ones cost as much as a 2000XL or even a 1000.

5. Yes, the MPC 5K has double the number of external MIDI channels. This has been an MPC standard for over 20 years. Of course you don't have to use all 64 channels..but having all these outputs, you don't need to use a MIDI patchbay to connect all your instruments to an MPC.

I would love to hear your arguments about why you feel the MV has a better sequencer just for kicks. The MPCs sequencer is legendary for a reason.

The Q-links are not over-rated. The 5K is a MIDI sequencer and controller. Using the Q-links to send MIDI CC messages to software like Reasons is incredible for hands on control.

6. First...you need to actually use an MPC and try out its automation before you comment. After you do that..come back and give a report.

7. That is funny. 95% of what the MV has is because an MPC had it first. Roland is probably paying fees for using Akai's patents. Anyway, the 5Ks 20 voice synth clearly outperforms what the MV does.

8. You are reading and typing so quickly that you are not paying attention. I said in a studio environment, I am not using effects in a DRUM MACHINE. In other words, I would add effects once I have the audio in my DAW. Of I would add dynamics to my drums as I am sampling them.

Anyway..the 5K does not skimp on Effects. As I wrote earlier, it has 4 effect busses with two effects per buss. They can all be linked if you like. The 5K has both insert and send effects. I think I counted 36 effects which includes parametric EQ, vintage compressor, chorus, distortion grimey, resampler (for dirty drums, decimator (for removing bits), filters, etc
 
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