Writer/Producer doesn't deserver ROYALTIES???

j.troup said:
Not true. That's something producers like to say to make themselves feel better. Hooks and melodies sell songs. They have since the beginning of time.
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lol, do you think justin bieber comes up with the hooks and melody's ? songwriter = more money than justin, in a fair world
 
DjPolair said:
lol, do you think justin bieber comes up with the hooks and melody's ? songwriter = more money than justin, in a fair world
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It's about the voice, though. A lot of good rappers, with nice flow, just won't make it because they don't have a good voice. A lot of people can sing, but only some can be professional singers.

And if we know anything about supply and demand, the artist should at least get what the producer gets.
 
@Troup, I deal with this all the time. Explain to them they're entitled to performance revenue which will make them alot richer off the song than yourself, you're jumpstarting a career that may lead to more songs and deals you have nothing to do with. And that's it's more than fair for you to get a percentage of sales from anything involving your work. They're not "giving you a percentage" they're investing in the artist's future. This won't be the end of the road for him. At any time this song can be discarded leaving you with a percentage of zero, but you must protect yourself, because you have faith in your work as they should when they come to you for a service.
 
Wedges2 said:
It's about the voice, though. A lot of good rappers, with nice flow, just won't make it because they don't have a good voice. A lot of people can sing, but only some can be professional singers.

And if we know anything about supply and demand, the artist should at least get what the producer gets.
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producer is skill, singer is genetical benefit for a large part
 
deRaNged 4 Phuk'dup said:
@Troup, I deal with this all the time. Explain to them they're entitled to performance revenue which will make them alot richer off the song than yourself, you're jumpstarting a career that may lead to more songs and deals you have nothing to do with. And that's it's more than fair for you to get a percentage of sales from anything involving your work. They're not "giving you a percentage" they're investing in the artist's future. This won't be the end of the road for him. At any time this song can be discarded leaving you with a percentage of zero, but you must protect yourself, because you have faith in your work as they should when they come to you for a service.
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That's wassup. I'm new to dealing with the "general public". Usually the folks I deal with as far as selling songs are record labels, or at least know the common business practices of licensing music.

It's really frustrating trying to explain to someone how the music industry works, especially when they are already super afraid that you'll try to take advantage of them, because they believe everyone in the music industry is out to steal something from you.
 
^^^^Hey, I know how to f**k up every chance in the industry, but I gotta make my money somehow, right? I do know how to deal with the everyday public who want in the music biz. It is an eciting world BTW.

You just wanna over and above all be able to pride yourself in never screwing over anyone, because this is their hard earned money, while still making sure to protect yourself in case they're the next Justin Bieber.

Alot of talent to deal with too! :cheers:

EDIT: and they'll pay for a feature out of their pocket quicker than people who are considered "placements".
 
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j.troup said:
I think you misunderstood what i meant...



These are NON MUSIC INDUSTRY CLIENTS.


aka, a 16 year boy and his parents.



I wrote the song. I produced the song. I already have 100% of EVERYTHING. All the client did was SING.

I'm GIVING them 10% of the writers share because the song was their idea. And I'm splitting the royalties from the song right down the middle, 50/50.




And giving the advance back is crazy talk.
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I got it. Just agree to whatever they want so the song can be released. Ain't nobody gone make no money from the song. And give the advance back too. You have to sacrifice for the greater good.
 
This is why I always had a contract for my production company. Sometime people be so needing the money, they forget this step. Having a production agreement signed before any work is done always get rid of this problem . Either agree to the terms or bounce worked good for me for 15 yrs.
 
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j.troup said:
So FP, I got a situation, and I want your opinions on it...


I have a non-music industry client, who I've written and produced (recorded/mixed/mastered) a song for that they are VERY happy with. I said that the terms for the song would be an up front fee for $X, plus 50%, and I'd split the song royalties 50/50 with the artist.


The client seems to think that since I got an up front fee, that I shouldn't be entitled to 50% of the back end. To which I explained to them that this isn't the way that music works, and that the people who wrote the words and the music are entitled to share in the proceeds from the song, as a matter of law.



How would you go about getting them to understand and accept my 50/50 proposal (which I feel is more than generous)?
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he's not wrong... either are you.. some people might settle from up front money.. if it's alot more than they would be getting if they were waiting for the royalties thing... i mean i'm pretty sure there are producers who sold beats and kept it moving.. no royalites whatsoever...
 
Before I jump on your side I would wonder how much up front you are asking for. Maybe he feels he’s paying enough to buy some points from you

You could get someone else to sing it to show they are not really needed in the process
 
Dee Chamberz said:
Before I jump on your side I would wonder how much up front you are asking for. Maybe he feels he’s paying enough to buy some points from you

You could get someone else to sing it to show they are not really needed in the process
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And what would you say is TOO MUCH?



Because trust me...it's not a lot AT ALL. Like, dirt cheap for the exclusive for songwriting, a beat, recording, editing, mixing and mastering.


How much do YOU think a package like that would go for, up front?
 
depends on how much money is on the table. you can just back out and say they cant use the work that you did. but if you want to go about it nicely i guess just try to explain that this is a team effort and that although it is the kids name on the song, you put in more work than the kid and that you should be entitled to 50%. Tell em this is how you develop good relationship by keeping it even in the beginning.
 
@Troup

Do you consider your upfront fee a guaranteed advance against possible future back end royalties or is it a separate service fee that you charge irregardless of the royalty breakdown?
 
Legal Dollaz said:
@Troup

Do you consider your upfront fee a guaranteed advance against possible future back end royalties or is it a separate service fee that you charge irregardless of the royalty breakdown?
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At first I hadn't really made that distinction, but the more i think about it, it's a separate service fee that I charge. Because no matter if client already has the song written or not, or comes in with an instrumental they need a song for, the "fee" is still going to be the same for me to add my talents to ensure that a great record is the result.



So what say you about the situation?
 
j.troup said:
At first I hadn't really made that distinction, but the more i think about it, it's a separate service fee that I charge. Because no matter if client already has the song written or not, or comes in with an instrumental they need a song for, the "fee" is still going to be the same for me to add my talents to ensure that a great record is the result.



So what say you about the situation?
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Ok gotcha. One more question and pardon if I didn't catch your answer somewhere in the thread but did you do ALL the producing and songwriting or did the client co-wrote the lyrics along with you?
 
Legal Dollaz said:
Ok gotcha. One more question and pardon if I didn't catch your answer somewhere in the thread but did you do ALL the producing and songwriting or did the client co-wrote the lyrics along with you?
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I did all the production. I wrote every single lyric. His only contribution was "I want to do a song about this...this is what the situation is".
 
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